Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread - I'd rather be your cocoon

[Freeptop]

Listen,
I would LOVE to have a proper fitting, system working, dedicated, try his best, noncancerous, goal scoring Kovalchuk here too. Don't you think he would already be locked down by another team _unless_ there is something wrong - or just straight up too much to gamble on bringing him in?

LA didn't even look to trade him ( or did they? ). They just fired his ass and let some other club deal with him with LA having no strings attached to Kovalchuk.

Something just doesn't seem right. I just don't want to risk bringing him in, but I'm fighting myself... the fanboy in me wants him, but I just get Kessel vibes all over again like (I think) @Tom Hanks said earlier.

I believe they did try to trade him, but at a $6.25M cap hit that continued through next season as well (which was signed at 35, so comes with all sorts of fun cap implications), no other team was going to touch that, even if the Kings retained the maximum 50% of his salary.

On a one-year deal, the 35+ cap provisions don't apply, and at this point, he wouldn't be expected to get even half of what his previous contract was paying, so yes, I can see how some teams would be willing to take a chance there.

Personally, I don't see much reason for it to be the Pens, though.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Long term discussion. Schultz is officially a goner now right? Marino is the long term 2nd pair RD. What does that do to the rest of our D core going forward?

Dumoulin - Letang - Balanced all situations pair
Pettersson - Marino - Balanced all situations pair
JMFJ - ????

Riikola and Ruhwedel are the two in house options. We probably need an upgrade on that right? A RHS #5 who can move the puck so JJ doesn't try it is preferable. Maybe Riikola can fill that role on his off side like he did for large portions of last season, but HCMS seems dead set on not playing the guy. Anyone in the system ready to come up?

Letting Schultz walk, along with Chucky and presumably trading Bjugstad gives us a nice slice of cap space to sign our RFAs and even bring in some outside help at LW.

I think you need another Pettersson or Marino type of defenseman to put on the 3rd pair. You need a mobile 2-way defenseman who is capable of moving the puck. I think JJ's pair should be used as more of a defensive pair, with eating some minutes against 2nd and 3rd lines. I think you need another Marino or Pettersson to do that.

Riikola does play that style, he is a mobile 2-way guy who is capable of moving the puck. The problem is that he's not very good, they need a better version of Riikola.

 

[Riptide]

Long term discussion. Schultz is officially a goner now right? Marino is the long term 2nd pair RD. What does that do to the rest of our D core going forward?

Dumoulin - Letang - Balanced all situations pair
Pettersson - Marino - Balanced all situations pair
JMFJ - ????

Riikola and Ruhwedel are the two in house options. We probably need an upgrade on that right? A RHS #5 who can move the puck so JJ doesn't try it is preferable. Maybe Riikola can fill that role on his off side like he did for large portions of last season, but HCMS seems dead set on not playing the guy. Anyone in the system ready to come up?

Letting Schultz walk, along with Chucky and presumably trading Bjugstad gives us a nice slice of cap space to sign our RFAs and even bring in some outside help at LW.

I think Schultz and one of Riikola/JJ will be gone this summer. Schultz's injuries, overall play (and Marino's emergence) and reasonably expected cap hit for next season (aka he's not signing for 3m) will dictate this. As for JJ/Rikkola, given how JJ has been playing, that's looking like Riikola. Ruh will stick around as the #6/7 depending on how much cap space we have to get a different #3RD, but I expect him to fall to the #7 spot.

I would expect our blueline to be Letang, Dumoulin, Marino and MP. Then 2 of JJ, Riikola and Ruh, with potentially (hopefully) a decent 3RD in there as well.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I'm not sure Kovalchuk can be any more tainted than he already was.
I mean... I just don't see him fitting the aggregate. I think it would be a Kessel thing again... do you think Kovalchuk would fit in with Sid or Geno?

Oh, off-ice question, I think he gets on well with Geno or am I mistaken? If not... bringing him in would piss off Geno AGAIN after last season. I just don't know. Like I said, too risky to be worth it.

I 100% think Kovalchuk would fit perfectly with Geno and that's the spot for him. Jake lives on Sid's LW, with Rust and Geno being a thing again and hopefully staying there, that left wing spot will be a merry go round of whatever by the staff again.

