Salary Cap: Salary Cap + Roster Building | Every time I refresh, I panic.

[Pens1566]

I don't want them to deal Jake. I think it's the wrong move, both short and long term. If this funk keeps up, I could see McKenzie's point coming to pass in the form of a Kessel deal though.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The encouraging thing here? The impression I'm getting from these line combinations is that Crosby's line is going to be Simon-Crosby-Sprong when Sid gets back, baring any future changes. It could also be ZAR-Crosby-Rust, but I doubt that based on them using Grant with Simon and Sprong. Grant is definitely not in the lineup when everyone is healthy.

The other encouraging thing is that, at least for the time being, they've decided that smashing their faces against a brick wall over and over doesn't feel very good and pulled the plug on Malkin/Horns.

 

[Peat]

Ryan Spooner from 2014-2018 had 147 points in 246 games, which is a pace of 49 points per 82 games. It's really not a ridiculous claim to make, you can get 50 point wingers somewhat easily. Those guys may just be really bad at hockey outside of their production, just like Sam Gagner.

I didn't say it was inaccurate, just mean

That said... Spooner has a lot of those goals on the PP. You want a guy to give you what Guentzel's ES production looks like in comparison to his peers, you're talking more Zucker and Nyquist.

 

[Peat]

The encouraging thing here? The impression I'm getting from these line combinations is that Crosby's line is going to be Simon-Crosby-Sprong when Sid gets back, baring any future changes. It could also be ZAR-Crosby-Rust, but I doubt that based on them using Grant with Simon and Sprong. Grant is definitely not in the lineup when everyone is healthy.

I agree with this.

I also think Crosby-Riikola might be a better d pairing than most of the ones we've got.

The other encouraging thing is that, at least for the time being, they've decided that smashing their faces against a brick wall over and over doesn't feel very good and pulled the plug on Malkin/Horns.

Right move for now, fo' sho'.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Right move for now, fo' sho'.

Right move forever.

Totally missed the Crosby D pairing. Hey... could it actually do any WORSE?

 

[Empoleon8771]

I didn't say it was inaccurate, just mean

That said... Spooner has a lot of those goals on the PP. You want a guy to give you what Guentzel's ES production looks like in comparison to his peers, you're talking more Zucker and Nyquist.

I think Nyquist works as an example, but not Zucker. Zucker is a good 2-way player and brings some absurd speed to the table. I think you can replace Nyquist with another former Red Wing in Tatar and have that work. Guys like Gagner, Spooner and Namestnikov do rely on PP production to inflate their point totals more, but I still think they fall into the category of bad players who can produce at a top-6 rate.

I will say though, hopefully Hornqvist's work ethic rubs off on Guentzel as they're playing together. That's a great 3rd line if you have Guentzel and Brassard both engaged and grinding.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

The encouraging thing here? The impression I'm getting from these line combinations is that Crosby's line is going to be Simon-Crosby-Sprong when Sid gets back, baring any future changes. It could also be ZAR-Crosby-Rust, but I doubt that based on them using Grant with Simon and Sprong. Grant is definitely not in the lineup when everyone is healthy.

Why is Riikola sitting and Ruhwedel still in the freaking line-up!?!

 

[Peat]

Right move forever.

Totally missed the Crosby D pairing. Hey... could it actually do any WORSE?

 

[EightyOne]

Why is Riikola sitting and Ruhwedel still in the freaking line-up!?!

On the face of it, I'm not even mad. And I hate Ruhwedel.

But it's been like 8 days since Riikola's played...SEND HIM DOWN for real experience!!!

 

[NMK11]

The encouraging thing here? The impression I'm getting from these line combinations is that Crosby's line is going to be Simon-Crosby-Sprong when Sid gets back, baring any future changes. It could also be ZAR-Crosby-Rust, but I doubt that based on them using Grant with Simon and Sprong. Grant is definitely not in the lineup when everyone is healthy.

I think I could handle those lines. Waive Grant, send ZAR back down, call up someone else with some more speed/skill for the fourth and rotate them with Cullen and Sheahan.

