Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap: The Trades We'd Make Before The Play Offs

[dogthateats]

Would you trade 1OV and Murray for 3 and 5? Maybe they have to take JJ as a cap dump. I don't know if 1st OA gets you 3 and 5. Maybe it does, but maybe you can do for 3rd overall and a Logan Brown 1 OA and JJ.

If you get 1OA and you do trade it to Ottawa I'd want Stutzle and Jaime Drysdale

I don't know because I don't have a really firm grasp on the value of draft picks or how deep this draft is. I was just browsing through recent drafts and seeing the caliber of players drafted in the 3 through 10ish range and comparing them to the 1st OA. I kind of cherry picked the 2017 draft, bc I have heard a lot of people mention that the 2020 draft was deep.

 

[EVGENIMERLIN]

Yes, I would do that deal. That would be a very good move for us. It would be gritting our teeth at either keeping Bjugstad or having TB be the 3C but I could live with it considering the value Montour would bring.



That first deal, no not without a significant asset also coming our way. I would want something like Brannstrom. I mean, you are getting the 1OV. There's gonna be some hurt. I would maybe even add something.

1OV + Murray + choice of McCann or Horny

for

3rd + 5th OV + Brannstrom

I think there's enough incentive on both sides. Ottawa has the picks this draft and the next and they get that franchise player. Brannstrom is good, but he's not going to pull butts into seats.

I'd do that deal. Brannstrom is the guy you hope ends up with Marino and then you grab Stutzle and maybe Raymond, Holtz, or Rossi since Brannstrom is coming the other way.

I'd also do McCann for Montour. Would you do Letang and McCann for Montour and Mitts?

 

[Peat]

I wouldn't rule out the possibility of trading Letang prior to the expansion draft and protecting Dumoulin, Pettersson and Montour in this situation.

I'm also perfectly content with leaving Pettersson exposed and being prepared to have POJ take his spot if he gets taken. I don't think it's a guarantee that Pettersson is an expansion draft casualty. You can also pay Seattle to not touch MP if you're concerned with losing him.

You're killing Letang's trade value in such a situation and if last ED is anything to go by, Seattle would kill us if we paid them to keep away - and unless Pettersson has a dogcrap season, why wouldn't they? Top 4 dman vs whoever performed worse out of Tanev, Hornqvist, ZAR or Simon? Not sure POJ would be ready for that either but even if he is, giving away a top 4 D sucks.

Asset value ain't the most important thing in the world but I'd want a real killer season to justify throwing that much away.

and maybe someone like ERod

ERod has a 2m QO that only a maniac would do. He's basically a UFA at this point.

I do agree that Letang is better than Ristolainen. Don't they actually have the same amount of years left on their contracts? Anyway, I assume that the Pens have a better chance of re-signing Risto than the Sabres have of re-signing Letang.

Once again, I don't think Letang accepts a trade to Buffalo.

Would you want to resign Risto at UFA prices though?

In any case, maybe Letang doesn't, maybe he does... but if I'm thinking teams that want to win now and need a 1D and can take on a pricy contract... not sure where else I'm thinking tbh.

I don't know because I don't have a really firm grasp on the value of draft picks or how deep this draft is. I was just browsing through recent drafts and seeing the caliber of players drafted in the 3 through 10ish range and comparing them to the 1st OA. I kind of cherry picked the 2017 draft, bc I have heard a lot of people mention that the 2020 draft was deep.

Analysis seems to suggest the 3OA and 5OA add up to the same impact of 1OA, so I think it'd be a fair trade (Ottawa mightn't though) - does put a real onus on the scouts though. There's very few drafts where I wouldn't prefer to have the 3rd best and 5th best player in the draft over the 1st, but identifying them correctly is clearly bloody difficult.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Well I just had a Sabres fan say that a Ristolainen for Letang trade MIGHT make sense if both were 25, so that just tells me that Buffalo fans aren't worth engaging with on this site

Dear lord, the levels of delusion.

 

[SEALBound]

I'd do that deal. Brannstrom is the guy you hope ends up with Marino and then you grab Stutzle and maybe Raymond, Holtz, or Rossi since Brannstrom is coming the other way.

I'd also do McCann for Montour. Would you do Letang and McCann for Montour and Mitts?

Mitts isn't the guy they thought he was. He really regressed so no.

1OV, Murray, Horny (ideally) or 3, 5, Branny
McCann for Montour

Jake-Sid-Stutzle
Zucker-Geno-Rust
Poulin-Bleuger-Ray/Holtz/etc
ZAR-Laffs-Tanev

Dumo-Letang
Petts-Marino
Montour-Branny

Jarry-CDS

I could get on board with seeing where that team goes. That's a big shake up that doesn't destroy the core. That's even a young enough team that you can transition to the future and be competitive with. Next year, no 1st, but in 2021, you take a center.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Would you want to resign Risto at UFA prices though?

