Prospect and Marlies Thread: 2017 - 2018 (continued)

[Mikeyg]

Mikey. Babcock a week ago said that if Dermott was a RD, he would have made the team out of training camp. He was ready. He became a victim of Babs obsession with handedness on D.

Dude that doesn't even matter, in September borgy was straight up better. Out of rosen borg and dermott, It really isn't reasonable to say that dermott was the best out of them during that time, he really wasn't. He improved vastly over the last 5 months.

 

[Mr Hockey]

Of course he is but there are some alarm bells for sure. He has Kapanen at 10th in the draft ahead of Nylander then when the leafs acquired him suddenly he was not going to be an NHL player? Wtf?

Kappy was rated high...

NHL CSS 2014 International skaters midterm rankings

 

[nobody]

You called him biased against Leaf players, I just showed you proof he isn't with the 2016 list.

Once again, I don't care about his rankings. Listen to the guy or watch his Leafs segments. He isn't too fond of the Leafs. Just because he put a bunch of names together and included Leafs prospects doesn't change anything. Anyway, I'm done talking about Button. He's not worth the time.

 

[nobody]

Kappy was rated high...

NHL CSS 2014 International skaters midterm rankings

That's what he's saying. Kapanen was ranked very high even by Button before the draft. He was even a good prospect when he was with the Pens but all of a sudden Button soured on him while he was with the Marlies (putting up almost PPG #s). Anyway, this conversation is a waste, unless you are Craig's PR staff. Move on from the topic.

Lilly is a very good player and he's going to be a great player. We have the luxury of slowly bringing him along if need be but I think he's going to hit his stride massively before the end of this year going into the playoffs. Being injured certainly doesn't help his case in-terms of building consistency but hopefully he'll have better luck going forward.

 

[saltming]

Kappy was rated high...

NHL CSS 2014 International skaters midterm rankings

That's the point, he was rated high even by button until we acquired him. Then he would never make the NHL

 

[saltming]

That's what he's saying. Kapanen was ranked very high even by Button before the draft. He was even a good prospect when he was with the Pens but all of a sudden Button soured on him while he was with the Marlies (putting up almost PPG #s). Anyway, this conversation is a waste, unless you are Craig's PR staff. Move on from the topic.

Lilly is a very good player and he's going to be a great player. We have the luxury of slowly bringing him along if need be but I think he's going to hit his stride massively before the end of this year going into the playoffs. Being injured certainly doesn't help his case in-terms of building consistency but hopefully he'll have better luck going forward.

I have to agree about Lily. I think the injuries are due to being a kid in a man's league and if that's so I hope we are very careful and take our time like they did with Bracco and all the off ice training to start the year.
Good bet our coaching and development teams are going to turn this kid into a stud

 

[Mr Hockey]

That's what he's saying. Kapanen was ranked very high even by Button before the draft. He was even a good prospect when he was with the Pens but all of a sudden Button soured on him while he was with the Marlies (putting up almost PPG #s). Anyway, this conversation is a waste, unless you are Craig's PR staff. Move on from the topic.

Lilly is a very good player and he's going to be a great player. We have the luxury of slowly bringing him along if need be but I think he's going to hit his stride massively before the end of this year going into the playoffs. Being injured certainly doesn't help his case in-terms of building consistency but hopefully he'll have better luck going forward.

Lots of players are drafted high and then take an immediate nose dive, happens. Lilly is a very "raw" talent, that is why the Marlies kept him under there watchful eye. I believe if he played in the SHL he may have comeback next season with more bad habits.

 

[Mr Hockey]

That's the point, he was rated high even by button until we acquired him. Then he would never make the NHL

I have heard babcock describe Kappy's play the last two seasons, and from what I get Babs thinks he is inconsistent, doesn't play hard every game, he says the same about Levio. I am sure that influences Buttons opinions.

 

[saltming]

I have heard babcock describe Kappy's play the last two seasons, and from what I get Babs thinks he is inconsistent, doesn't play hard every game, he says the same about Levio. I am sure that influences Buttons opinions.

