Should Boughner stay or go?

Boughner Stay or Go


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RainingRats

Registered User
Dec 28, 2008
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So fix the roster and bring in a good coach. Do both.

The stability thing is overrated. It's really not that much of an issue, especially if you're bringing in a good coach and your players don't suck.

Like I've said before, maybe boog is good, maybe he's bad, it's fair to say we don't even really know. But I know there are good coaches available, and it's stupid to go with an unknown into our most important season as a franchise.
So who do you realistically bring in? None of the options are more appealing.

I disagree about stability with such a young team.

It’s hard to honestly assess the performance of Boughner this season bc of our goaltending imo and If you believe like I do that our goalies sunk the season then a new coach isn’t the fix we need.

I don’t even care about boughner but I can think of a few other people I’d get rid of before him. I’d take Q too but if we don’t upgrade our goalies and get a top 4 d, this team isn’t going to be much better
 

pantherbot

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I guess the issue is would they be good with our team. That is also not a guarantee. Hitchcock is regarded as a good coach correct. But after a great start with the Oilers, they have gone back to being really crappy.

So who do you realistically bring in? None of the options are more appealing.

I disagree about stability with such a young team.

It’s hard to honestly assess the performance of Boughner this season bc of our goaltending imo and If you believe like I do that our goalies sunk the season then a new coach isn’t the fix we need.

I don’t even care about boughner but I can think of a few other people I’d get rid of before him. I’d take Q too but if we don’t upgrade our goalies and get a top 4 d, this team isn’t going to be much better

Ya we're in agreement that the roster needs an upgrade and just a coach isn't enough.

I'd bring in quenneville or vigneault. They could be good fits for this team.

But probably this conversation doesn't even matter... I'm guessing boog gets another year anyways
 

RainingRats

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Dec 28, 2008
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Ya we're in agreement that the roster needs an upgrade and just a coach isn't enough.

I'd bring in quenneville or vigneault. They could be good fits for this team.

But probably this conversation doesn't even matter... I'm guessing boog gets another year anyways
If we get a new coach, I want a new gm too

I’m an AV fan
 
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Crossbar

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Career years this season for our core guys (Barky, Huby, Hoff and Yands-2pts away) as well as supporting guys like Trano. Last season, career year for Tro and we got Ek back on track (right now 4 pts away from surpassing his career high in points), Dads repeating his numbers from last season.

Boog is not elite level coach, but I don't think he's garbage and we can't expect him to make every guy who steps foot in this organization into a good player. Petro is still as much trash in his hometown under Hitch as he was here. Bjugs "severely snakebitten" as Pens announcers described him a couple games ago as he was here, what can you do? Last season was actually a career year in points for Nick under Boog playing with Barky. Canner I'm disappointed we weren't more patient keeping (don't know if he had anything to do with that decision), especially since he was supposedly one of Boog's favorite players......whatever.

Math is my main complaint. Increasing his minutes when the numbers and eye test all clearly show he can't handle it yet and only now benching him for the same garbage fundamental plays all year. He's still young and Ekblad was just as bad when he first wasn't playing sheltered mins, this better be the last time we see this garbage from Math. Not much Boog can do about the goalies except switch/beg Tallon for a new goalie.

Only other complaints I have from Boog is puck management. We have the lead, aside from the goalies giving up softies, we don't know how to waste time. Why are we attacking with 2-3 guys while shorthanded and then surprised to see the other team go the other way on an odd-man rush/breakaway to score on Lu/Reim? When we have the lead and are on the man-advantage, why take risks and give up shorthanded goals?

Here are some simple rules we should apply: The puck should always be advanced forward instead of backwards in all 3 zones when we are tied or have the lead, no more "no-look" drop passes AT LEAST in our own zone, move the puck out of our zone as quickly as possible, shoot the puck if you have the chance *cough* Dadonov *cough*, Icing/Faceoff >>> Shot Against.
 

GrumpyKelly

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May 15, 2011
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Tallon probably will stick with Boog true but that may ultimately be the thing that gets him fired. Unless Boog finds a way to evolve his coaching to another level which he may since he's still young as a hc.
 

PSLguy

#TimeToHunt
Jan 14, 2013
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Matheson sucks, Matheson stinks, Matheson and goaltending cost us the season.

I'm sick of hearing the same complaints over and over.

Matheson is playing above his role right now just like Ekblad was when the same crowd complained about him.

Goalies hurt us, yes, but it takes a team to win. Connor McDavid and Leon Draisaitl can't carry the Oilers to the playoffs. Why do you expect one line to carry us?

Matheson will improve and next year the same folks complaining will be quiet.

Goaltending will improve and barring injuries we will be a playoff team next season.

Boog will be a great coach when the Panthers break 100 points.
 

