Empoleon8771
Registered User
I'd like this from what I've read on Fangraphs:
The Manager’s Perspective: Derek Shelton on Managerial Philosophy
The idea that the Pirates could or even should have traded Bell is a farce. I don't actually think you are trolling, but I really wish that you were. There is not one analogous example that is even in the same stratosphere of what you seemingly want to have happened, given where Bell is in his contract cycle. (And this doesn't even begin to address what is the underlying premise of your complaint, which is that Bell completely sucks and somehow the Pirates should have keyed into this fact, and gotten a superstar return for him after 5 legendary weeks... even going full-cynical on Bell, this just isn't a realistic idea).
I'd still be skeptical, but I don't absolutely have a problem with the notion of trading Bell in the right move, in some measure because I am pretty high on Jose Osuna. What I take issue with is that there was somehow a trade to be had for Bell this summer.
In general I am extremely skeptical of the idea of stacking prospects, because I think that the teams who had success in doing that and winning World Series also ended up spending significantly to supplement their team, on top of having a good amount of luck. And especially when you historicize what has happened and how the game has totally transformed from when the Astros and Cubs, for example, started to stockpile talent and tank up to now, I just don't think there are obvious answers to certain questions.
The Pirates approach which emphasizes caution above all else (and probably will do so even more going forward, given how badly they failed when they threw caution out the window to get Archer) is obviously an abysmal failure. But I don't think there's a royal road to making a contender. In fact, San Diego will be a pretty good litmus test for this in the next year or two.
IMO, the most important thing that happens this offseason is what kind of pitching philosophy they implement, and how that philosophy will get more out of the talent they have in the organization. I would rank spending money on a catcher as the second most important, and bolstering the starting pitching as a close third, then the new manager and whatever else. Obviously, from just an ideal perspective, the team very much needs a better rotation anchor, doubly so with Taillon gone, and in some sense I could just quickly rattle off what I'd take as important: 1) fix pitching philosophy, 2) sign Grandal, 3) sign Wheeler. I don't really think that even with the most optimistic outlook imaginable for Archer, Musgrove, Keller... that it's the dream rotation for a playoff series.
But at the end of the day, my attitude remains that it's pretty easy to slam the Pirates given how things played out, and I'm more or less fine being cavalier and writing off the post-ASB nightmare. We'll see how much of a clean break can be made, and in think an underrated story to watch will be whether the bullpen can be turned into a weapon again. Everything to getting on some kind of track emanates out of the pitcher-catcher situation. We could get Max Scherzer and we'd still be in extreme trouble if the catching duo was Diaz and Stallings.
I think selling high on Bell is a good idea, assuming there is some team out there that is willing to bite. I think whether that team actually exists is a valid question, though. I mean, we aren't the only ones with access to splits.
I'd also be open to trading Marte, Kela, or anyone else not named Reynolds, Newman, and maybe Taillon. I think they should start as fresh as possible with a new core, new manager, new pitching coach...and new owner.
Yeah, I don't support selling just to sell, though. They'd have to get some value in return. I don't think most of the pitchers would get much in return at the moment, so might as well see if a new pitching coach/strategy can 'fix' some of these guys. If they for some reason did, see ya.In a selloff as you describe, I think Frazier would also have value. He's a slightly above-average second baseman with 3 years of control left.
However, I wouldn't trade Musgrove/Williams and I'd still bring back Archer. You'd hope with a new pitching coach 2/3 of those would be able to rehabilitate their value substantially. Only Musgrove would fetch anything material right now. Also, there'd be no value in trading Taillon now when he's not going to pitch 1 inning next year. May as well trade him next winter if the Pirates are still in rebuilding mode and he looks like he'll be ready for opening day '21.
I'm an extreme skeptic about Craig – I just don't see the offense in the way that I'd like – but it could be interesting if he has a good spring training and forces his way into a bench role. Overall, I still lean against the idea of trading Bell, largely because I wonder what his value really would be, and I think there still is a gear there in terms of consistency. To put it in other terms, I'd wager he will have at least as much value in any deal at next year's deadline or next winter, so I'm in no hurry to shuffle him off.
If somebody like Craig or Osuna, or eventually even Cruz, starts to force the issue, then I think you explore the option more fully, but the main attention right now on the team needs to be adding pitchers and adding a catcher, not subtracting or manipulating other positions. This is incredibly cliche, but things tend to work themselves out in terms of playing time, etc., so I'd just be continuing to evaluate where players are and what the assessment of the players coming up behind them is. You ideally want to be dealing from positions of strength, not positions of, "well, this team can't immediately win the division for sure, so we should tinker." I don't think anyone here is saying that, but that's my worry with getting too speculative about moving Bell (or Marte, or Archer, etc).
I'm still insanely high on Hayes. I think the bat will continue to come, and I'd like to see us give him the opportunity to break camp with the team, although I would assume his timeframe is going to be more like early June. Again, maybe a good spring training forces the issue somewhat. Lord knows we still need better infield defense besides Newman.