Confirmed with Link: Sens hire Pierre McGuire

[Masked]

Its a pretty obvious joke lol

Yeah, because who the hell would ever believe that SOEM would foot the bill at Le Nordik?

 

[Beech]

Its a pretty obvious joke lol

yes, but his antics Dude. Who takes him seriously? Simpson comes off as a clown. This whole thread is about who? Pierre McGuire...Who we all see as a clown... Screaming "A Double Deon" is a quick way to loose respect.

Do you remember the American politician who screamed/screeched (Howard Dean)?..wins the primary, screeches like a drunk college kid and goodbye career. The Presidency may have been his!! Jim Rome was using his screech as a punch line on his show for years!

Managers must always come off as serious, stoic. Marc Bergevin is the exception. But he is aided by heritage and one owner who loves him. And even he has become considerably more stoic. Making fun of a situation that is partially tense will not endear you to PD, PM or EM and not endear to the hockey world. If I am PM, PD or EM, I would take this as: I am being made fun of. Now hope that those 3 give you the time of day.

Simpson has spent the last 10 years on Ottawa radio talking about drinking and acting like a teenage boy. And sending out crazy tweets. All he is doing is ensuring that he remains on Ottawa radio.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

In here, where fans are, we really need to accept that analytics are extremely boring, a full blown buzzkill in fact, for many people.

I personally don’t watch hockey to crunch numbers, and my eyes typically glaze over when someone wants to wow me with ‘data’ during my personal time.

The eye test, for fans, equates to watching the games and forming opinions based on what one sees. This is totally adequate for the purposes of fans talking to each other on a message board.

As for team analytics, they are a fun tool, that generally is meaningless if it’s not applied properly. The way we seem to use data seems appropriate; DJ explains how they get game data right after the game and can use that along with what they saw to evaluate how players are playing as lines, and within the systems.

Drafting a player based solely on analytics is silly, much like team’s don’t draft based solely on stats either.

I think when we see that a team ‘doesn’t rely on analytics’ it means that the don’t heavily rely on them, which doesn’t mean they don’t use them at all. We also don’t need a massive analytics team when there are professional businesses that will compile the data for you. All a team really needs is someone to manage the relationship with said company, and at least initially, help the team interpret what all of those acronyms mean (lol). These days the coaching staff, at least ours, seem competent enough to interpret the numbers they want to use.

In no way does analytics replace, or even come close to being equal to the eye test, especially when those eyes are pro coaches, players, scouts, and managers.

No one is saying draft players solely based on analytics. That’s the thing. No one is saying that. Not even the “analytixs people”

your last paragraph well what would you like me to say. You say yourself your eyes glaze over when hearing about the numbers. Many times players are acquired by these pros. And the analytics say “whoa, player x is not very good look at these numbers AND he doesn’t seem very good when we watch him” aaaaand he turns out to not be very good and now team y is saddled with a bad contract. Happens every year. A bunch of times.

 

[Ice-Tray]

No one is saying draft players solely based on analytics. That’s the thing. No one is saying that. Not even the “analytixs people”

your last paragraph well what would you like me to say. You say yourself your eyes glaze over when hearing about the numbers. Many times players are acquired by these pros. And the analytics say “whoa, player x is not very good look at these numbers AND he doesn’t seem very good when we watch him” aaaaand he turns out to not be very good and now team y is saddled with a bad contract. Happens every year. A bunch of times.

I think my point was that me personally view hockey as entertainment, and data analysis is not entertaining for me, personally. So I mostly ignore chatter about it in here.

The pros obviously don’t, and our team has said numerous times that they use it, just don’t rely on it.

As for your example; certain teams use analytics as a basis to sign players, even when the eye test doesn’t match, and are often sorry for it. Think about our good buddy Patty Wier….

I don’t mind if you enjoy advanced stats, that’s ‘cool’ with me

 

[TheDebater]

Its a pretty obvious joke lol

The 2nd part of his tweet is obviously a joke, but who's to say the first part would not be interpreted as being true? As a media personality, with people who follow you, you have a responsibility and liability when you throw out rumours especially when it is preceded with "my sources tell me".

I could have read that and thought the first part is true and 2nd part was just Simpson making light of a real situation. He needs to think his tweets through.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Toxic in Kanata....

 

[Micklebot]

Huh, wonder how Logan feels about his dad talking crap about his team's new hire, might be a sign he really wants out,

Edit: Jeff not a fan of Simmer either...