My only real question is Dumo-Ruh? Seems like they're trying for a shut down pair there and I'm not sure if I like it to take heavy Dzone starts and give Maatta-O sheltered time, or if it seems like they're shortening our second best defender.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think I could handle those lines. Waive Grant, send ZAR back down, call up someone else with some more speed/skill for the fourth and rotate them with Cullen and Sheahan.

My only real question is Dumo-Ruh? Seems like they're trying for a shut down pair there and I'm not sure if I like it to take heavy Dzone starts and give Maatta-O sheltered time, or if it seems like they're shortening our second best defender.

They're not going to send ZAR back down, I think the best case scenario for that 4th line is ZAR-Cullen-Rust. Seeing how they actually scored some goals last game, I think you'll see that going forward for the short run too.

On defense, I don't like any of the pairs to be honest. I want to see them run with:

Maatta-Letang
Dumoulin-Johnson
Oleksiak-Ruhwedel

And heavily shelter the bottom pair. I think it may be questionable to put Johnson with Dumoulin, considering some of Dumoulin's recent performances, but they need one of Maatta or Johnson with Dumoulin IMO and Maatta dosn't play RD.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Yup. I am for real.

 

[NMK11]

They're not going to send ZAR back down, I think the best case scenario for that 4th line is ZAR-Cullen-Rust. Seeing how they actually scored some goals last game, I think you'll see that going forward for the short run too.

On defense, I don't like any of the pairs to be honest. I want to see them run with:

Maatta-Letang
Dumoulin-Johnson
Oleksiak-Ruhwedel

And heavily shelter the bottom pair. I think it may be questionable to put Johnson with Dumoulin, considering some of Dumoulin's recent performances, but they need one of Maatta or Johnson with Dumoulin IMO and Maatta dosn't play RD.

Yeah, ZAR is likely here to stay I feel, but I can dream. That line would just be so much better with Cullen/Sheahan flanked by Rust with a speed player on the other side a la DiPauli.

I'd be up for trying Maatta again with Letang. The second pair looks like it's asking to be hemmed in for entire shifts. But if the top pair works then it's a good place to slot Schultz in.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yeah, ZAR is likely here to stay I feel, but I can dream. That line would just be so much better with Cullen/Sheahan flanked by Rust with a speed player on the other side a la DiPauli.

I'd be up for trying Maatta again with Letang. The second pair looks like it's asking to be hemmed in for entire shifts. But if the top pair works then it's a good place to slot Schultz in.

Yeah, that's exactly what I'm thinking. I think Dumoulin and Johnson have good enough puck moving skills together for that pair to not get hemmed in their zone, but I'd ultimately want to see Dumoulin with Schultz as the 2nd pair. When Schultz is back, bump Johnson to the bottom pair and try to acquire a defensive puck moving RD to play with Johnson. I think both Letang and Maatta can cover some of each others weaknesses (while Johnson is really just being carried by Letang right now) and the 2nd pair is obviously good, so I don't know why it hasn't been tried yet.

 

[Tom Hanks]

The whole reason to part with a one-dimensional winger like Sheary was that we could have a rookie come in and produce his numbers easily under similar circumstances. Sprong can, and has been producing as well as anyone in the league who's been used like he has. But the coach has his head up his ass, so here we are, wondering where we can find offense to replace frickin Sheary when we don't look an inch in front of our faces.

Simon who is doing exactly what your talking about. You don’t need to look to far to see that.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Simon who is doing exactly what your talking about. You don’t need to look to far to see that.

I don't think the problem is with Simon being able to replace Sheary (although I don't think he has replaced him), I think the problem is the next guys after Simon being able to replace Simon. I don't think Simon can replace the goal scoring that Sheary brought, but he can at least come close I think. But who's going to replace what Simon provided last year? No one has yet.

 

[Peat]

So... jumping the gun massively, but if a (mostly) 1 for 1 hockey trade with Guentzel were to go down, how would people prefer it to go?

Get a more 2 way but still high impact wing?

Or see if you can find a 3D type guy?