Same was said about Nylander and almost every prospect ever
Consistency ous part of learning to be a pro
Leivo has or doesn't have the skating Babcock wants

 

[Scott Malkinson]

Dude that doesn't even matter, in September borgy was straight up better. Out of rosen borg and dermott, It really isn't reasonable to say that dermott was the best out of them during that time, he really wasn't. He improved vastly over the last 5 months.

Travis was definitely better than Borgman and especially Rosen.

He got sent down because of circumstance.

 

[Mr Hockey]

Travis was definitely better than Borgman and especially Rosen.

He got sent down because of circumstance.

what were the circumstances?

 

[Kiwi]

what were the circumstances?

The first one I can think of is that we're trying to look good by playing those overseas guys we brought in so that other guys overseas will want to sign with us

That's the only reason I can think of Rosen got a game or two, he's pretty brutal

 

[Mr Hockey]

The first one I can think of is that we're trying to look good by playing those overseas guys we brought in so that other guys overseas will want to sign with us

That's the only reason I can think of Rosen got a game or two, he's pretty brutal

Rosen is actually pretty decent on the Marlies. I think our d'men call ups went something like this:

• Borgman ~ made the team from camp
• Marincin
• Rosen
• Polak
• Marincin
  
• Dermott

 

[LeafChief]

Liljegren is a top talent. Anyone that says otherwise is confused.

 

[Mikeyg]

Travis was definitely better than Borgman and especially Rosen.

He got sent down because of circumstance.

You guys are trying to pump this dumb narrative that just isn't correct.... rosen borgman and dermott ALL SHOOT LEFT!!!!!! yet he was clearly ranked third as evident by the fact that rosen and borg got games before he did. It isn't a bad thing guys....

ala fox sports:
Calle Rosen
Defense | Toronto Maple Leafs

Stick Hand

Left

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Andreas Borgman
Defense | Toronto Maple Leafs

Stick Hand

Left

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

#23 | Travis Dermott
Defense | Toronto Maple Leafs

Stick Hand

Left

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

So cut the crap. Think about what you are arguing against right now.... Our 21 year old dman needed another 5 months to get to a top 4 level... who actually cares? But hopefully you guys can put your silly argument to rest.

 

[biotk]

It is funny that you act like you watch a lot of Marlies, but clearly with the assessment that Liljegren is 3rd pairing bordering on their number 7 D, you either don't watch them or are biased to the point of ridiculousness. I watch quite a few Marlies games and Liljegren has looked good, and getting better all the time.

Pretty much. Having watched the Marlies several games this year my assessment is inline with Wheeler's recent piece for the athletic.

His assessment of the D's play this year (their play, not their potential, and as part of assessing all the Marlies players)

He had Dermott easily as their #1 D.
Marincin, Liljegren and Holl were a step below.
Rosen was several steps below that and then the rest of the D with Nielsen rock bottom.

Of Liljegren, Wheeler said that concerns about his defensive play have been dispelled. Of Rosen, Wheeler said that he has been prone to poor decision making and turnovers. Essentially said he needs a D partner to babysit him defensively, and often Liljegren has taken on that role.

 

[Kiwi]

Rosen is actually pretty decent on the Marlies. I think our d'men call ups went something like this:

• Borgman ~ made the team from camp
• Marincin
• Rosen
• Polak
• Marincin
  
• Dermott

We've called up Dermott Valiev Marincin and Holl from the Marlies in the last 40 games this season instead of Rosen

He's at least behind all them and it's not surprising, he can skate but he's atrocious defensively, think Gardiner type brain cramps without the good stuff

He makes Marincin look like a Norris winner by comparison

 

[Mr Hockey]

We've called up Dermott Valiev Marincin and Holl from the Marlies in the last 40 games this season instead of Rosen

He's at least behind all them and it's not surprising, he can skate but he's atrocious defensively, think Gardiner type brain cramps without the good stuff

He makes Marincin look like a Norris winner by comparison

Marincin is like Chara in AHL, very dominate. Rosen has nice skill set, and he leads all Marlies d'men with shots on goal, he is not that bad lol

 

[Kiwi]

Marincin is like Chara in AHL, very dominate. Rosen has nice skill set, and he leads all Marlies d'men with shots on goal, he is not that bad lol

He's a train wreck no matter how many shots on goal he has

Unless he has a come to Jesus moment defensively he's not playing in the NHL

 

[horner]

We have nobody in Buttons Top 50 NHL-affiliated prospects...

