The All Encompassing This Team is Broken / Trade Everyone / Fire Everyone Thread

[Andy99]

Will JR make A move before next game?

Well according to this...JR isn’t making a move...everything is A ok, they’re going to fight their way out this and the problems, including goaltending, is all because they are all over thinking the details of their position..it’ll work out on its own, nothing to see here...

20 Penguins Thoughts: What's Jim Rutherford's next move?

 

[Pancakes]

I think we see a big move TODAY. I don't see JR Being happy with the last loss and I feel as though he's getting to his breaking point very very quickly. This team needs a shakeup bad before the season is lost. It's still salvageable.

I wonder about that. I'm sure he wants to, but when you dig into our roster there's not a lot there that is tradeable that he would actually want to move.

Like who does he trade? He probably doesn't want to move Guentzel or Kessel. Letang/Sid/Geno are untouchable.

Past that? There's like Brassard (cheap, and we still dont know what we have in him), Maatta (sucks, and probably other teams know it now), and then a whole host of crap like Oleksiak, etc.

Sprong might be intriguing to someone I guess.

We don't have a lot of attractive assets right now that JR would actually move.

 

[Pens x]

The core has fired Olcyk, Therrien, Bylsma, Johnston...

Same MO...everyone suddenly forgets hockey...

To be fair, all of those coaches are terrible. Well Therrien at least coached for a bit after he was fired. It’s not like we keep firing Scotty Bowman and Al Arbor. I guarantee you if the Pens fired Sullivan he’d be an assistant coach within 5 years. None of these guys are great coaches.

I think Shero’s mishandling of this team has led to many people thinking JR is actually a really good GM. Same with Bylsma and Sullivan. Jr and Sully are pretty mediocre. JR made some nice timely trades but he’s done pretty poor over the last 15 months.

 

[Pens1566]

Given the current state of affairs, we really need to limit Tom Hanks related posts to shots from The Money Pit.

 

[Pancakes]

We play Dallas next which is not an easy game and then we've got Boston who we always struggle with. Pretty easy to see two more losses even if we do actually show up and play decent hockey. And especially if we don't.

 

[DegenX]

Something I was thinking about, if there is another coaching change would you go so far as to call the players coach killers?

If it happens, 3 different coaches will have coached them in the last 3 years. 4 coaches in 5 years if you include Bylsma. In Sully's 3 playoffs, 2 Stanley Cups and a loss to the Stanley Cup champs. It's a very strange situation.

I'm confused by your math. Sullivan has been here since December 2015. So, almost 3 years. Johnston was here a little over a year. Regardless, who cares? How many coaches did Mario go through? I think the way Morehouse left Bylsma hanging was poorly done, but we wound up with Johnston because the other coaches that were available already had destinations in mind. It's not like we really missed out, either.

 

[pistolpete11]

Well according to this...JR isn’t making a move...everything is A ok, they’re going to fight their way out this and the problems, including goaltending, is all because they are all over thinking the details of their position..it’ll work out on its own, nothing to see here...

20 Penguins Thoughts: What's Jim Rutherford's next move?

I don't really have a problem with that. To me, that is JR starting the clock on the coaching staff. He's basically saying, "This roster is good enough to win. There may be some flaws with the roster, but it ain't this bad." Saying they are looking at more moves kind of gives the coaches a pass and puts the blame back on JR.

I wonder about that. I'm sure he wants to, but when you dig into our roster there's not a lot there that is tradeable that he would actually want to move.

Like who does he trade? He probably doesn't want to move Guentzel or Kessel. Letang/Sid/Geno are untouchable.

Past that? There's like Brassard (cheap, and we still dont know what we have in him), Maatta (sucks, and probably other teams know it now), and then a whole host of crap like Oleksiak, etc.

Sprong might be intriguing to someone I guess.

We don't have a lot of attractive assets right now that JR would actually move.

I think the coaching staff is the #1 issue, but there's got to be more change of scenery type of deals out there for guys like Maatta, Oleksiak, Rust, Sheahan, Sprong, etc. JR's not going to be able to package any of these guys together to get a surefire top 4 defenseman, but he could possibly find another Schultz, Daley, Hags, Cole, etc.

 

[Pete Gas]

So what happened JR? He went from saying changes are happening and the food vendors are at risk for a trade to “we just gotta play our way out of this”

 

[IcedCapp]

The core has fired Olcyk, Therrien, Bylsma, Johnston...

Same MO...everyone suddenly forgets hockey...

You think Sid was shit before the injury?

 

[Gurglesons]

So what happened JR? He went from saying changes are happening and the food vendors are at risk for a trade to “we just gotta play our way out of this”

Realized how deep his errors have been over the past two summers and a trade won’t resolve it.

 

[Rodgerwilco]

I don't really have a problem with that. To me, that is JR starting the clock on the coaching staff. He's basically saying, "This roster is good enough to win. There may be some flaws with the roster, but it ain't this bad." Saying they are looking at more moves kind of gives the coaches a pass and puts the blame back on JR.


I think the coaching staff is the #1 issue, but there's got to be more change of scenery type of deals out there for guys like Maatta, Oleksiak, Rust, Sheahan, Sprong, etc. JR's not going to be able to package any of these guys together to get a surefire top 4 defenseman, but he could possibly find another Schultz, Daley, Hags, Cole, etc.

