Phoenix CXII: The Devil is in the Details

[Fairview]

What happened to the BIG announcement that was going to be at the end of the season? I never saw this announcement coming I am pretty sure the announcement in 6 weeks will be along the lines of-- things are super duper progressed and IA will make an announcement shortly..Late June.
As far as LeBlanks statement of never stay long term in Glendale , he should have come clean and admitted that he meant Glendale or anywhere else in Arizona. It would make him sound more believable

Ooops !!! I stand corrected, I did not think LeBlank would announce the end of June deadline until the end of April. My mistake. Everything else is on schedule though. He even mentions sponsors and STH needing clarity. More clarity coming late June for sure

 

[CasualFan]

More delays to the long con...


Getting awfully close to the end of June...

And, this...

Didn't the original press on this set a due date of Dec 31, 2015? IA talks so much garbage I cannot even remember. Also, who makes an announcement that there will be an announcement? Of all the stadium and arena partnerships that get done around the country, I doubt that any have ever followed this trajectory. That's not to say it couldn't happen but without question IA is the most pathetic ownership group in the history of sports. I rarely use the term "deserve" when discussing these types of things - but seriously, everyone who follows this franchise with any amount of passion deserves better than this.

 

[Killion]

Didn't the original press on this set a due date of Dec 31, 2015? IA talks so much garbage I cannot even remember. Also, who makes an announcement that there will be an announcement? Of all the stadium and arena partnerships that get done around the country, I doubt that any have ever followed this trajectory. That's not to say it couldn't happen but without question IA is the most pathetic ownership group in the history of sports. I rarely use the term "deserve" when discussing these types of things - but seriously, everyone who follows this franchise with any amount of passion deserves better than this.

Oh ya, totally agree... if it is all just absolute garbage, setup for an exit, awfully elaborate... come back to bite him in the ass like no tomorrow. Theres no need to create such fictions. State simply "were exploring other options in the Valley, we hope to be able to stay in-state, have another year on our agreement, rest assured, working towards that end, announcement hopefully forthcoming, Im optimistic".... Thats it. Even if the "optimistic" bit is absolute BS....If nothing comes to fruition they can make the case that without managing the facility (GRA) & capturing all revenue streams etc, situation untenable, in desperate straights, no choice in the matter, not in the business of losing money, cant source any suitable alternatives locally. People can cry foul about the $15M AMF & Glendales actions in voiding the agreement all they want but that right there is an entirely justifiable reason & excuse for having to leave. So play it straight. This nonsense, just more false hope, extremely unbecoming & beyond disrespectful to the fans who have been through Hell, an insult to peoples intelligence.

 

[Fairview]

He IS a salesman. He can't help himself from telling tall tales. He tells people what he thinks they want to hear. Everytime a deadline comes near, it gets pushed back. All talk no substance.

 

[not a troll]

He ran out of adjectives for progressed.

 

[kihekah19*]

IA is the most pathetic ownership group in the history of sports.

That, or they wind up being genius.

 

[mesamonster]

hardly a surprise. This group does not know how to tell the truth to anyone. The fans are not the only group being lied to, inside the organization they are pushing this same slop. All in the name of holding on to players and coaches for their final season next year. My bet is that enough of the players and coaches who have a legal means of exiting will do so! The Coyotes will be fielding a team and staff that looks nothing like this years group.

What still baffles me is assuming they remain for one lame duck season, what will the economic consequences be? Certainly, IA is not able to pay for such largesse? Imagine, if by X-mas and the league has announced expansion/relocation what the level of interest at GRA will be?

Why would IA play another season under such inhospitable financial outcomes? Wouldn`t BK, be preferable to the ultimate loss of 10s of millions of dollars? Or is it that they have been given an out by GB and all losses will be the responsibility of the other 29 owners?

 

[Glacial]

hardly a surprise. This group does not know how to tell the truth to anyone. The fans are not the only group being lied to, inside the organization they are pushing this same slop. All in the name of holding on to players and coaches for their final season next year. My bet is that enough of the players and coaches who have a legal means of exiting will do so! The Coyotes will be fielding a team and staff that looks nothing like this years group.

What still baffles me is assuming they remain for one lame duck season, what will the economic consequences be? Certainly, IA is not able to pay for such largesse? Imagine, if by X-mas and the league has announced expansion/relocation what the level of interest at GRA will be?

Why would IA play another season under such inhospitable financial outcomes? Wouldn`t BK, be preferable to the ultimate loss of 10s of millions of dollars? Or is it that they have been given an out by GB and all losses will be the responsibility of the other 29 owners?