Cupboard is stocked for up-and-coming Canucks - Article - TSN

Dermot isn't listed on our top 5 when did he make this list last wk ?
Neilson # 3 on our list don't think so.

Valimaki was drafted on spot ahead of ljiligren and is 18 on his list wow.

Button is a duffass

 

[Muston Atthews]

We've called up Dermott Valiev Marincin and Holl from the Marlies in the last 40 games this season instead of Rosen

He's at least behind all them and it's not surprising, he can skate but he's atrocious defensively, think Gardiner type brain cramps without the good stuff

He makes Marincin look like a Norris winner by comparison

I wouldn’t go as far to say that those defenseman are ahead of him besides Dermott. Valiev was called up to sit in the pressbox for a few days while we needed a warm body we wouldn’t miss is the minors, Marincin was given his last chance with the Leafs and failed miserably and Holl is a RHD who filled in after our top 2 “RHD” went down with injury/sickness. I’m assuming the Leafs don’t want to yo-yo a guy they obviously thought had potential to start the year

 

[Walshy7]

Of course he is but there are some alarm bells for sure. He has Kapanen at 10th in the draft ahead of Nylander then when the leafs acquired him suddenly he was not going to be an NHL player? Wtf?

lets not forget button also said. "with adam brooks coming he would trade nylander" AND "if the leafs won the vesey sweepstakes nylander would of been out the door". Why people think he is a good scout is beyond me he is far too biased

 

[horner]

He's a train wreck no matter how many shots on goal he has

Unless he has a come to Jesus moment defensively he's not playing in the NHL

I agree.
Someone said that he was better than Borgman wow.
If he was any good someone would picked him up by know.

 

[saltming]

lets not forget button also said. "with adam brooks coming he would trade nylander" AND "if the leafs won the vesey sweepstakes nylander would of been out the door". Why people think he is a good scout is beyond me he is far too biased

Ya those Nylander comments were hilarious.
I'm not sure how leafs fans in particular can't see it

 

[Orfieus]

If Lilly was playing in the CHL like most of the guys on buttons list, he would be absolutely killing it. His skating alone would make him a threat in the OHL. Button simply doesn't like Leafs prospects for whatever reason. This was the same guy that questioned the Matthews pick over Laine and he wouldn't give Willie an inch of credit when he was tearing up the SHL and the AHL. The only Leafs prospect that's got any kind of love from Button in recent memory has been Mitch and that was after he absolutely lit up the Memorial cup. This same idiot also went on the radio multiple times claiming that Kasperi Kapanen didn't have it in him to be an NHL player. He was going to be a bust... And we all know how well that prediction has been working out for Button.

Timmeh is the youngest D-man in the AHL by a country mile. The kid had to learn how to play on the smaller rink with less time to maneuver with his skating. His offense has already been pretty damn good for someone his age in the AHL and he has missed countless opportunities on picking up the 2nd assists. His biggest flaw is his defensive game. He needs to understand how to keep opponents in front of him rather let them walk by. His pivots still need a ton of work and he is still prone to making absolutely boneheaded passes atleast once a game. BUT he's only 18. There's no other player in his situation right now. He might not be primed to make the jump in the next season or two but long term, Timmeh is going to be a big part of the Leafs.

Button also said, over and over, that Kap isn't an NHL player. To inconsistent. I used to have a high opinion of him but between these asinine lists, his opinion on players and his appearances on Overdrive I want him off of TSN and working with ESPN where he belongs

edit: looks like someone pointed out Buttons views on Kap. I would delete this msg but I have no idea how