 

[Gurglesons]

Remember when Sprong was never going to play another game? And Sullivan was smug Sully?

 

[Gurglesons]

So... jumping the gun massively, but if a (mostly) 1 for 1 hockey trade with Guentzel were to go down, how would people prefer it to go?

Get a more 2 way but still high impact wing?

Or see if you can find a 3D type guy?

I don’t even want to think about what JR would move Jake for. Jake can probably be signed for under 6 with his performance right now. That should be reason enough not to trade him.

 

[Empoleon8771]

So... jumping the gun massively, but if a (mostly) 1 for 1 hockey trade with Guentzel were to go down, how would people prefer it to go?

Get a more 2 way but still high impact wing?

Or see if you can find a 3D type guy?

I'd be trying to find a good RW fit for Crosby if we're trading Guentzel. It's the biggest long-term hole on the roster right now. I don't think it's worth trading Guentzel for a defenseman, I don't think you need a defenseman as good as what you'd get back for Guentzel.

I'd prefer to try to move Rust for that RW, though. I don't think the Penguins need a crazy good RWer for Crosby, so you could probably get a good enough player with using Rust as the main piece.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I don't think the problem is with Simon being able to replace Sheary (although I don't think he has replaced him), I think the problem is the next guys after Simon being able to replace Simon. I don't think Simon can replace the goal scoring that Sheary brought, but he can at least come close I think. But who's going to replace what Simon provided last year? No one has yet.

Yeah for sure. Simon stats are pretty good though right now. 18 goal, 45 point pace right now which matches Sheary’s goals from last year plus a bunch more assists. His advanced stats are great too. Sid and Simon are working well together. Add in Jake on that line and they get a boost again.

 

[Peat]

I'd be trying to find a good RW fit for Crosby if we're trading Guentzel. It's the biggest long-term hole on the roster right now. I don't think it's worth trading Guentzel for a defenseman, I don't think you need a defenseman as good as what you'd get back for Guentzel.

Would you marry that with trading some of the current RW stock, and if so, what sort of thing are you thinking?

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

So... jumping the gun massively, but if a (mostly) 1 for 1 hockey trade with Guentzel were to go down, how would people prefer it to go?

Get a more 2 way but still high impact wing?

Or see if you can find a 3D type guy?

In my opinion any and all resources should be devoted towards reshaping this defense first because it's a tire fire of colossal proportions that is having an impact on every other facet of the team.

That would, of course, also require shedding some of the bad to terrible contracts in this group like Maatta, Oleksiak and JJ. The last of which we're almost certainly just going to have to sit here and take for at least the remainder of this season.

 

[Tom Hanks]

So... jumping the gun massively, but if a (mostly) 1 for 1 hockey trade with Guentzel were to go down, how would people prefer it to go?

Get a more 2 way but still high impact wing?

Or see if you can find a 3D type guy?

I doubt I’d trade Jake unless it was a really great D man. It’s real hard to go past his playoff performances.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yeah for sure. Simon stats are pretty good though right now. 18 goal, 45 point pace right now which matches Sheary’s goals from last year plus a bunch more assists. His advanced stats are great too. Sid and Simon are working well together. Add in Jake on that line and they get a boost again.

Simon's play on the year is actually a part of the reason I'm a little more open to talking about trading Guentzel. Simon looks like a guy that can fit well with Crosby on his LW, but the Penguins haven't had an actual good fit for Crosby's RW ever since Dupuis retired.

Would you marry that with trading some of the current RW stock, and if so, what sort of thing are you thinking?

Yeah, I'd be trading Rust for a LW version of Rust almost immediately after that trade. Do you remember the lineup I threw out that had Guentzel-Crosby-Simon as the top line? The idea would be to try and find a RW that fits as well with Crosby as Guentzel does, which would allow Simon to be playing his normal side. It's probably super difficult to find a RWer like that, to the point where I probably wouldn't find a guy I'd trade Guentzel for, but it would be my plan. If you're going to trade someone who fits as well with Crosby as Guentzel does, it has to be for someone else who is going to fit with Crosby IMO.