There would only be another bankruptcy if IceArizona does indeed own it and has been running and financing it themselves or if the NHL owns it but decides if it's one thing the Coyotes need, it's another bankruptcy. If the league runs the team and handles the financing, then the team is just one pile of losses in one area of their overall business. Other businesses have hidden perpetually unprofitable ventures in more profitable divisions or to obfuscate the losses (Microsoft with the Xbox comes to mind [as of a few years ago, they still hadn't recouped all the R&D development costs of the Xbox + 360 + One. Likewise how Time Warner hid the losses of the WB network such that it's hard to find out how much money the network lost whereas Paramount/Viacom were transparent with the losses UPN accrued). The Coyotes look more like the latter.

 

[Ciao]

Six weeks. Good as any other timetable, I guess.

By then hockey will be done in Glendale. If there is something concrete such as a relo it can be announced then, and if not he can string things out as long as he likes over the summer.

Mind you, if he pulls an arena out of his hat no one will know because the media will be too busy covering Hell freezing over.

 

[Ciao]

. . . without question IA is the most pathetic ownership group in the history of sports.

That covers a lot of ground, CF.

Ottawa Rough Rider fans will remember the Glebermans who, among other things, drafted a player who was dead at the time he was drafted.

Leafs fans have Harold Ballard as the standard-bearer of greed and ineptitude.

The Clowns are truly remarkable, but there's a heck of a lot of other competition for that title too.

 

[Mightygoose]

The team had their town hall meeting on Saturday to my understanding.

For anyone that attended, aside from the 6 week timeframe did the team give any indication of a site(s)/partner(s) that are more front runners/short listed?

Was there allot of follow up questions on that front? Curious how the team responded.

 

[GuelphStormer]

He IS a salesman. He can't help himself from telling tall tales. He tells people what he thinks they want to hear. Everytime a deadline comes near, it gets pushed back. All talk no substance.

and with his behaviour in Glendale these past few months, years even, we all now have a little bit more insight into some of the reasons why he may have "left" RIM.

 

[Killion]

There would only be another bankruptcy if IceArizona does indeed own it and has been running and financing it themselves or if the NHL owns it but decides if it's one thing the Coyotes need, it's another bankruptcy. If the league runs the team and handles the financing, then the team is just one pile of losses in one area of their overall business. Other businesses have hidden perpetually unprofitable ventures in more profitable divisions or to obfuscate the losses (Microsoft with the Xbox comes to mind [as of a few years ago, they still hadn't recouped all the R&D development costs of the Xbox + 360 + One. Likewise how Time Warner hid the losses of the WB network such that it's hard to find out how much money the network lost whereas Paramount/Viacom were transparent with the losses UPN accrued). The Coyotes look more like the latter.

Yeah thats not going to happen, Bankruptcy, absolutely blow the lid right off of the facade in terms of who actually still owns this team while simultaneously jeopardizing the league wide LOC which has been used to prop-up this franchise. If IA did actually own the team then like every other owner they would have been required to have signed the standard Consent Form which strictly forbids declarations of BK in order to provide relief & protection from creditors, step 1 in any financial restructuring or in a complete divestiture of winding down the franchise entirely. Their not permitted to do that, dont have the legal right as they dont own the franchise & the NHL's most certainly not going to do it. Be extremely harmful.... If we remember way back when, Gary Bettman promised the owners that in fighting back the Moyes BK & hostile relo attempt, the NHL purchasing & running the team, that none of this would cost them a dime. So far, he's kept that promise and stands on the brink of not only fully reimbursing his creditor who has provided the funds to prop up this Magic Show but to actually turn a couple of hundred million in profit through a relo sale. Las Vegas. $500M right there. Retains the footprint in the SW. Coyotes fans adopting the Black Knights, one & the same....
nice weekend drive or flight, getaway during the season, playoffs. Hotels, MGM & the team putting together package deals. Tickets, 1 or 2 nighters..................

Starting at $259.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

The team had their town hall meeting on Saturday to my understanding.

For anyone that attended, aside from the 6 week timeframe did the team give any indication of a site(s)/partner(s) that are more front runners/short listed?

Was there allot of follow up questions on that front? Curious how the team responded.

I was not there but a buddy of mine was. As you might guess, nobody had any really probing questions about the matter. No indications of front-runners for sites. They did, however, admit that they don't have the money renovate AVMC enough to play there. There was a question about remaining in Glendale and Leblanc said, paraphrased, "I will never say never but it is highly, highly unlikely."