And Kovalchuk vs Kessel is a bad comparison, Kovalchuk isn't some god awful defensive player, he's not a world beater there, but it's not like he doesn't put in effort there and the guy goes into traffic areas still. I think it's clear you didn't watch him on the Kings much at all lately.


Off ice - Kovalchuk is the guy that got Malkin and Ovechkin to sit down and hash out their beef. He's good friends with both.

What a horrible locker room guy, huh?

 

[ColePens]

I 100% think Kovalchuk would fit perfectly with Geno and that's the spot for him. Jake lives on Sid's LW, with Rust and Geno being a thing again and hopefully staying there, that left wing spot will be a merry go round of whatever by the staff again.

And Kovalchuk vs Kessel is a bad comparison, Kovalchuk isn't some god awful defensive player, he's not a world beater there, but it's not like he doesn't put in effort there and the guy goes into traffic areas still. I think it's clear you didn't watch him on the Kings much at all lately.

I personally do not think Kovy would fit. What works for Geno right now is fast/annoying players. I'd keep Rusty with him 24/7 and go from there.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think Schultz and one of Riikola/JJ will be gone this summer. Schultz's injuries, overall play (and Marino's emergence) and reasonably expected cap hit for next season (aka he's not signing for 3m) will dictate this. As for JJ/Rikkola, given how JJ has been playing, that's looking like Riikola. Ruh will stick around as the #6/7 depending on how much cap space we have to get a different #3RD, but I expect him to fall to the #7 spot.

I would expect our blueline to be Letang, Dumoulin, Marino and MP. Then 2 of JJ, Riikola and Ruh, with potentially (hopefully) a decent 3RD in there as well.

Honestly, I don't even see JJ vs Riikola as a debate. They're 100% going to keep JJ over Riikola, because JJ has been good this year and Riikola hasn't shown any signs of progression with the Penguins.

What sucks is that Riikola has everything you want out of a D partner for JJ, he's a guy who can handle himself defensively, skates with the puck well, has a good outlet pass, has a rocket of a shot and seems to have decent offensive instincts. He just can't put out consistent results despite that.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I personally do not think Kovy would fit. What works for Geno right now is fast/annoying players. I'd keep Rusty with him 24/7 and go from there.

Rust with Geno is the fast and pesky guy that has a solid 2-way game in him, the left side needs a smart offensive hockey IQ which we really don't have outside of Guentzel, for that side. Someone that can also hold the puck and know when to pass it and when to shoot. McCann literally just whips a shot even when he shouldn't and might actually be the smart play for the 3C spot than Geno's LW.

I think Kovalchuk could fit, I seem to be the only one to feel that way though.

 

[LOGiK]

I 100% think Kovalchuk would fit perfectly with Geno and that's the spot for him. Jake lives on Sid's LW, with Rust and Geno being a thing again and hopefully staying there, that left wing spot will be a merry go round of whatever by the staff again.

And Kovalchuk vs Kessel is a bad comparison, Kovalchuk isn't some god awful defensive player, he's not a world beater there, but it's not like he doesn't put in effort there and the guy goes into traffic areas still. I think it's clear you didn't watch him on the Kings much at all lately.

“It’s going to be interesting over the next couple of months to watch Lou figure out what to do. I’ve never seen anything like this in my 18 years here,” veteran forward Patrik Elias said. “No question it’s going to affect the team. You can question his defensive play, but offensively Kovy was a key guy. He was putting up the numbers.”

It's obvious I didn't try to claim i watched him. I even said earlier I didn't watch him enough to know about him. Although anyone claiming to figure him out by watching highlight reels is pretty weak. Who here can even claim to have watched him and the Kings play on a consistent basis? I'd have to wager, nobody. Which again, there lies the rub, nobody can confidently take him on without knowing the risks...

 

[Gurglesons]

I personally do not think Kovy would fit. What works for Geno right now is fast/annoying players. I'd keep Rusty with him 24/7 and go from there.