I am not exposed

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Mar 16, 2014
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Matheson sucks, Matheson stinks, Matheson and goaltending cost us the season.

I'm sick of hearing the same complaints over and over.

Matheson is playing above his role right now just like Ekblad was when the same crowd complained about him.

Goalies hurt us, yes, but it takes a team to win. Connor McDavid and Leon Draisaitl can't carry the Oilers to the playoffs. Why do you expect one line to carry us?

Matheson will improve and next year the same folks complaining will be quiet.

Goaltending will improve and barring injuries we will be a playoff team next season.

Boog will be a great coach when the Panthers break 100 points.

He's going to win the Jack Adams next year :)

And the Stanley Cup of course.
 
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Crossbar

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I'm sick of hearing the same complaints over and over.

Matheson is playing above his role right now just like Ekblad was when the same crowd complained about him.
It goes both ways, some are sick of complaining, some are sick of excuses, but this is the place where everyone can vent.

I'm sure Math will improve (hey Kuli was once one of the worst d-man in the league too until Gallant forced him to play defense-only role), doesn't erase what Math has done this season.
 

zeroG

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was coming here to post bobby mac's comments but @Bure1096 beat me to it.

Huberdeau is responsible for the defensive breakdown. It’s 101 level coverage. Do you think Huberdeau needs a new coach? Or he’s playing sloppy Bc he’s missing the playoffs again.

Defensive breakdowns happen and that’s why you need your goalie to stop the saveable chances.

I keep hearing this from you. actually, most coaches work really hard to get their teams creating defensive layers. so when you have that one breakdown, there's a second layer. one breakdown should not mean your goalie is hung out to dry. watch the bruins to get a sense of what that looks like.

regarding huberdeau's play, most teams are using a strong-side overload strategy on the PK and sometimes 5v5. that's pretty much what you saw from huberdeau.i'm not sure that was what boog wanted but it'd be really lousy discipline for him to wander over to the wrong side of the ice on his own.

when you overload the strong side, you gotta have guys ready to rotate out if your opponent breaks the pressure. in that case last night, ek would've had to rotate out to the point and so on.

Every single team makes mistakes. Babcock the great has a team that before the last two games was giving up a similar number of chances as us iirc. It’s a bias towards this being your team and putting them under the microscope. Toronto gave up 5 goals last night and half the people here would cut their arm off for their coach. Sometimes it’s on the players more than the coaching staff. They have to execute. Hockey is not complicated

Do you really think the coach doesn’t tell Huberdeau to cover the d-man? Or tell Tro to backcheck with some effort? Or the d-men not to make cute plays? Matheson alone drags our d quality down significantly.

Coach gets some responsibility but players don’t get enough blame around here

That’s not my point. My point is we have roster issues. I don’t believe a coach will fix Matheson who is sinking our defense. And our goalies are not making basic saves. Until you upgrade those positions, a coach won’t make a big enough difference. Ya’ll act like we didn’t get 96 points last year and that’s almost always good enough to get In.

How about, would you upgrade the roster or the coaching staff?

like I said, look at the isles. the golden knights?

there's no question, in any real organization, boog's time is up. two years and no improvement in team play. this is nowhere near good enough from this roster. I think tallon is going to do the right thing. I'd take a chance with almost any retread over another year with this staff.

this team got 96 points last year in spite of coaching. they missed the playoffs because they lost key, winnable games down the stretch as a result of poor team play.

having said all that, I completely agree @RainingRats - the players deserve a ton of blame.

I've already said I think this team has a major character issue with its core guys. trotchek, ek, huberdeau and so on. these guys want to play cute hockey. and Borg looks to be infected now as well. I think we're going to have to move one or more to change the posture in the room. it's a good thing they all have some value.

and yeah, Babcock is dealing with a bunch of prima donnas just like boughner is here. the leafs will be bounced hard by the bruins unless they get their crap together. thing is, you know Babcock knows what takes and knows how to get that message across. it's entirely possible that the leafs think they can flip a switch in April. we'll see.

and I like boog. he sounds like he gets it probably because he's spent time with deboer, who's a smart hockey person.

he simple has not been able to get this roster to play good hockey.
 

Jean Luc Discard

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Jul 11, 2014
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A coaching change will mean another lost season due to first half will be spent on adjusting to the system. It's funny that these guys make X's and O's sound like nuclear science...
 

zeroG

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A coaching change will mean another lost season due to first half will be spent on adjusting to the system. It's funny that these guys make X's and O's sound like nuclear science...

that's not the case, imo. you're right - hockey's simple. with one training camp, an experienced coach can ought to be able to get a good team on the same page. sure, they'll tune as the season goes on but you won't lose the season.

anyhow, was coming to say that dale's should make a move now or Sunday before last home stand. team's clearly thrown in the towel. he needs to lay some lumber. show the kids there are consequences. if he waits until the offseason, he's letting them off and ultimately hurting them and the organization. they need to feel what it's like to see their efforts result in their coach getting canned while the season's still going and there's no place to hide.

bring up Kinnear for the last few as acting HC. then get a veteran.
 