Hard to answer since I don't know what the cap'll be like then and many other variables.

In any case, maybe Letang doesn't, maybe he does... but if I'm thinking teams that want to win now and need a 1D and can take on a pricy contract... not sure where else I'm thinking tbh.

I know of a team that could use him. Pittsburgh.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I guess you can also ask if you can do something like McCann for Montour and then trade Letang for forward help. I'm not super confident with a Pettersson-Montour 2nd pair for next year, but you can alleviate that by addressing your bottom pair. That solves the expansion draft problem and also lets you sell higher on Letang. That defense is much more in the 2017 mold as well (assuming you can make a strong bottom pair).

But at some point, quality overrides quantity. You can trade Letang, McCann and Murray and get back a lot of new faces, but are you actually getting better because of it?

 

[Gurglesons]

I guess you can also ask if you can do something like McCann for Montour and then trade Letang for forward help. I'm not super confident with a Pettersson-Montour 2nd pair for next year, but you can alleviate that by addressing your bottom pair. That solves the expansion draft problem and also lets you sell higher on Letang. That defense is much more in the 2017 mold as well (assuming you can make a strong bottom pair).

But at some point, quality overrides quantity. You can trade Letang, McCann and Murray and get back a lot of new faces, but are you actually getting better because of it?

I think we can easily get better by trading McCann and Murray.

McCann doesn't fit here and I don't see how that relationship is fixed unless Sully is fired.

If Murray doesn't start tomorrow, I say the same thing. Unless he starts and wins the next two games.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think we can easily get better by trading McCann and Murray.

McCann doesn't fit here and I don't see how that relationship is fixed unless Sully is fired.

If Murray doesn't start tomorrow, I say the same thing. Unless he starts and wins the next two games.

Oh I agree, that was just a continuation of my thought of "you can trade Letang and make Pettersson-Montour your 2nd pair".

For that kind of move or that series of moves to make sense, they basically have to be 1 for 1 swaps where you at least come out even. Something like McCann for Montour and Murray for Kapanen both are examples of 1 for 1 swaps that I think are worth doing. But what can you do with Letang there? And even if you make those 2 moves, does that even move the needle?

I think the problem is that the Penguins need to make a big shake up move this off-season, but they aren't in a situation to receive a better player in those shake up moves. I don't think smaller moves like Murray and McCann move the needle enough, but you can't get an equal return for either Hornqvist or Letang.

 

[EVGENIMERLIN]

Mitts isn't the guy they thought he was. He really regressed so no.

1OV, Murray, Horny (ideally) or 3, 5, Branny
McCann for Montour

Jake-Sid-Stutzle
Zucker-Geno-Rust
Poulin-Bleuger-Ray/Holtz/etc
ZAR-Laffs-Tanev

Dumo-Letang
Petts-Marino
Montour-Branny

Jarry-CDS

I could get on board with seeing where that team goes. That's a big shake up that doesn't destroy the core. That's even a young enough team that you can transition to the future and be competitive with. Next year, no 1st, but in 2021, you take a center.

I'd do this. I agree with everything you said, and it sets you up with three young pieces to build around and nabs you Montour. You have POJ waiting in the wings as well.

Poulin can shift to center in a couple of seasons and Teddy can be your 4C.

 

[Headshot77]

1OV+JJ to Ott for 3rd and 5th OV

Iike this scenario, only for the fact that it would melt HF boards. I kinda doubt Ottawa would do it though.

 

[The Old Master]

Like I said, that's crazy talk.

can't argue with that.

 

[Headshot77]

Dumoulin - Letang
Pettersson - Tanev
POJ - Marino

Would be real nice.

Marino would be your 2RD and Tanev would be the 3RD

 

[KIRK]

I'd want to do that but Lafreniere is ready now and 3rd and 5th are slight question marks. I'd go with the safety.

I'd change my mind if they took JJ as well.

And Bjugstad.

EDIT: Nah, I think however tempting it may be, you can use a Murray give away to get rid of JJ and a 2nd rounder to get rid of Bjugstad. You take the franchise altering pick.

 

[KIRK]

The only chance I'd ever considering moving that pick is if someone is offering a Lafreniere caliber RW straight up for the pick. I would much rather take the guy who's a guaranteed top-6 forward over getting more pieces that may be top-6 forwards.

The thought of running with Guentzel-Crosby-Lafreniere is way too appealing for me to to consider moving that pick for quantity.

Which one is moving to RW?

 

[KIRK]

This defense is f***ing awful. We are moving JJ to basically get JJ in Zadorov why?

The bottom two pairings look like Chicago's. Which means we miss the playoffs.

I'm trying to figure out why any sane person would be forecasting a Zucker-Malkin-Rust line for next year.