 

[Beech]

No one is saying draft players solely based on analytics. That’s the thing. No one is saying that. Not even the “analytixs people”

your last paragraph well what would you like me to say. You say yourself your eyes glaze over when hearing about the numbers. Many times players are acquired by these pros. And the analytics say “whoa, player x is not very good look at these numbers AND he doesn’t seem very good when we watch him” aaaaand he turns out to not be very good and now team y is saddled with a bad contract. Happens every year. A bunch of times.

Burrow...no way.

I would love to see a draft table produced by analytics guys and then compare it to productivity of those players over the next 2-5 years. Analytics is at best poor in the world of junior hockey because the game is way to chaotic to trust numbers. The pro game is more structured and numbers can be trusted.

Analytics is a far greater tool for trades and free agency. But that does not replace old fashioned scouting, old fashion "information gathering" (Yes, inside dirt).

Toronto calls its department; Research....

That research got it zero playoff wins (series, not games). It got it Tavares @ 11.5 million; 1 playoff series won. It got it Mathews and Marner at 11 million; 0 playoff wins. Nylander @ 7 million; 0 wins and so on.

Does Lou Lamerelo strike you as an analytics guy? within one goal of a final. A final they most likely would have won. He let Tavares walk..

 

[cudi]

Jeff Brown seems like such a helicopter parent.

 

[TheDebater]

Huh, wonder how Logan feels about his dad talking crap about his team's new hire, might be a sign he really wants out,

Edit: Jeff not a fan of Simmer either...

Such a mess. I wonder if the best solution is to in fact move on from the Brown family and send Logan packing to another city.

As an aside, Jeff Brown does have a point in his reply to Simpson; the guy tends to throw out so many random rumours without having any shred of truth. He has a hard time clarifying what he tweets between "opinion" and "hearsay".

 

[Tuna99]

Huh, wonder how Logan feels about his dad talking crap about his team's new hire, might be a sign he really wants out,

Edit: Jeff not a fan of Simmer either...

nice: Shawn Simpson has been telling the same 3 stories of being drafted, playing for the WJC and the Soo for 20 years. And he peppers on some insults and terrible rumours. Remember the EK has been traded tweet - that’s how connected he really is.

 

[Micklebot]

nice: Shawn Simpson has been telling the same 3 stories of being drafted, playing for the WJC and the Soo for 20 years. And he peppers on some insults and terrible rumours. Remember the EK has been traded tweet - that’s how connected he really is.

There's been some confirmation that Ryan and Ek both thought it was a done deal for them to go to Vegas, hasn't there? I though I read that it was all said and done but Dorion wouldn't move of Glass instead of Suzuki so it fell through,

Sometimes you have good Intel but it just doesn't pan out, he may have had it all right pulled the trigger early, or decided not to hedge, only to see it fall apart and looks like he made it up but he may have had legit sources on that one.

 

[burf]

Burrow...no way.

I would love to see a draft table produced by analytics guys and then compare it to productivity of those players over the next 2-5 years. Analytics is at best poor in the world of junior hockey because the game is way to chaotic to trust numbers. The pro game is more structured and numbers can be trusted.

Analytics is a far greater tool for trades and free agency. But that does not replace old fashioned scouting, old fashion "information gathering" (Yes, inside dirt).

This is one of my favourite draft-related blog posts from the past decade. Not even comparing draft results to analytics-focused draft results. Just comparing a team's draft results to what would have happened if they took the highest-scoring North American player available at the pick:

We think the Vancouver Canucks may have a scouting problem(!!!!)

I'd be interested to see a similar comparison between an NHL team and an NHLe model. I might even do so and post it if I have time today.

This isn't to say that I think that "analytics", however you want to define them, can replace scouting. I think it's just a weird appeal-to-authority argument to assume that an old-fashioned scouting department will always take the better player.

I don't think there's any team - Toronto included - that thinks analytics can replace scouting, or even makes their decisions on the basis of analytics. Heck, Toronto's deadline moves the past few years make that point pretty well. And the teams that do rely heavily on analytics - Tampa, Carolina, Colorado, even Toronto - have been doing very well in the league lately.

edit: For what it's worth, I think that Ottawa has drafted very well, apparently without relying heavily on analytics. First-round picks like Karlsson, Zibanejad, and Sanderson are looking very good, even if they were low-rated by NHLe models. But I think that's a large part of the point - you need to rely on both methods, especially as you get into later rounds of the draft.

 

[topshelf15]

This is one of my favourite draft-related blog posts from the past decade. Not even comparing draft results to analytics-focused draft results. Just comparing a team's draft results to what would have happened if they took the highest-scoring North American player available at the pick:

We think the Vancouver Canucks may have a scouting problem(!!!!)

