Speculation: Search for a President of Hockey..... Oops

[FormentonTheFuture]

Once Edmonton chooses their GM I bet one of those candidates may end up interviewing here

 

[coladin]

People didn't have the concerns about whether execs would be willing to work under Melnyk that they have today even two years ago. You are making a false equivalency by suggesting melnyks reputation today is the sames as it was when leeder was here or that keeping a role you already have under a mecurial owner is the same as applying for a new one under the same person.

Idk if melnyks reputation will impact the hiring of a new POHO but i stand by my claim that Leeder's time here doesn't give any insight into whether or not it will be a factor.

So, Melnyk was not mercurial the entire time, just lately? Melnyk demonstrated the same pattern when he was denied the casino, the soccer stadium and MLS franchise, etc...I don't see the overhanded accusation of false equivalency here

 

[Liver King]

Once Edmonton chooses their GM I bet one of those candidates may end up interviewing here

Mark Hunter come on down

 

[BatherSeason]

Once Edmonton chooses their GM I bet one of those candidates may end up interviewing here

Sloppy seconds

 

[Micklebot]

So, Melnyk was not mercurial the entire time, just lately? Melnyk demonstrated the same pattern when he was denied the casino, the soccer stadium and MLS franchise, etc...I don't see the overhanded accusation of false equivalency here

so you don't think his reputation has gotten worse lately?

The underlying personality always existed, but a reputation is built of the accumulation of supporting evidence. More important, the spotlight has been shining on his behaviour far more than say 5 to 10 years ago.

More importantly, you are still trying to sidestep the difference between sticking around a place where you've laid your roots (leeder in ottawa) and coming into a new situation knowing about the issue in advance. It's not the same thing at all.

 

[stempniaksen]

Leeder also wasn't the POHO. I think there are vastly different expectations when it comes to expecting your owner to be hands on when it comes to the business side of things as opposed to hockey ops. The expectation from Leeder was (likely) that EM would be hands on whereas anyone coming in to be a "true" POHO (and not some figurehead) would want full authority on hockey decisions.

Bit of a strange name to bring up in many regards, imo.

 

[coladin]

Leeder also wasn't the POHO. I think there are vastly different expectations when it comes to expecting your owner to be hands on when it comes to the business side of things as opposed to hockey ops. The expectation from Leeder was (likely) that EM would be hands on whereas anyone coming in to be a "true" POHO (and not some figurehead) would want full authority on hockey decisions.

Bit of a strange name to bring up in many regards, imo.

The name was brought up because of the discussion about working under Melnyk, and good people working for him. He is considered to be good people.

 

[coladin]

so you don't think his reputation has gotten worse lately?

The underlying personality always existed, but a reputation is built of the accumulation of supporting evidence. More important, the spotlight has been shining on his behaviour far more than say 5 to 10 years ago.

More importantly, you are still trying to sidestep the difference between sticking around a place where you've laid your roots (leeder in ottawa) and coming into a new situation knowing about the issue in advance. It's not the same thing at all.

You are correct, as you stated that the underlying personality always existed. Always. Difference is the team was doing better on the ice during those tumultuous times where stuff was swept under the rug when it suited many Senator fans.

 

[Micklebot]

You are correct, as you stated that the underlying personality always existed. Always. Difference is the team was doing better on the ice during those tumultuous times where stuff was swept under the rug when it suited many Senator fans.

Reputation is all about perception so there is certainly room for debate on whither Melnyk's has taken enough of a hit of late to affect the team's ability to attract execs since Leeder was here, i guess we can agree to disagree on that point but you are notably still not addressing the difference between attracting new employees vs retaining someone who was essentially a founding member of the team. It takes more to drive someone with deep roots in the team and community away than it does to prevent someone with no connection from being interested in joining.

Its also interesting that you claim things were swept under the rug when it suited fans. The media is far harsher on melnyk now than in the past. Its not fans on sportsnet, it's Burke and Maclean. This didn't happen when Leeder was here.

The list of guys we know or at least are reported to have rejected the idea of interviewing for POHO aren't soing so because the team is bad, execs don't look at short term results they look at potential and numerous hockey personalities have said our reserve list would be highly attractive. People are staying away for different reasons.

 

[JD1]

While that is true, he didn't take the job to work under melnyk, ownership changed above him. It's not really an analogous situation to hiring somebody now, particularly given all the stuff that has happened since his departure. Anselmi was well regarded and took the job but he quit not long after. That's imo far more relevant.

Any idea why Anselmi quit?

 

[Micklebot]

Any idea why Anselmi quit?

Not sure. Might be as simple as he was no longer required given the way the Lebreton deal was going, or perhaps he saw the writing on the wall and wanted nothing to do with it. The point though was simply that Leeder sticking around for 14 years doesn't speak to whether or not we can currently attract execs. Anselmi coming in (even if it was only for a very short time) is more relevant, but for whatever reason, that's not the example he chose to point to. It we knew exactly why he left, that might be relevant too,

 

[JD1]

Not sure. Might be as simple as he was no longer required given the way the Lebreton deal was going, or perhaps he saw the writing on the wall and wanted nothing to do with it. The point though was simply that Leeder sticking around for 14 years doesn't speak to whether or not we can currently attract execs. Anselmi coming in (even if it was only for a very short time) is more relevant, but for whatever reason, that's not the example he chose to point to. It we knew exactly why he left, that might be relevant too,

Ok

So here is what is relevant

Anselmi took a job under Melnyk knowing full well the rep.

Anselmi leaving isn't relevant. It's a fact. But in the absence of an understanding why he left, it isn't relevant.