There seems to be the dawning sentiment, though, that Glendale may end up being a longer-term solution than anyone guessed because of AEG - it's clear IA and Glendale have no interest in negotiating with each other, but AEG could be an effective middleman broker when they come in.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Coyotes fans adopting the Black Knights, one & the same....

Yeah, that's not going to happen.

Coyotes hardcores, except in a rare case or two, are not going to adopt the city that stole their team, any more than Winnipeg considered Coyotes exhibition games "home games" before the ThrasherJets happened. They'll pick another team - Kings or Ducks or Avs, maybe. The rest of the hockey fans in Arizona will do what they've been doing all along - cheering for the Blackhawks, Red Wings, and Sabres.

 

[Fugu]

I was not there but a buddy of mine was. As you might guess, nobody had any really probing questions about the matter. No indications of front-runners for sites. They did, however, admit that they don't have the money renovate AVMC enough to play there. There was a question about remaining in Glendale and Leblanc said, paraphrased, "I will never say never but it is highly, highly unlikely."

There seems to be the dawning sentiment, though, that Glendale may end up being a longer-term solution than anyone guessed because of AEG - it's clear IA and Glendale have no interest in negotiating with each other, but AEG could be an effective middleman broker when they come in.

Isn't this the point several of us have been making all along? They don't have the money themselves to renovate, nor to build a new arena with another partner. They need someone to build it for them! Is that ASU? Or one of the Native American tribes? They need access to the revenue streams, and in the past, they needed a subsidy from the arena owner as well. They're already leveraged to the max, and any bumps in franchise valuation (or if there's an expansion, the money from it), the money they can get will quickly go towards operations. As predicted, Sarver isn't interested in sharing, so that rules out the new Phoenix arena, which is still several years off regardless.

I don't think there are any more shells to move around.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Isn't this the point several of us have been making all along? They don't have the money themselves to renovate, nor to build a new arena with another partner. They need someone to build it for them! Is that ASU? Or one of the Native American tribes? They need access to the revenue streams, and in the past, they needed a subsidy from the arena owner as well. They're already leveraged to the max, and any bumps in franchise valuation (or if there's an expansion, the money from it), the money they can get will quickly go towards operations.

I don't think there are any more shells to move around.

Yeah, I think it was pretty clear that AVMC was a red herring all along - a feint in the press to stick it to Glendale and get the fans on their side. And I agree, the only way they get a new barn is if someone builds it for them. It's why I think the only feasible solution is the SR-PI reservation - the alternatives require a special tax district and public money and, with what just happened with the Diamondbacks, I think the hoi polloi are going to be leery of anyone saying, "We need your tax dollars to do what's right for our fans."

I'll tell you something, the Arizona sports scene has turned into a trainwreck so glorious that you can't help but bring out the

 

[Killion]

Yeah, that's not going to happen.... Coyotes hardcores, except in a rare case or two, are not going to adopt the city that stole their team...

Wouldnt be so sure about that TFP.... wait'll you check-in at the Holiday Inn Express up there in Henderson, give you your game tickets..... 2-4-1 Coupon for Carne' Asada Burrito's at Faustos over on College Drive.... cant get those in Arizona.... Muey delicioso. Think you died & went to heaven.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Wouldnt be so sure about that TFP.... wait'll you check-in at the Holiday Inn Express up there in Henderson, give you your game tickets..... 2-4-1 Coupon for Carne' Asada Burrito's at Faustos over on College Drive.... cant get those in Arizona.... Muey delicioso. Think you died & went to heaven.

Me, I prefer the Venetian with its in-house canals and Madame Toussaud's by the skybridge to creep me out with its wax replicas...

...doesn't mean I'd call the Black Knights my home team, even with my boy Max Domi on the wing and Shane Doan going along for the ride.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Not Coyotes, but it does apply:

Such as suing those fans, who are taxpayers in Maricopa County?

Will the team take those fans to court to get out of the stadium deal and move to a different spot? Perhaps out on the Salt River Pima-Maricopa Indian Community, with whom they built a new spring-training facility east of Scottsdale on Loop 101.

We’re talking about the same fans who paid $238 million in sales taxes to build the stadium with the belief the team wouldn’t bolt prior to the end of the 30-year lease.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/opin...ndbacks-chase-field-maricopa-county/82333374/

...and here is the letter the D'backs sent to Maricopa County... shades of IA vs. Glendale?

https://drive.google.com/viewerng/v...backsletterforChairmanSupervisors03242016.pdf

 

[TheLegend]

Isn't this the point several of us have been making all along? They don't have the money themselves to renovate, nor to build a new arena with another partner. They need someone to build it for them! Is that ASU? Or one of the Native American tribes? They need access to the revenue streams, and in the past, they needed a subsidy from the arena owner as well. They're already leveraged to the max, and any bumps in franchise valuation (or if there's an expansion, the money from it), the money they can get will quickly go towards operations. As predicted, Sarver isn't interested in sharing, so that rules out the new Phoenix arena, which is still several years off regardless.