I don’t think that it is a sure fire fit, but at league minimum there is little risks and unlike Kessel you can easily scratch him.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

“It’s going to be interesting over the next couple of months to watch Lou figure out what to do. I’ve never seen anything like this in my 18 years here,” veteran forward Patrik Elias said. “No question it’s going to affect the team. You can question his defensive play, but offensively Kovy was a key guy. He was putting up the numbers.”

It's obvious I didn't try to claim i watched him. I even said earlier I didn't watch him enough to know about him. Although anyone claiming to figure him out by watching highlight reels is pretty weak. Who here can even claim to have watched him and the Kings play on a consistent basis? I'd have to wager, nobody. Which again, there lies the rub, nobody can confidently take him on without knowing the risks...

I catch Kings games because my brother lives in SD and is a season ticket holder, so we mostly talk shit about hockey and how he's somehow a Kings fan now the last 5yrs because he lives in California, as well as a close good friend that's also a Kings fan, but he mostly just rambles on about how he hates Sharks fans so I never really talk to him about the Kings. So I unfortunately see a fair amount of Kings games and why I have had a desire to want Kempe on the Pens for a couple of seasons now.

You are aware you can watch other teams right? Geographically, I am in the West, when the Pens aren't playing, the sports channels here show a lot of WC games, I have also caught a ton of Avs games the last couple of years and at this point I would say I probably watch at least 60 games of Western teams a season to fill my Penguins hockey withdrawal on their days off, like their current 2 days off, I'll probably be watching whatever team is on...likely a WC team since I only put the effort in to stream Pens games.

 

[LOGiK]

Off ice - Kovalchuk is the guy that got Malkin and Ovechkin to sit down and hash out their beef. He's good friends with both.

What a horrible locker room guy, huh?

Thats a +

Not saying he would be a badfit. Just that I don't know. I'm here openly saying I don't know.
I used to watch him more frequently 10 years ago and his incredibly olympic shootout vs Oshie... nothing recently though, no.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Kovalchuk is the perfect fit...if we had a different coach. We already have one one-way scoring winger playing less than 10 minutes/game. He would definitely become the second. In Mike Sullivan's world, players like Alex Galchenyuk and Ilya Kovalchuk are not as valuable as players like Zach Aston-Reese and Teddy Blueger (no matter what the scoring stats, reputations, salary and pedigree say).

So I think all of this is a moot point. JR could be kicking the tires but knowing his own coach will probably make him gun-shy on this one.

I actually would not touch the Guentzel-Malkin-Rust line for anything, no matter who is coming back from injury and when. I would be looking for a winger or two to play with 87. Maybe even just the one, because McCann could fill that other hole (or even Simon, maybe).

Kovalchuk would definitely be a force on our power play, but that is only if Sullivan sees him as a first PP guy. So far, Sullivan sees Galchenyuk as a fourth liner and a second PP guy, so I don't have a lot of faith here.

As a top-nine winger and first PP guy, I would love Kovalchuk. As a fourth-line winger, no thanks.

 

[LOGiK]

I catch Kings games because my brother lives in SD and is a season ticket holder, so we mostly talk **** about hockey and how he's somehow a Kings fan now the last 5yrs because he lives in California, as well as a close good friend that's also a Kings fan, but he mostly just rambles on about how he hates Sharks fans so I never really talk to him about the Kings. So I unfortunately see a fair amount of Kings games and why I have had a desire to want Kempe on the Pens for a couple of seasons now.

You are aware you can watch other teams right? Geographically, I am in the West, when the Pens aren't playing, the sports channels here show a lot of WC games, I have also caught a ton of Avs games the last couple of years and at this point I would say I probably watch at least 60 games of Western teams a season to fill my Penguins hockey withdrawal on their days off, like their current 2 days off, I'll probably be watching whatever team is on...likely a WC team since I only put the effort in to stream Pens games.

I don't doubt you watch other teams, but I unabashedly do not claim to watch a dead last, atrocious team the last 2 or so seasons consistently enough to confidently say Kovalchuk would be a fit here.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Honestly, I don't even see JJ vs Riikola as a debate. They're 100% going to keep JJ over Riikola, because JJ has been good this year and Riikola hasn't shown any signs of progression with the Penguins.