 

[Micklebot]

Ok

So here is what is relevant

Anselmi took a job under Melnyk knowing full well the rep.

Anselmi leaving isn't relevant. It's a fact. But in the absence of an understanding why he left, it isn't relevant.

At the end of the day , my point was simple, Leeder sticking around has very little relevance when discussing the ability of the team to attract execs today and more specifically, Melnyk's influence on that. I specifically pointed out that Anselmi taking the job was more relevant as a sidenote. You're right that we don't know why he quit, so we can't necessarily use that as evidence that execs aren't willing to work with Melnyk, but it also means we can't use him as an example of an exec who stuck around for an extended period despite the reputation, which was the argument being made with Leeder.

Having said that, do you think Melnyk's rep has improved, stayed the same or gotten worse since the Lebreton fiasco and all the other crap that has transpired since Anselmi accepted the job? It's certainly getting a lot more negative attention from the media in the last 2 years. I think that's a fact that probable deserves consideration when discussing whether or not Leeder sticking around has any relevance to our current ability to attract execs.

 

[swiftwin]

I think whoever comes on as POHO will eventually fire Dorion and take over himself.

lmao. not happening.

 

[Clayonator]

lmao. not happening.

I’d like to hear your reasoning

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Ok

So here is what is relevant

Anselmi took a job under Melnyk knowing full well the rep.

Anselmi leaving isn't relevant. It's a fact. But in the absence of an understanding why he left, it isn't relevant.

Ottawa management is in tip top shape. Melnyk is bringing in a POHO with no outside influence because he wants this to be the best org ever. FYOUS is soon upon us.

 

[Liver King]

If Mark Hunter doesn't get the GM job in Edmonton he should be our guy

 

[coladin]

Reputation is all about perception so there is certainly room for debate on whither Melnyk's has taken enough of a hit of late to affect the team's ability to attract execs since Leeder was here, i guess we can agree to disagree on that point but you are notably still not addressing the difference between attracting new employees vs retaining someone who was essentially a founding member of the team. It takes more to drive someone with deep roots in the team and community away than it does to prevent someone with no connection from being interested in joining.

Its also interesting that you claim things were swept under the rug when it suited fans. The media is far harsher on melnyk now than in the past. Its not fans on sportsnet, it's Burke and Maclean. This didn't happen when Leeder was here.

The list of guys we know or at least are reported to have rejected the idea of interviewing for POHO aren't soing so because the team is bad, execs don't look at short term results they look at potential and numerous hockey personalities have said our reserve list would be highly attractive. People are staying away for different reasons.

I am not notably omitting anything. There are names thrown out there about who may or may not have been approached. No one seems to know for sure. If they are interested in people whose seasons are still
active, then that may be part of it.

Melnyk has made a mess of things and the media has given him no break as of late. He used to, though, and was called “passionate” or “no. 1 fan”, or “flamboyant, or boisterous”. Now he is “embattled” and all the other negative terms that are used to describe the same person .

Yes, in the past Melnyk said dumb things, always did and that was part of his charm. Now he is a moron, embarrassing, etc...but he is the same person. He hasn’t changed so much as the supporters have.

 

[SensHulk]

Has Ron Francis already said no to the sens?

 

[Upgrayedd]

If Mark Hunter doesn't get the GM job in Edmonton he should be our guy

Isn't he reasonably sought after? You can scratch him off the list if that's the case, its been proven here in Ottawa time and time again that anyone with options avoids Gene like the plague.

 

[BatherSeason]

Melnyk has made a mess of things and the media has given him no break as of late.

The local media has gone silent on all things Melnyk once again since about a week after the trade deadline, most likely because lawsuits and losing charter access was threatened. Remember after the trade deadline when even Ian Mendes admitted that the media has enabled this man for far too long?

When you got guys like Duthie, etc, liking and retweeting clips like the Simpsons clip, and other tweets that insult the Sens organization, you must at some point have to realize that you are on the wrong side of the argument here.

 

[Liver King]

Isn't he reasonably sought after? You can scratch him off the list if that's the case, its been proven here in Ottawa time and time again that anyone with options avoids Gene like the plague.

Yeah I dont know - it's not like he has extensive GM experience and there are not many jobs available.

Guy knows prospects just seems like a good fit for a rebuild

 

[harrisb]

If Mark Hunter doesn't get the GM job in Edmonton he should be our guy

Edmonton is famous for the old boys club, I'd think Mark Hunter fits very well in that environment so I could see him being selected

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Other than Matthews and Marner who were kinda no brainers for Hunter , particularly coming out of London, what were Mark Hunters other great picks that would distinguish him? Not saying he wouldn't be a good man for the job but I am not sure he is so much better than other potential candidates. I personally don't think he'd touch Ottawa regardless.

 

[BondraTime]

Other than Matthews and Marner who were kinda no brainers for Hunter , particularly coming out of London, what were Mark Hunters other great picks that would distinguish him? Not saying he wouldn't be a good man for the job but I am not sure he is so much better than other potential candidates. I personally don't think he'd touch Ottawa regardless.

Well it's only 4 recent drafts to pull from.

Marner
Matthews
Dermott
Grundstrom
Sandin (Dubas pick more than likely)
Liljgren

Dubas seems to love his advanced stats picks, and likes taking small guys and overagers. I'd be very concerned if I were a Leafs fan about their drafting outside the 1st round. They are among the worst, if not the worst team at finding talent in the draft past the 1st 3 rounds.

The only guys they have drafted since 2010 outside of the top 3 rounds who have become NHLers are Connor Brown and Andreas Johnsson.