Player Discussion Shea Weber Part II

[jaffy27]

Leonidas is a weird one. Not gonna ask.

As for Weber - we can talk about his leadership when the Habs lost in the first round to a truly mediocre Rangers. The Habs couldn't look less capable with the puck. Maybe they lacked some leadership.

The Preds the year before crashed out against the Sharks in game 7. Weber was on the ice for how many goals against - I think five. His aura must've been delayed at the airport.

I don't want him to be done or cooked or to decline. I want him to thrive. I think he is a great player. I don't think it's necessary to loudly try to convince oneself and other fans that he's a modern-day Achilles who will thrive until his late 30s. Plenty of evidence to the contrary. The game has changed a fair bit too. You lose a step, and he's already lost a half-a-step, you might not be able to recover. Dany Heatly was a truly elite goal scorer and he washed out very hard. Weber is a great dman today, can we enjoy him without having to endure exaggerated praise?

Gretzky last won a cup in what.....88??

He played another 11yrs without winning a cup....doesn’t mean he wasn’t good or his presence could t elevate the entire team. Just means the other team was better, that’s it!!

At the end of the day, everyone has a job to do, Weber, as Gretzky, did theirs.

Was Weber -5......sure, so was Josi. The Preds scored zero goals in their last two games vs Pittsburgh in that final......does that justify posters calling anyone on the Preds chokers with a lack of heart and leadership??

And thinking Weber will play well into his 30’s hardly constitutes as exaggerated praise, it’s a thought that I expressed on a chat forum......what else am I suppose to do here.

 

[Cobra Commander]

I get and agree with you.....but posters had no problem going to town on Weber when he was hurt....ran with the he’s old and broken down, a mob with pitchforks we’re ready to ransack the 7th floor of the Bell Centre.....meanwhile he’s proving the complete opposite.

Weber in my opinion will continue his dominance well into his 30’s, my spider senses are telling me the other guy won’t. ......absolutely love this player. He’s my second man crush I’ve ever had........Leonidis was the other

This guy has been beating the players up like crazy, it’s annoying

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

Gretzky last won a cup in what.....88??

He played another 11yrs without winning a cup....doesn’t mean he wasn’t good or his presence could t elevate the entire team. Just means the other team was better, that’s it!!

At the end of the day, everyone has a job to do, Weber, as Gretzky, did theirs.

Was Weber -5......sure, so was Josi. The Preds scored zero goals in their last two games vs Pittsburgh in that final......does that justify posters calling anyone on the Preds chokers with a lack of heart and leadership??

And thinking Weber will play well into his 30’s hardly constitutes as exaggerated praise, it’s a thought that I expressed on a chat forum......what else am I suppose to do here.

Comparing a 32 year old Dman who has never won any personal hardware to the greatest player of all time is a bold move. Good stuff there.

If a team trips at the finish line they still get credit for making it that far. It is patently unfair to call them chokers if they won three rounds prior to the final. Weber's never won two rounds.

But everyone has their own job, you're right. So why does Weber get praised for the intangible intangible of "leadership" when his former team has thrived since his departure and his new team cratered? Why is his aura respected so much of it can't get him or his team past the second round? Why should his mere presence be praised if it can't hold up in, say, a game 7?

All I'm saying is let's be realistic and honest. Praise the player for what he is. What good does it serve to praise the player for what he supposedly was when he wasn't a Hab?

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

This guy has been beating the players up like crazy, it’s annoying

Weber's tough enough to take it, I'm sure.

 

[Mrb1p]

Do you guys seriously think the Habs are ahead of that trade?

If only in quantifiable ways the Preds got to the Cup Finals and then won the President's trophy while the Habs won nothing and tanked.

How does that "feel good"? I really don't get it.

So you really believe the Preds wouldnt win those games if you swapped Weber and Subban?

 

[Cobra Commander]

I know Weber is large man and you're desperate for him to surpass his own limits but he isn't all of our players lmao

His own limits of being the best in the world at what he does? He’s the best Defender in the world, not overall Defenseman.

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

Loved the move at first. Still do now. Ds like Weber have proved to be competitive pretty much till they turn 40. In his last year here Subban was starting to show why he wasn't a fit anymore.

Bergevin did a lot of pretty awful moves. But this one ain't one of them. It's funny to see everyone point at this trade and say it is the big reason for all of the Habs problems and shortcomings in the last few years.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

So you really believe the Preds wouldnt win those games if you swapped Weber and Subban?