I thought it would kill it, but the three pieces just don't work together. And after the last 9 periods of hockey, I don't see why anyone would think it's a good idea. You want to tell me Lafreniere-Sid-Zucker and Jake-Malkin-Rust . . . then you're onto something, but doubling down on a failure, I just don't get.

 

[KIRK]

Yohe mentioned if they lose there will be a big shakeup, but what does that mean?

Murray and JJ will most assuredly be gone. He mentioned they’re actively trying to move Bjugstadt. Letang? Horny? McCann? Are they trade bait?

Murray. JJ. Bjugstad. Call me crazy, but I don't see rearranging the deck chairs as being a shakeup.

(where did he mention, what specifically did he say)

 

[Gurglesons]

I'm trying to figure out why any sane person would be forecasting a Zucker-Malkin-Rust line for next year.

I thought it would kill it, but the three pieces just don't work together. And after the last 9 periods of hockey, I don't see why anyone would think it's a good idea. You want to tell me Lafreniere-Sid-Zucker and Jake-Malkin-Rust . . . then you're onto something, but doubling down on a failure, I just don't get.

Wouldn't be surprised if Rust is the sacrificial lamb tbh.

 

[Headshot77]

Mitts isn't the guy they thought he was. He really regressed so no.

1OV, Murray, Horny (ideally) for 3, 5, Branny

McCann for Montour

Jake-Sid-Stutzle
Zucker-Geno-Rust
Poulin-Bleuger-Ray/Holtz/etc
ZAR-Laffs-Tanev

Dumo-Letang
Petts-Marino
Montour-Branny

Jarry-CDS

I could get on board with seeing where that team goes. That's a big shake up that doesn't destroy the core.

The only problem is that you still need to dump JJ. I THINK Ottawa would be a good team to dump him to as they have the 2nd most cap space right now and they only have 4 D signed for next season.

1OA+JJ For 3OA+5OA should be the base of the trade, but I don't think Ottawa bites unless we take a big contract back due to their internal financial constraints.

 

[KIRK]

Wouldn't be surprised if Rust is the sacrificial lamb tbh.

Oh I could totally see something dumb like that.

I honestly don't get Sully sticking with Zucker-Malkin-Rust. The three of them just don't work together. I'll take any duo from those three guys, but not all three. It happens sometimes, and as I said you've got a score of people here saying 'oh on our shaken up and improved team, that can be our 2nd line'. It's madness.

 

[The Old Master]

And Bjugstad.

EDIT: Nah, I think however tempting it may be, you can use a Murray give away to get rid of JJ and a 2nd rounder to get rid of Bjugstad. You take the franchise altering pick.

i don't often disagree but if we could get 3+5 ov we need to do it. we might even be able to trade up a spot with a nice sweetner. theres too much talent there not to.
edit; laf might be the clear no. 1 but i'm not sold him being in the sid-geno class

 

[Gurglesons]

Oh I could totally see something dumb like that.

I honestly don't get Sully sticking with Zucker-Malkin-Rust. The three of them just don't work together. I'll take any duo from those three guys, but not all three. It happens sometimes, and as I said you've got a score of people here saying 'oh on our shaken up and improved team, that can be our 2nd line'. It's madness.

I mean, I don't think this is Sully. I think it is Sid. And Zucker - Malkin - Hornqvist ain't looking much different tbh.

 

[KIRK]

The only problem is that you still need to dump JJ. I THINK Ottawa would be a good team to dump him to as they have the 2nd most cap space right now and they only have 4 D signed for next season.

1OA+JJ For 3OA+5OA should be the base of the trade, but I don't think Ottawa bites unless we take a big contract back due to their internal financial constraints.

Are you kidding me? Ottawa would move heaven and earth to get Lafreniere.

You could tell them 1OV, Murray, Bjugstad, and Johnson for 3OV and 5OV, and they'd bite . . . they'd do whatever it took to make the budget work, that's how big a deal getting Lafreniere would be for them right now.

BUT, the Pens aren't moving 1OV if they get it. As I said, they'll use Murray and a 2nd to rid themselves of Johnson and Bjugstad if that's what it takes. BUT, there's a 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000001% chance they even think of moving their next generation superstar to take over when Sid is done.

 

[Turin]

Wouldn't be surprised if Rust is the sacrificial lamb tbh.

I love Rust this year but to be honest his value will never be higher.

 

[KIRK]

I mean, I don't think this is Sully. I think it is Sid. And Zucker - Malkin - Hornqvist ain't looking much different tbh.

You know what I think of Horny with Geno. That said, the neutral zone issues-- spacing, timing, support-- actually might not be as bad because Horny is slower. Oh, it'll be ugly, but maybe that's what you need right now . . . an ugly goal off an ugly play.

I don't know . . . Sully needs to mix L2 up. How? Up for debate, but you don't stick with what's not working, because all that ends up happening is you go home.