Oleksiak is in good part of the "change of scenery" move now. Getting him out of Dallas was the change of scenery and he's playing fairly well, in my opinion. The team has a slew of problems right now, but Oleksiak doesn't seem to be one of them for me.

 

[Shwag33]

I'm shocked at how many people think goaltending is a problem. Murray has not been good, but hasek in his prime would be in huge trouble with the way this team is playing.

I think murray and desmith are playing about the same, he's had the tougher matchups and more breakdowns.

The big problem is the team. I still believe that goaltending is largely a by product of team play and it's putrid.

 

[pistolpete11]

Oleksiak is in good part of the "change of scenery" move now. Getting him out of Dallas was the change of scenery and he's playing fairly well, in my opinion. The team has a slew of problems right now, but Oleksiak doesn't seem to be one of them for me.

I don't necessarily disagree. He just gets mentioned a lot around here and was a healthy scratch not too long ago.

 

[Gurglesons]

I'm shocked at how many people think goaltending is a problem. Murray has not been good, but hasek in his prime would be in huge trouble with the way this team is playing.

I think murray and desmith are playing about the same, he's had the tougher matchups and more breakdowns.

The big problem is the team. I still believe that goaltending is largely a by product of team play and it's putrid.

Murray has given up four goals like 10 times in 13 starts. Sorry, that isn’t all the players in front of him.

 

[Shady Machine]

Random vent time:

The JJ signing was so freaking bad. It's not even just about the contract, it's about adding him as a core piece of a defense that already has Big Rig and Maatta lumbering around. Missing Schultz sucks, but honestly, JJ has been even worse than I feared. Obviously a lot of players are struggling, but I honestly have no idea what anyone saw in JJ that made it a worthy gamble with the current mix on defense.

 

[The Old Master]

Well according to this...JR isn’t making a move...everything is A ok, they’re going to fight their way out this and the problems, including goaltending, is all because they are all over thinking the details of their position..it’ll work out on its own, nothing to see here...

20 Penguins Thoughts: What's Jim Rutherford's next move?

translation; I've made a bunch of calls and no one wants our players.

 

[bathroomSTAAL]

Murray is literally the worst goalie in the league statistically. Goaltending is a huge problem. There are other huge problems of course but that is one of them.

EDIT: Okay Mike Smith technically has a worse save percentage. Guess we're okay then.

 

[PensandCaps]

I might be the only one, but if there is a coaching change I'd rather go with AV than Q. I think his style suits the Pens much better.

Id go with neither.

As they both suck.

 

[JackFr]

One thing I really want to underline, because I admit I've been thinking of it lately.

We should not trade Bryan Rust.

It makes sense in a vacuum - he's locked up at a significant value, he's a RW, he hasn't been contributing offensively, etc. But he's also been really really unlucky and will regress to the mean soon. The stats indicate that he's been a big positive to us offensively and defensively this season no matter who it's with, the goals just aren't going in. If we trade him we are selling super low.

The biggest problems in this forward group are Sheahan and Cullen in my mind. Both of them are just killing our offence.

 

[Gurglesons]

Random vent time:

The JJ signing was so freaking bad. It's not even just about the contract, it's about adding him as a core piece of a defense that already has Big Rig and Maatta lumbering around. Missing Schultz sucks, but honestly, JJ has been even worse than I feared. Obviously a lot of players are struggling, but I honestly have no idea what anyone saw in JJ that made it a worthy gamble with the current mix on defense.

#trustingonch

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Random vent time:

The JJ signing was so freaking bad. It's not even just about the contract, it's about adding him as a core piece of a defense that already has Big Rig and Maatta lumbering around. Missing Schultz sucks, but honestly, JJ has been even worse than I feared. Obviously a lot of players are struggling, but I honestly have no idea what anyone saw in JJ that made it a worthy gamble with the current mix on defense.

Johnson's one of those defensemen you maybe (and I'm stressing maybe) add as a depth guy on a cheap (less than $3 milion) 1 or 2 year "show me" deal. He's not someone you should be locking up long term.

 

[cheesedanish87]

Random vent time:

The JJ signing was so freaking bad. It's not even just about the contract, it's about adding him as a core piece of a defense that already has Big Rig and Maatta lumbering around. Missing Schultz sucks, but honestly, JJ has been even worse than I feared. Obviously a lot of players are struggling, but I honestly have no idea what anyone saw in JJ that made it a worthy gamble with the current mix on defense.

Its not like we are second guessing the signing, everybody seemed to know it was a terrible deal when it happened besides JR and Sully.

I can usually see other coaches and Gm view of things even when i disagree with them, but i have no idea why they thought bringing in JJ was a good move.

 

[Gurglesons]

Who should be the next GM of the Penguins?

Just need to follow option 4.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Who should be the next GM of the Penguins?

Just need to follow option 4.

If you were in charge of hiring/firing the GM in 2015, we'd have 2 less Stanley Cups right now.

 

[Al Smith]

Who should be the next GM of the Penguins?

Just need to follow option 4.

There’s no such thing as bad publicity