I didn't say that. I'm saying that it's silly for Habs fans to praise getting an inferior player back and then claim his aura is in fact magical when the results are the opposite. But yes, I don't think Weber has the same impact on the ice as more mobile dmen and it hurts the transition game, ie possession, a lot. Having a couple of two-way studs at D allows the Preds to enjoy a dynamic approach. Weber was trending downright down in his last season for the Preds - they were moving in a different (better) direction without him. It's clear to see.

Why don't you ask this guy if he seriously believes Weber is the best defender in the world? Go ahead I'll wait.

His own limits of being the best in the world at what he does? He’s the best Defender in the world, not overall Defenseman.

Prove it and I'll eat my words. I'm sure the stats are there, D-zone starts, Fenwick, or whatever. Best defender. Okay, that should be easy to prove. Go ahead.

 

[jaffy27]

Comparing a 32 year old Dman who has never won any personal hardware to the greatest player of all time is a bold move. Good stuff there.

If a team trips at the finish line they still get credit for making it that far. It is patently unfair to call them chokers if they won three rounds prior to the final. Weber's never won two rounds.

But everyone has their own job, you're right. So why does Weber get praised for the intangible intangible of "leadership" when his former team has thrived since his departure and his new team cratered? Why is his aura respected so much of it can't get him or his team past the second round? Why should his mere presence be praised if it can't hold up in, say, a game 7?

All I'm saying is let's be realistic and honest. Praise the player for what he is. What good does it serve to praise the player for what he supposedly was when he wasn't a Hab?

Bold move??.....he’s the greatest player of all time that “choked” for another 11yrs!!!!

If the greatest player of all time can’t elevate his team via his aura and talent, what makes you think Weber could too?? And he’s a defenceman to boot!!

As for his aura and how he elevates people, you don’t know and I don’t know what it’s effect is.....but do you know who knows???.....NHL Players

And if you do any research on the matter, plenty, and I mean plenty of praise for Webs, that’s fact!!

Anyways, I've come to the conclusion that Weber is a pretty good defensemen and I trust what NHL players say when discussing their respect and praise for the player.

It’s all good

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

Loved the move at first. Still do now. Ds like Weber have proved to be competitive pretty much till they turn 40.

Can you name a few? I want to be enlightened.

In his last year here Subban was starting to show why he wasn't a fit anymore.

Why is that? On the ice he had another great year and was in Norris contention until the wheels flew off and the Habs sold at the deadline. If you mean "off the ice" then I'd like to be enlightened too, thanks.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Do you guys seriously think the Habs are ahead of that trade?

If only in quantifiable ways the Preds got to the Cup Finals and then won the President's trophy while the Habs won nothing and tanked.

How does that "feel good"? I really don't get it.

The Oilers won the Taylor Hall trade then because Larsson helped them win a playoff round the first season after the trade while Hall and the Devils were winning the draft lottery?

Silly logic.

This has nothing to do with my opinion on the trade (both players bring similar value to their teams - but the age factor should have brought extra compensation from Nsh), but these cup finals arguments annoy me as much as I assume the intangible comments annoy you.

 

[Cobra Commander]

I didn't say that. I'm saying that it's silly for Habs fans to praise getting an inferior player back and then claim his aura is in fact magical when the results are the opposite. But yes, I don't think Weber has the same impact on the ice as more mobile dmen and it hurts the transition game, ie possession, a lot. Having a couple of two-way studs at D allows the Preds to enjoy a dynamic approach. Weber was trending downright down in his last season for the Preds - they were moving in a different (better) direction without him. It's clear to see.

Why don't you ask this guy if he seriously believes Weber is the best defender in the world? Go ahead I'll wait.


Prove it and I'll eat my words. I'm sure the stats are there, D-zone starts, Fenwick, or whatever. Best defender. Okay, that should be easy to prove. Go ahead.

I don’t have to prove shit to you. Name me a defenseman who eats big minutes like Weber that can defend better than he does.. 3.. 2.. 1.. Goodluck.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

Bold move??.....he’s the greatest player of all time that “choked” for another 11yrs!!!!

If the greatest player of all time can’t elevate his team via his aura and talent, what makes you think Weber could too?? And he’s a defenceman to boot!!

As for his aura and how he elevates people, you don’t know and I don’t know what it’s effect is.....but do you know who knows???.....NHL Players

And if you do any research on the matter, plenty, and I mean plenty of praise for Webs, that’s fact!!

Anyways, I've come to the conclusion that Weber is a pretty good defensemen and I trust what NHL players say when discussing their respect and praise for the player.