I don't think there are any more shells to move around.

Not to be picky but...... Re: AVMC renovation

I'm still waiting for the video to be released but I'm not convinced IA admitted to not having the money to do it. Everything I've read was more in the realm of it wasn't practical given costs involved versus the temporary benefits.

 

[Fairview]

And then you have LeBlank making statements like.. highly unlikely they will remain in Glendale long term. The reality is that GRA is the only option for them to remain in Arizona.IF the tribe would have been interested in them then something would have happened by now after 6 months of negotiations. ASU or city helping out? Unlikely. He is acting like a spoiled brat having a temper tantrum when it comes to Glendale. Glendale council did the right thing by backing away from discussions with IA. NHL should do the same. It is time to remove LeBlank from team spokesman. Everytime he opens his mouth he comes off looking like a big cry baby. Every missed deadline, every empty threat..it is time for him to just SHUT UP.

 

[mesamonster]

It is very hard to ever take this group seriously when the only mouth piece to the public is the verbally bungling clown that Tony is. His mere presence has become synonymous with duplicitous obfuscation and deceit. While we have yet to see the transcript of the town hall meeting, I can only imagine that he spun the story in a manner that depicts his group as the victim. My guess is that each answer to the softball questions were incomplete disclosures and false promises. Tony has become a sorry caricature of all that is wrong with this franchise.

The fact that he has already rejected the AVMC venue as a temporary home says volumes about their inability to even begin a conversation with any of the suggested arena sites he has alluded to. No confirmation from potential partners regarding talks is clue #2 that time is drawing very short for these cash strapped hucksters.

There was once some hope that if they could get the #1 pick this year that perhaps Austen Matthews might be of some help to the struggling franchise? That appears to now be a pipe dream as the Coyotes have firmly established themselves above the bottom five.

Hello LV! One more year at GRA would be too painful for EVERYONE to watch. With no new announcements regarding a new arena in the next six weeks the exit door is going to swing open and those that can will be walking through it. First to go will be the beloved coach and with him will be the loyal captain and anyone else who can untether themselves from this sinking ship.

 

[Llama19]

It is very hard to ever take this group seriously when the only mouth piece to the public is the verbally bungling clown that Tony is. His mere presence has become synonymous with duplicitous obfuscation and deceit. While we have yet to see the transcript of the town hall meeting, I can only imagine that he spun the story in a manner that depicts his group as the victim. My guess is that each answer to the softball questions were incomplete disclosures and false promises. Tony has become a sorry caricature of all that is wrong with this franchise.

The fact that he has already rejected the AVMC venue as a temporary home says volumes about their inability to even begin a conversation with any of the suggested arena sites he has alluded to. No confirmation from potential partners regarding talks is clue #2 that time is drawing very short for these cash strapped hucksters.

There was once some hope that if they could get the #1 pick this year that perhaps Austen Matthews might be of some help to the struggling franchise? That appears to now be a pipe dream as the Coyotes have firmly established themselves above the bottom five.

Hello LV! One more year at GRA would be too painful for EVERYONE to watch. With no new announcements regarding a new arena in the next six weeks the exit door is going to swing open and those that can will be walking through it. First to go will be the beloved coach and with him will be the loyal captain and anyone else who can untether themselves from this sinking ship.

To quote from the 'official' feature story from the team's web site...

"Regarding the team’s future home, [Team President and CEO Anthony] LeBlanc reaffirmed that a number of cities within the Valley have reached out to the Coyotes to discuss a new arena.

“Now we have to make an economic decision, and the reality is… the majority of the fan base tends to be on the other side of the Valley. So we are exploring it quite aggressively… I am very confident that we will have some kind of announcement out to the community in the next six weeks.â€"

Source: http://coyotes.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=875665

 

[JimAnchower]

To quote from the 'official' feature story from the team's web site...

"Regarding the team’s future home, [Team President and CEO Anthony] LeBlanc reaffirmed that a number of cities within the Valley have reached out to the Coyotes to discuss a new arena.

“Now we have to make an economic decision, and the reality is… the majority of the fan base tends to be on the other side of the Valley. So we are exploring it quite aggressively… I am very confident that we will have some kind of announcement out to the community in the next six weeks.â€"

Source: http://coyotes.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=875665

As a reminder, zero is also a number...