Rumor: Sharks GM Doug Wilson looking desperately to get a first for rebuild mode

[Sysreq]

how about simplified:

To San Jose:
C- Casey Mittelstadt
D- Brandon Montour
2020 1st Round Pick (top 3 protected?)

To Buffalo:
C- Tomas Hertl

I’d do that. I think SJS overvalues Hertl like TML overvalues Bracco. Hertl is good, but I don’t like him at center. People are calling this a down year for him, but it’s not. Last year was the abnormality. Hertl is back to where he has always been. He was rocking a 19.5% shooting percentage last season. He scored half his goals in the post season off the power play. This year, his shooting percentage is down to slightly above career average, at 13%. He has 2 power play goals, like most other seasons.

 

[matt trick]

I’d do that. I think SJS overvalues Hertl like TML overvalues Bracco. Hertl is good, but I don’t like him at center. People are calling this a down year for him, but it’s not. Last year was the abnormality. Hertl is back to where he has always been. On the whole, I don’t think Hertl is substantially better than Hayes or Kreider.

I haven't seen anyone propose Hertl for McDavid in this thread*

*I like Bracco and think he'd be a great buy low option for the Sharks. Though I'd say hoping for him to play at a top 9 level has about a 25% chance of working out.

 

[themelkman]

how about simplified:

To San Jose:
C- Casey Mittelstadt
D- Brandon Montour
2020 1st Round Pick (top 3 protected?)

To Buffalo:
C- Tomas Hertl

If you make Mittel Couzins or make sure the first is a top 3 then sure, otherwise no

 

[izzy]

No late firsts you are hoping to develop into impact players and settle for 40-50 point players which are nice to have but which can also be easily scooped up like Fabbri, Duclair, Connolly etc were

Does Kevin Labanc move the needle for any sort of contender? He can hang on the PP with better players but so can many others. Compare his impact on the game to that of a guy like Meier for instance

you also hope that of 4th rounds, its uncommon. you are massively overrating late first round picks and the types of players they typically become

 

[Kuznetsnow]

you also hope that of 4th rounds, its uncommon. you are massively overrating late first round picks and the types of players they typically become

Just because that's what they typically become doesn't mean that's the value

It's supply and demand. 40-50 point players are in high supply (at least with solid GMing). There's lots signed through UFA, KHL, NCAA etc. every year. But 1st rounders are also the best shot at getting a high end player who can also be tethered to a reasonable contract since Panarins come along very rarely. That's the real value. You hope to hit on a David Pastrnak and if you strike out completely get a Kevin Labanc like player cheaply some other way if you need him.

Just this year, you had teams cheaply acquire the following players who are ~Kevin Labanc (some better, some worse but net impact in that ballpark) - Nichushkin, Fabbri, Namestnikov, Mikheyev, Burakovsky, Connolly, Acciari, Haula, Duclair, Dzingel, Stephenson, Connor Brown. Some aren't on his level offensively but bring a more complete game.

 

[is the answer jesus]

If you make Mittel Couzins or make sure the first is a top 3 then sure, otherwise no

So you want a blue chip prospect, a young top 4 defenseman and what looks very likely to be a top 10 pick in a good draft? Easy pass.

 

[themelkman]

So you want a blue chip prospect, a young top 4 defenseman and what looks very likely to be a top 10 pick in a good draft? Easy pass.

I want a blue chip prospect and a first, dont need any D men who would be on our third pair.

 

[is the answer jesus]

I want a blue chip prospect and a first, dont need any D men who would be on our third pair.

I think you could get a 1st and a blue chip prospect for Hertl, but it'd be from a playoff team, not a team that picks in the top 10 year in and year out. I certainly wouldn't scoff at any offer that included one of Cozens or our 1st ++. Hertl is a damn good player on a good contract. It's honestly probably a moot point anyhow as I think it's extremely unlikely SJ moves him. A guy like Labanc would probably be the more realistic target as I don't think Botterill has the stones to pull off a deal of that magnitude.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

I’d do that. I think SJS overvalues Hertl like TML overvalues Bracco. Hertl is good, but I don’t like him at center. People are calling this a down year for him, but it’s not. Last year was the abnormality. Hertl is back to where he has always been. He was rocking a 19.5% shooting percentage last season. He scored half his goals in the post season off the power play. This year, his shooting percentage is down to slightly above career average, at 13%. He has 2 power play goals, like most other seasons.

This is literally the worst analogy that I have ever seen anybody ever use anywhere in my life.

 

[Oddbob]

How about getting a real goalie before your season goes straight in the toilet? They were built to win, they should have done something to at least address it.

 

[CDN24]

how about simplified:

To San Jose:
C- Casey Mittelstadt
D- Brandon Montour
2020 1st Round Pick (top 3 protected?)

To Buffalo:
C- Tomas Hertl

Sabres say no.

Hertl not worth 3 1st rounders.
2020 1st
They just traded a 1st (sj's from kane trade) to get montour
mittlestadt former 8th overall, seems to have regressed but is still only 21.

Look at what you paid to get an extended Kane a 1st and a 4th, would have been a 2nd and 4th had he not resigned

 

[405Exit]

I’d do that. I think SJS overvalues Hertl like TML overvalues Bracco. Hertl is good, but I don’t like him at center. People are calling this a down year for him, but it’s not. Last year was the abnormality. Hertl is back to where he has always been. He was rocking a 19.5% shooting percentage last season. He scored half his goals in the post season off the power play. This year, his shooting percentage is down to slightly above career average, at 13%. He has 2 power play goals, like most other seasons.

