Sidney Crosby surpassing Alexander Ovechkin in career points watch (UPD: Ovechkin ahead by 6)

[Plural]

In that case I will give you $412 if you give me back $426.

The difference is negligible and considering games played Sid actually has more PP production. But he has better overall production too so it doesn't mean much.

But the original claim of OV relying more on PP through their careers is false.

 

[illpucks]

The difference is negligible and considering games played Sid actually has more PP production. But he has better overall production too so it doesn't mean much.

But the original claim of OV relying more on PP through their careers is false.

Just have to look at how much of Crosby's 2006 Art Ross was from PP points.

 

[wetcoast]

Just have to look at how much of Crosby's 2006 Art Ross was from PP points.

Well not really since 426>412 right?

That one season does distort the overall year to year trend though.

Crosby had 61 PPP that season, Ovechkin 37.

So let me rephrase (not that I really need to since 426>412), since the 07-08 Season Ovechkin has relied on the PP more than Crosby, something that is pretty consistent year to year.

not that it really matters much.

 

[Randyne]

Sure that is one single metric looking at full ESP seasons, does not account for fluctuations in league scoring and PP rates ect...
Like I said looking at the big picture tells us the whole story.
Looking at a partial picture tells us less.

2005-2018 span it is the whole story for now...
Or you think that OV being at #3 and #5 is a fluke and I'm hiding Crosby's second best result at #11? Nope, it's occupied by his teammate Malkin. Crosby's 2nd rank at #14.
NHL.com - Stats

 

[wetcoast]

2005-2018 span it is the whole story for now...
Or you think that OV being at #3 and #5 is a fluke and I'm hiding Crosby's second best result at #11? Nope, it's occupied by his teammate Malkin. Crosby's 2nd rank at #14.
NHL.com - Stats

It's the whole story on ESP in terms of raw stats yes.

No its not a fluke, its still a single metric that is more benificial to full seasons and also disregards league wide scoring levels.

It's about as relevant, on it's own, as the PPG metric.

The whole picture shows more than snapshots.

 

[NextYear67]

Matter of time til Sid is like 100+ ahead tbh. In less GP

 

[kugelbahn]

Surprisingly this isn't really the case.

426 power play points for Ovechkin, 412 power play points for Crosby.

This is actually not correct, 452 PPP for OV, 426 PPP for Crosby,
as of right now hockey-reference is busted, it gives wrong totals.

 

[mrv52]

Matter of time til Sid is like 100+ ahead tbh. In less GP

How do you figure?

Since 12-13, Sid has only outscored Ovechkin by 64 points. This cooresponds with Sid finally playing some semblance of a full season.

Sid is not likely to outscore him by "like 100" between now and the end of them playing at the same time.

 

[Acallabeth]

Matter of time til Sid is like 100+ ahead tbh. In less GP

 

[NextYear67]

How do you figure?

Since 12-13, Sid has only outscored Ovechkin by 64 points. This cooresponds with Sid finally playing some semblance of a full season.

Sid is not likely to outscore him by "like 100" between now and the end of them playing at the same time.

I'm calling it

 

[kladorf2005]

And yet Ovechkin has two EVP records on top 10 above Sid.

Percentage of points at even strength:
62.9% - Crosby
61.2% - Ovechkin

What was your point, again?

 

[Randyne]

Percentage of points at even strength:
62.9% - Crosby
61.2% - Ovechkin
What was your point, again?

In case the image is not loading: NHL.com - Stats
Player seasons by EVP

 

[kladorf2005]

In case the image is not loading: NHL.com - Stats
Player seasons by EVP

Image loaded fine. You're showing us EVP by season. Ovi has a 75 and 73. Crosby has a 72. That's supposed to tell us that Crosby relies on the PP more than Ovi? I legitimately don't understand.

 

[Randyne]

Image loaded fine. You're showing us EVP by season. Ovi has a 75 and 73. Crosby has a 72. That's supposed to tell us that Crosby relies on the PP more than Ovi? I legitimately don't understand.

Of course not. It tells that Ovi has better EVP records in their careers that's my point. BTW 73EVP in 9 games less (fewer)...

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

This is a weird thread because it'll literally keep going until one or both of them retires before we know the answer.

Even if Sid passes Ovechkin at some point, it'll only last for as long as both keep playing. If Sid retires before Ovi, then Ovi will just retake the lead.

 

[Khomutov]

I can't believe how this thread has devolved into both sides saying the other player scores too much on the power play.

These are the two best offensive players of the generation, of course they're gonna put up a bunch of points on the power play...

The Penguins and Capitals are trying to make teams pay for taking penalties, not boost Sid and Ovi's even-strength points %

Good post. I don't like Crosby but i would never criticize him for being good on the PP. Thats ridiculous.

 

[kladorf2005]

Of course not. It tells that Ovi has better EVP records in their careers that's my point. BTW 73EVP in 9 games less (fewer)...

I think we already knew that Ovi has had the higher of the highs (evidence by all of his individual awards). But he's also had the lower lows (evidence by the fact they are near even in points with the disparity in games played)

 

[Incognito]

Hot take, Ovechkin is the better goal scorer and has had less injuries, glad that has been put to rest.

Yup. Ovechkin never would have gotten his 3rd Hart Trophy if Brooks Orpik hadn't shot a puck at Crosby's face.

 

[Dondini]

I don’t get why power play points is a bad thing on hf. Like power plays literally happen in 99%+ more for a team in a game. You are getting a pp consistently throughout a season. So being good at it is pretty important for a players production. But on hf it means ur garbage. 5v5/60 only stat that matters. Everything else means nothing. Everything else is like coin flip win percentage in the nfl. Pure luck

 

[Brucelenok]

Yup. Ovechkin never would have gotten his 3rd Hart Trophy if Brooks Orpik hadn't shot a puck at Crosby's face.

He would....... if he didn't miss 10 games in 2010. P.S. All this talk "shoulda, coulda, woulda" is pointless.

 

[bobbyking]

He would....... if he didn't miss 10 games in 2010. P.S. All this talk "shoulda, coulda, woulda" is pointless.

I thought he got suspendid? That's his own undoing

 

[DrewGl]

Can we just lock this thread until they both retire?

 

[Khomutov]

I thought he got suspendid? That's his own undoing

He missed six of ten games because of injury.

 

[bobbyking]

That's great in isolation, but I prefer to look at the whole picture, ie their careers.

Crosby in his worst full season of play still had above 82 points, something that Ovechkin has faild to do 3 times now, this season pending.

In fact Crosby in his worst season (when looking in isolation like you are above) has a line of 80-36-49-85 in 2015-2016.

And most of that is due to lower scoring league wide as he was still 3rd in points (ovechkin was 15th)

7th in goals (Ovechkin was 1st)
9th in assists (Ovechkin was tied for 202nd along with 21 other players)

Crosby has 2 seasons worse then that scoring less then 30

 

[Incognito]

He would....... if he didn't miss 10 games in 2010. P.S. All this talk "shoulda, coulda, woulda" is pointless.

He missed those games because he was reckless back then and got himself suspended. Him missing out on the Hart in 2009-2010 was entirely of his own doing.

Edit: apparently I was wrong. Ovechkin missed 6 games to injury and 4 to suspension. He probably would still have 3 Harts if not for his injuries then (2007-2008, 2008-2009, and 2009-2010).