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IceManCat

#TheFloridaPanthers
Jul 13, 2006
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I don’t think coach Q is the right coach for us either he runs an uptempo style as well that leads to defensive breaks against we just don’t have the player personnel to run that system our team would be much better with a defensive minded coach ala Gallant, Trotz. A lot of guys would benefit from that defensive structure goaltending included
 

KW

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A coaching change will mean another lost season due to first half will be spent on adjusting to the system. It's funny that these guys make X's and O's sound like nuclear science...
Last year Boog got months of free credit from some people here based on “players need time to learn his system”. (Then I found out this season from some of the same fans that there’s no such thing as a hockey system. But they didn’t explain what took so long last year to get going though, if players weren’t learning Boog’s system after all. But then I did hear about the great finish, and Boog’s great systems, once again.)
 

KW

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I don’t think coach Q is the right coach for us either he runs an uptempo style as well that leads to defensive breaks against we just don’t have the player personnel to run that system our team would be much better with a defensive minded coach ala Gallant, Trotz. A lot of guys would benefit from that defensive structure goaltending included
I think Q’s Blackhawks played plenty well defensively in the playoffs.
 

IceManCat

#TheFloridaPanthers
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I think Q’s Blackhawks played plenty well defensively in the playoffs.

They did but they had the defenseman to shut other teams down Hjarlmarsson, Seabrook, and Keith are all defensive stalwarts along with a good amount of defensive forwards Toews, Ladd, Vermette etc.. we don’t have the personnel that the Hawks had
 

pantherbot

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You have to wonder with these past three games... How much respect does boughner command in that locker room? Can we really go into next year with a coach that this team has tuned out?

I hope these guys show up to play for the last few games because going into the offseason like this is not a good setup for next season.
 

GrumpyKelly

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Bob said nothing. They always evaluate everything and with everybody at the end of season meetings. And everybody knows Quenneville's connection with Tallon. This is just Bob filling air time in TSN.

Bob clearly says there are a lot of people who think there could be a coaching change. Also he's one of the most reliable if not the most when it comes to this stuff, it's not just filling air time. This thing actually has some legs if it's coming from him.

I don’t believe a coach will fix Matheson who is sinking our defense.

This is exactly what a good coach would do. He would actually be able to coach the mistakes out of him and if you're claiming that it's an IQ issue then the coach would at least

a) simplify his decision making, cut down the high risk plays he's making
b) reduce his minutes and give easier assignments
c) bench Matheson aka hold him responsible if he still continuously f***s up

etc.

This is what a good coach can do. You don't have to look further than GG's time here and see how much he got out of everyone.

But instead here we have Boob who kept throwing Math out there for +70 games, 20 min per night like a a total moron although he was continuously doing the same mistakes over and over again.
 

RainingRats

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Dec 28, 2008
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Bob clearly says there are a lot of people who think there could be a coaching change. Also he's one of the most reliable if not the most when it comes to this stuff, it's not just filling air time. This thing actually has some legs if it's coming from him.



This is exactly what a good coach would do. He would actually be able to coach the mistakes out of him and if you're claiming that it's an IQ issue then the coach would at least

a) simplify his decision making, cut down the high risk plays he's making
b) reduce his minutes and give easier assignments
c) bench Matheson aka hold him responsible if he still continuously ****s up

etc.

This is what a good coach can do. You don't have to look further than GG's time here and see how much he got out of everyone.

But instead here we have Boob who kept throwing Math out there for +70 games, 20 min per night like a a total moron although he was continuously doing the same mistakes over and over again.
Disagree bc there are plenty of first round picks who don’t make it in the NHL and what I’ve seen is that he’s got such a low hockey iq and constantly makes a terrible play that I’m extremely bearish on his development potential. Matheson has had the same problems forever at every level. That was the scouting report on him at the draft iirc. Some players have all the physical tools but cant put it together even under the best coaches.

The biggest mistake with Matheson is tallon signing him long term.
 

GrumpyKelly

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Disagree bc there are plenty of first round picks who don’t make it in the NHL and what I’ve seen is that he’s got such a low hockey iq and constantly makes a terrible play that I’m extremely bearish on his development potential. Matheson has had the same problems forever at every level. That was the scouting report on him at the draft iirc. Some players have all the physical tools but cant put it together even under the best coaches

so it's ok to keep throwing him out there +20min every night then?

either Boog is wrong about Math or you are but he sure as hell thinks that Matheson doesn't lack iq
 

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