I don’t mind it either. If Wilson wants to get back in the first round? This is one of the better proposals.

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

how about simplified:

To San Jose:
C- Casey Mittelstadt
D- Brandon Montour
2020 1st Round Pick (top 3 protected?)

To Buffalo:
C- Tomas Hertl

Mittelstadt and Montour's value have taken a pretty huge hit imo. Both need new contracts this offseason. I'd be worried they are fool's gold if I were the Sharks.

 

[themelkman]

Mittelstadt and Montour's value have taken a pretty huge hit imo. Both need new contracts this offseason. I'd be worried they are fool's gold if I were the Sharks.

I don’t even think they are fools gold, more like fools bronze

 

[Dicdonya]

How about getting a real goalie before your season goes straight in the toilet? They were built to win, they should have done something to at least address it.

How are/were we built to win? Literally I mean, not from a hope standpoint?

We have a couple decent forwards, no prospects that were able to step up and contribute, a defense that is anchored by a defensive dman that isn’t playing like one, and two wild horses that are just as likely to cause goals against as for.

We had a gaping hole in our top six from the get go, and goalies that can’t compensate for any of the above.

This team was built to eek into the playoffs possibly before getting bent over again by better teams.

Like seriously this team is the same one from last year that had to have a miracle to make it out of the first round, and then we removed about 100+ pts of forwards from the roster and replaced them with Marleau only after it was clear our forward prospects were not ready for the nhl.

A goalie might help us not be a bottom feeder, but that’s about it.

 

[Oddbob]

How are/were we built to win? Literally I mean, not from a hope standpoint?

We have a couple decent forwards, no prospects that were able to step up and contribute, a defense that is anchored by a defensive dman that isn’t playing like one, and two wild horses that are just as likely to cause goals against as for.

We had a gaping hole in our top six from the get go, and goalies that can’t compensate for any of the above.

This team was built to eek into the playoffs possibly before getting bent over again by better teams.

Like seriously this team is the same one from last year that had to have a miracle to make it out of the first round, and then we removed about 100+ pts of forwards from the roster and replaced them with Marleau only after it was clear our forward prospects were not ready for the nhl.

A goalie might help us not be a bottom feeder, but that’s about it.

Well, your clearly not retooling or rebuilding, and your team has lots of veterans. They are/were in the contender category based on their roster, not sure why you think otherwise. The Sharks did not go into this season intending to be middle or bottom, otherwise they would be selling off Burns, Karlsson, Thornton, and wouldn't even be signing vets like Marleau. If you had a real goalie, you might have 6 or 7 more wins, which in the NHL today is a lot of ground made up. Even 5 more wins and you are within 2 pts of the division lead. 1 pt separates the top 5 teams in your division, so a better goalie has you looking a lot better. Even Bernier has played better and we have a far worse team and blueline than you guys do, believe me!

 

[Zman5778]

Sabres say no.

I think the Sabres take Hertl for Mitts, Montour and a top-3 protected 1st all day. I don't think it's terrible value for the Sharks, but I do think they could do a bit better than that package. Or maybe get a 2021 2nd/3rd out of Buffalo for him.

 

[Dicdonya]

Well, your clearly not retooling or rebuilding, and your team has lots of veterans. They are/were in the contender category based on their roster, not sure why you think otherwise. The Sharks did not go into this season intending to be middle or bottom, otherwise they would be selling off Burns, Karlsson, Thornton, and wouldn't even be signing vets like Marleau. If you had a real goalie, you might have 6 or 7 more wins, which in the NHL today is a lot of ground made up. Even 5 more wins and you are within 2 pts of the division lead. 1 pt separates the top 5 teams in your division, so a better goalie has you looking a lot better. Even Bernier has played better and we have a far worse team and blueline than you guys do, believe me!

Oh ok so you meant more like “our GM wants us to compete” more so than we are actually built as one of the better teams?

I agree it’s looks like we are stuck having to force ourselves to try to compete based on the roster, I just disagree this roster was able to compete for anything other than possibly making the playoffs.

 

[hockfan1991]

How about getting a real goalie before your season goes straight in the toilet? They were built to win, they should have done something to at least address it.

We are far past the toilet

The Season Is already in the sewage system floating in SF Bay

 

[Nolan11]

Our next 6-8 games are against pacific division teams. If we were to "magically win" all of these games in regulation, we would be back in the playoff hunt prior to the TDL. (In which case, DW would be buying instead of selling). Barring some crazy hot streak like that, and nothing points to us having anything like that, we are cooked.

Given a worse case scenario, which we sharks fans always seem to expect, we do go on this miracle on ice hot streak and then will revert to our normal selves as soon as the TDL passes.

 

[405Exit]

This is literally the worst analogy that I have ever seen anybody ever use anywhere in my life.

I haven’t seen one San Jose poster beef up Hertls value. Not one..... not one criticizing value like TML does with Bracco. I gave you a like.

 

[CanadienShark]

I would be very interested if Hertl/Meier is on the table, although Lebanc is probably more realistic.

No, no, and maybe.

 

[The don godfather]

Hertyl for grezlyk heinen 1st round pick.

 

[themelkman]

Hertyl for grezlyk heinen 1st round pick.

More like Debrusk, Studnicka and a first.

 

[The don godfather]

More like Debrusk, Studnicka and a first.

Ouch I don't think Donny would do that.