I'd be interested to see a similar comparison between an NHL team and an NHLe model. I might even do so and post it if I have time today.

This isn't to say that I think that "analytics", however you want to define them, can replace scouting. I think it's just a weird appeal-to-authority argument to assume that an old-fashioned scouting department will always take the better player.

I don't think there's any team - Toronto included - that thinks analytics can replace scouting, or even makes their decisions on the basis of analytics. Heck, Toronto's deadline moves the past few years make that point pretty well. And the teams that do rely heavily on analytics - Tampa, Carolina, Colorado, even Toronto - have been doing very well in the league lately.

I bet everyone of those team looks at the players they draft with both methods,save maybe Toronto..They seem to bent on collecting talent rather than building a team

 

[Ice-Tray]

Man these little Twitter battles always seem to make everyone involved look bad.

People never learn. Jeff should really stay off Twitter for the time being, he’s not helping at all.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Such a mess. I wonder if the best solution is to in fact move on from the Brown family and send Logan packing to another city.

As an aside, Jeff Brown does have a point in his reply to Simpson; the guy tends to throw out so many random rumours without having any shred of truth. He has a hard time clarifying what he tweets between "opinion" and "hearsay".

clearly guessing at the list of possible sources . For JB to jump on this is an emo over reaction .. he should sign up here

 

[Ice-Tray]

clearly guessing at the list of possible sources . For JB to jump on this is an emo over reaction .. he should sign up here

Seriously, it really is either family connections, team connections, or agent connection.

I suppose he did leave out magic…..

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

clearly guessing at the list of possible sources . For JB to jump on this is an emo over reaction .. he should sign up here

He is not in a fan of internet trolls

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

He is not in a fan of internet trolls

An important balanced perspective

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Burrow...no way.

I would love to see a draft table produced by analytics guys and then compare it to productivity of those players over the next 2-5 years. Analytics is at best poor in the world of junior hockey because the game is way to chaotic to trust numbers. The pro game is more structured and numbers can be trusted.

Analytics is a far greater tool for trades and free agency. But that does not replace old fashioned scouting, old fashion "information gathering" (Yes, inside dirt).

Toronto calls its department; Research....

That research got it zero playoff wins (series, not games). It got it Tavares @ 11.5 million; 1 playoff series won. It got it Mathews and Marner at 11 million; 0 playoff wins. Nylander @ 7 million; 0 wins and so on.

Does Lou Lamerelo strike you as an analytics guy? within one goal of a final. A final they most likely would have won. He let Tavares walk..

I am not saying use only analytics lol.
There also seems to be this idea that Dubas is a big analytics guys because a he’s young and wears glasses.

 

[cudi]

Jeff Brown and Simmer should meet by the flagpole after school and settle this once and for all.

 

[TheDebater]

clearly guessing at the list of possible sources . For JB to jump on this is an emo over reaction .. he should sign up here

It is a build up of poorly worded and/or poorly thought out Tweets by Shawn Simpson. He likes to think of himself as a "random guy" but he is a voice on the only sports radio station in the city, he needs to accept that his words hold merit to them.

For example last year's lead up to the draft, he kept insisting and suggesting non-stop that the Senators were likely and should be selecting Askarov. He pushed that agenda for so long and then looked like a fool when they selected Jake Sanderson (something most people thought was a high possibilty).

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

It is a build up of poorly worded and/or poorly thought out Tweets by Shawn Simpson. He likes to think of himself as a "random guy" but he is a voice on the only sports radio station in the city, he needs to accept that his words hold merit to them.

For example last year's lead up to the draft, he kept insisting and suggesting non-stop that the Senators were likely and should be selecting Askarov. He pushed that agenda for so long and then looked like a fool when they selected Jake Sanderson (something most people thought was a high possibilty).

l0l looked like a fool .. smh

Hey I am sure he'd be receptive to your tips

 

[BloodRedArmy]

There's been some confirmation that Ryan and Ek both thought it was a done deal for them to go to Vegas, hasn't there? I though I read that it was all said and done but Dorion wouldn't move of Glass instead of Suzuki so it fell through,

Sometimes you have good Intel but it just doesn't pan out, he may have had it all right pulled the trigger early, or decided not to hedge, only to see it fall apart and looks like he made it up but he may have had legit sources on that one.

Simmer stated EK to Tampa was done.
TSN Reporter Apologizes for Fake Erik Karlsson Trade News