You're the one calling players chokers for absolutely no reason. I don't like using that term. So don't shake the "" at me, pal

I never spoke of Gretzky's aura. I know Gretzky was the best at what he did, I don't need to defer to his mythical aura to priase him. Maybe you people can try doing the same for Weber sometime! Just a thought.

 

[Cobra Commander]

You're the one calling players chokers for absolutely no reason. I don't like using that term. So don't shake the "" at me, pal

I never spoke of Gretzky's aura. I know Gretzky was the best at what he did, I don't need to defer to his mythical aura to priase him. Maybe you people can try doing the same for Weber sometime! Just a thought.

Enough with Gretzky.

Is Shea Weber the best defender in the world? Just admit it.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

The Oilers won the Taylor Hall trade then because Larsson helped them win a playoff round the first season after the trade while Hall and the Devils were winning the draft lottery?

Silly logic.

This has nothing to do with my opinion on the trade (both players bring similar value to their teams - but the age factor should have brought extra compensation from Nsh), but these cup finals arguments annoy me as much as I assume the intangible comments annoy you.

I think it's not reasonable to suggest that NJD trended down and EDM trended up. The opposite has happened in fact. Same with the Habs. It isn't Weber's fault that the Habs have undoubtedly trended down but then how is praised so much for his intangibles?? Why?!

I don’t have to prove **** to you. Name me a defenseman who eats big minutes like Weber that can defend better than he does.. 3.. 2.. 1.. Goodluck.

lmao I assume you've heard of PK Subban

 

[CDN24]

Can you name a few? I want to be enlightened. Why is that? On the ice he had another great year and was in Norris contention until the wheels flew off and the Habs sold at the deadline. If you mean "off the ice" then I'd like to be enlightened too, thanks.

Chelios, Chara, Doug harvey, Lidstrom, Larry Robinson, schneider, al macinnis

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

Chelios, Chara, Doug harvey, Lidstrom, Larry Robinson, schneider, al macinnis

So, one player per decade is your proof that plenty of players thrive until they're 40? Is that really your argument? lol

Was Matheiu Schneider thriving in his late 30s, is that the level you want from Weber? A slow, unreliable, non-physical slapshot?

 

[Cobra Commander]

I think it's not reasonable to suggest that NJD trended down and EDM trended up. The opposite has happened in fact. Same with the Habs. It isn't Weber's fault that the Habs have undoubtedly trended down but then how is praised so much for his intangibles?? Why?!


lmao I assume you've heard of PK Subban

PK Subban is not a better Defender!! Everyone knows this!! Is he an all around better Defenseman? Yes, because his offense is superior.

You are purposely running me around in circles. Answer my question, WHO CAN DEFEND BETTER THAN WEBER??

 

[Agalloch]

PK Subban is not a better Defender!! Everyone knows this!! Is he an all around better Defenseman? Yes.

You are purposely running me around in circles. Answer my question, WHO CAN DEFEND BETTER THAN WEBER??

Pk Subban. (kidding)

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

PK Subban is not a better Defender!! Everyone knows this!! Is he an all around better Defenseman? Yes, because his offense is superior.

You are purposely running me around in circles. Answer my question, WHO CAN DEFEND BETTER THAN WEBER??

In their last season with their previous teams, PK was notably better defensively than Shea. The stats are all there to see. I stand by that.

Mind proving your assertion now?

 

[Agalloch]

In their last season with their previous teams, PK was notably better defensively than Shea. The stats are all there to see. I stand by that.

Mind proving your assertion now?

OOps... I didn't read well at first (EDIT)

What stats ? curious to see.

 

[Frank Drebin]

I think it's not reasonable to suggest that NJD trended down and EDM trended up. The opposite has happened in fact. Same with the Habs. It isn't Weber's fault that the Habs have undoubtedly trended down but then how is praised so much for his intangibles?? Why?!

Actually, NJD is looking like a lottery team again this year, so no, I don't think they're trending up. Has nothing to do with Hall as a player.

As for the intangibles, you think some posters might be having a little fun with it?

 

[FrankMTL]

I love Weber...but he has to continue like this for many more years for this trade to be considered even. Whats funny, is that I have a weird feeling (probably just me), that with the way Subban plays, he may even slow down before Weber.

 

[Habs Icing]

Who you debating with, I can’t see who you’re replying to......I’m thinking it’s someone who I put on ignore

ECWHSWI.

 

[Cobra Commander]

In their last season with their previous teams, PK was notably better defensively than Shea. The stats are all there to see. I stand by that.

Mind proving your assertion now?

Hahaha god you are full of it.

My guess is that you have never watched either of these guys play