What sucks is that Riikola has everything you want out of a D partner for JJ, he's a guy who can handle himself defensively, skates with the puck well, has a good outlet pass, has a rocket of a shot and seems to have decent offensive instincts. He just can't put out consistent results despite that.

Agree with all. So, if we need another Pettersson/Marino type for the #5, preferrably right handed, who is your guy? I'd love to go after a Schultz/Niskanen type reclamation project. Give me a guy who has #3 potential, is but has lost confidence and is on an affordable deal, and build him back up in a sheltered role.

 

[LOGiK]

I don’t think that it is a sure fire fit, but at league minimum there is little risks and unlike Kessel you can easily scratch him.

Isn't that the inherent risk though? He is quoted saying he can not wait to get back on the ice. So if he gets right back into another LA scratch situation wouldn't you think he'd put up a stink about it?

 

[Empoleon8771]

Agree with all. So, if we need another Pettersson/Marino type for the #5, preferrably right handed, who is your guy? I'd love to go after a Schultz/Niskanen type reclamation project. Give me a guy who has #3 potential, is but has lost confidence and is on an affordable deal, and build him back up in a sheltered role.

In terms of reasonable targets, I'd look at Dylan DeMelo as the primary target. Good skater and puck mover, and I'm pretty sure he's more of a 2-way defenseman than anything. He both kills penalties and plays on the PP. He's a pending UFA after the year and I can't reasonably see him making more than $2.5-$3 million a year. He's playing middle pair minutes with Ottawa right now and giving good results, but it's still Ottawa.

I'd offer him 3 years at $3 million and see if he'd bite on it. I'd consider him a borderline #4/5 D, but if someone sees him as more than that, I can see a team throwing a nice offer at him.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Kovalchuk is El Stinko. He's old, he has back issues, he's selfish, and he's quit on two teams now. I have no desire to even try it out.

Again, we just rid ourselves of a selfish guy who had a dramatic ripple effect on this team's ability to play as a cohesive unit. No reason to bring in another guy like that just because he's Russian and has had a good NHL career (in which he hasn't been an impact guy since 2012-13).

Pony up and go after a guy who will be a significant player for us for years to come.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Agree with all. So, if we need another Pettersson/Marino type for the #5, preferrably right handed, who is your guy? I'd love to go after a Schultz/Niskanen type reclamation project. Give me a guy who has #3 potential, is but has lost confidence and is on an affordable deal, and build him back up in a sheltered role.

I don't think the debate should be Johnson vs. Riikola. I think the debate should be Riikola vs. Ruhwedel. I like Ruhwedel as a No. 7, and he is certainly a team-first player, but I really do not agree that he should be playing ahead of Riikola. When injuries hit on the right side of the defense, Marino and Riikola really held things together for us for a few games. I thought Riikola was playing inspired hockey. Then, he fumbled one play and was not able to get the puck out of the zone one time (I can't remember, it might have been against the Islanders) and then we basically have not seen him since. It was one time where a right-handed shot would have made the play and he could not. Meanwhile, he can make so many other plays that guys like Ruhwedel and Trotman simply do not have the talent to do.

Also, the coach seemed adamant that he had to have three lefties and three righties, which was the main reason why suddenly Riikola was sitting. Then we see both Letang and now Marino playing left defenseman ever since Brian Dumoulin went down, so so much for that theory.

It is a bit frustrating because there is no doubt in my mind that Riikola is more than a No. 7 D in the NHL. I honestly think we could trade Schultz today and not really miss much with Riikola in the lineup full time.

Anyway, there are plenty of candidates to replace Schultz out there. I think the main thing is cheap contracts because Marino is clearly going to be a top-4 guy for a long, long time.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Kovalchuk is El Stinko. He's old, he has back issues, he's selfish, and he's quit on two teams now. I have no desire to even try it out.

Again, we just rid ourselves of a selfish guy who had a dramatic ripple effect on this team's ability to play as a cohesive unit. No reason to bring in another guy like that just because he's Russian and has had a good NHL career (in which he hasn't been an impact guy since 2012-13).

Pony up and go after a guy who will be a significant player for us for years to come.

I completely disagree with your assessment of Kovalchuk, but I do agree with your final statement.

Basically, JR needs to acquire a forward who is such a slam dunk for this lineup that even Mike Sullivan would not bat an eye at playing him regularly, in all situations.

And yes, ideally this player would also help transition away from the Crosby/Malkin era...eventually.

This task of finding said player is definitely worthy of a Hall-of-Fame GM. Good luck, JR.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Just thinking out loud, I wonder how easy it would be for the Penguins to sign Chris Tanev as a free agent to be the bottom pair RD with Johnson. Tanev is a defense only guy with mediocre puck moving talent, but I feel like a JJ-Tanev pair could legitimately be used as a shutdown pair if JJ continues to play like he has this year. The issue is that Tanev makes $4.5 million a year right now and I really doubt he'd take a paycut.

Or what you could also do is keep Marino on LD, have Dumoulin-Tanev as your shutdown 2nd pair and see if Pettersson could play RD on the bottom pair with Johnson.

 

[LOGiK]

Kovalchuk is El Stinko. He's old, he has back issues, he's selfish, and he's quit on two teams now. I have no desire to even try it out.

Again, we just rid ourselves of a selfish guy who had a dramatic ripple effect on this team's ability to play as a cohesive unit. No reason to bring in another guy like that just because he's Russian and has had a good NHL career (in which he hasn't been an impact guy since 2012-13).

Pony up and go after a guy who will be a significant player for us for years to come.

Your late to the party bub. See the first two pages of this thread and even the other thread Hanks and others pretty much voiced (the same) concerns over him.

 

[LOGiK]

I completely disagree with your assessment of Kovalchuk, but I do agree with your final statement.

Basically, JR needs to acquire a forward who is such a slam dunk for this lineup that even Mike Sullivan would not bat an eye at playing him regularly, in all situations.

And yes, ideally this player would also help transition away from the Crosby/Malkin era...eventually.

This task of finding said player is definitely worthy of a Hall-of-Fame GM. Good luck, JR.

But why is he still out there then - even for this long - and not scooped up immediately if he is such an asset? There are quiet a few teams that could use what he has to offer.

Unless....

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I don't doubt you watch other teams, but I unabashedly do not claim to watch a dead last, atrocious team the last 2 or so seasons consistently enough to confidently say Kovalchuk would be a fit here.

If you've seen a player that you're a fan of for most of his career and then catch about 20-30 of the 81 games he's played since he's been back, I think I can comment on the player.

I still remember the young stars all star game that Kovalchuk was on, he was picking corners with such pin point accuracy and lazerbeam shots, I still can't shake that.

Also that Crosby finger point, lol.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Kovalchuk is the perfect fit...if we had a different coach. We already have one one-way scoring winger playing less than 10 minutes/game. He would definitely become the second. In Mike Sullivan's world, players like Alex Galchenyuk and Ilya Kovalchuk are not as valuable as players like Zach Aston-Reese and Teddy Blueger (no matter what the scoring stats, reputations, salary and pedigree say).

So I think all of this is a moot point. JR could be kicking the tires but knowing his own coach will probably make him gun-shy on this one.

I actually would not touch the Guentzel-Malkin-Rust line for anything, no matter who is coming back from injury and when. I would be looking for a winger or two to play with 87. Maybe even just the one, because McCann could fill that other hole (or even Simon, maybe).

Kovalchuk would definitely be a force on our power play, but that is only if Sullivan sees him as a first PP guy. So far, Sullivan sees Galchenyuk as a fourth liner and a second PP guy, so I don't have a lot of faith here.

As a top-nine winger and first PP guy, I would love Kovalchuk. As a fourth-line winger, no thanks.

I get you calling out ZAR, but I will not stand for you calling out Blueger.

Blueger is a solid NHL player.
ZAR is not.

 

[Your Boy Troy]

But why is he still out there then - even for this long - and not scooped up immediately if he is such an asset? There are quiet a few teams that could use what he has to offer.

Unless....

I’m indifferent to signing Kovalchuk, but this is a complete bullshit conjecture. He could possibly be weighing his options prior to signing. I do not know whether there is any interest in him at league minimum; you sure as hell don’t know what the circumstances are to why he hasn’t signed.