Confirmed with Link: [PHI/WPG] Kevin Hayes UFA rights for a 2019 5th, pt II

[SnS]

Not being able to sign a top-6 forward that they want and everyone recognizes as a position of need, perhaps the biggest free agent forward available to them is a much worse look, just because you're not impressed by him doesn't change that.

Few of my friends are more of the casuals as opposed to other sports. And they didn’t know who Kevin Hayes was. But the minute I mentioned Duchene, they practically went into frenzy. So if they want a splash, they should probably aim higher.

 

[SnS]

They wouldn't be blowing their load. They have more than enough cap space to sign him and then blow their load on someone else (this is starting to sound weird).

At this rate. To get Hayes to sign, nobody will be happy with the contract other than Kevin Hayes himself.

If they want to bring casuals back, they need to aim higher.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

While I generally hate trading anything for early negotiation rights, I can see where the Flyers felt it was a worthwhile gamble in this particular case.

They targeted Hayes as the FA who best fit a big need; he’s one of only two #2-caliber centers on the FA market; & there’s going to be a lot of competition. So they wanted to get their full pitch in & felt it was worth gambling a 5th rd pick that it could give them an important edge.

It still might, even though I think Hayes will wait until July 1 to decide. And if it doesn’t work out, I won’t be too upset at losing the 5th. They’ve been such a lousy team for years now that they need to try to gain an edge over better clubs who may look more enticing to FAs. Not the end of the world if it doesn’t work.

 

[SnS]

Well, the assumption would be that Fletch did his due diligence and determined that Hayes was open, if not amenable, to playing in Philly. To assume otherwise is to determine that Fletch is just throwing **** at the wall and (perhaps) doesn't have much of a plan. For now I prefer to believe the former, as the latter is depressing and it's a bit early to start drinking.

Maybe he thought he’d be able to get the jump. But all along maybe Hayes has wanted to test the market and have everyone running to him after they missed out on Duchene or Panarin.

 

[GKJ]

Duchene is going to Nashville.

While I generally hate trading anything for early negotiation rights, I can see where the Flyers felt it was a worthwhile gamble in this particular case.

They targeted Hayes as the FA who best fit a big need; he’s one of only two #2-caliber centers on the FA market; & there’s going to be a lot of competition. So they wanted to get their full pitch in & felt it was worth gambling a 5th rd pick that it could give them an important edge.

It still might, even though I think Hayes will wait until July 1 to decide. And if it doesn’t work out, I won’t be too upset at losing the 5th. They’ve been such a lousy team for years now that they need to try to gain an edge over better clubs who may look more enticing to FAs. Not the end of the world if it doesn’t work.

I don't mind doing it if it's conditional to the player signing.

 

[Peacekeeper]

If we can convince Panarin that New Jersey shore > Florida beaches that would be great

 

[Domino666]

Well, the assumption would be that Fletch did his due diligence and determined that Hayes was open, if not amenable, to playing in Philly. To assume otherwise is to determine that Fletch is just throwing **** at the wall and (perhaps) doesn't have much of a plan. For now I prefer to believe the former, as the latter is depressing and it's a bit early to start drinking.

You have to think they had a conversation with AV about Hayes and their relationship and possibly in a very untampering-esque way they may have heard from his camp that he would sign with Philly because of the AV connection, but who knows, if he doesn’t sign the lose a 5th round pick, no biggie

 

[BrindamoursNose]

If we can convince Panarin that New Jersey shore > Florida beaches that would be great

Call Snooki and gas up the jet

 

[Psuhockey]

At this rate. To get Hayes to sign, nobody will be happy with the contract other than Kevin Hayes himself.

If they want to bring casuals back, they need to aim higher.

Outside of Panarin and Karlsson, there is no one available to bring casuals back. It either win now or tank for a superstar forward.

 

[Peacekeeper]

Call Snooki and gas up the jet

It's gonna be a situation

 

[David St Hubbins]

You have to think they had a conversation with AV about Hayes and their relationship and possibly in a very untampering-esque way they may have heard from his camp that he would sign with Philly because of the AV connection, but who knows, if he doesn’t sign the lose a 5th round pick, no biggie

I'm sure Haye's has an agent that represents other players. Having a conversation about generalities - how do your clients feel about playing in Philly? Is there anyone that would just flat out not come here? See, I'm taking a survey for my bosses - would be expected and pretty common I would think.

 

[baudib1]

I don't care about the 5th-round pick but giving up anything to get a couple weeks extra negotiating time is just stupid. Especially when it essentially locks you out of signing some of the better UFAs.

 

[NYCFlyer]

Few of my friends are more of the casuals as opposed to other sports. And they didn’t know who Kevin Hayes was. But the minute I mentioned Duchene, they practically went into frenzy. So if they want a splash, they should probably aim higher.

Duchene is a far superior player but was never going to sign here. I spend a lot of time in Nashville and Duchene bought a place there last fall and has made it widely known he wants to play/live there. The issue is that the Preds are right up against the cap. They are going to try and move Subban and possibly others to afford Josi and Duchene. Hayes may not sign here but it was a smart gamble with little downside as we may be able to flip him to someone else for a 6th or so now that we can have an open dialogue with him and know if he will sign here or not. Like Duchene/Panarin/Tavares FA's know the league and know which couple of cities/teams interest them. Very few have an open competition.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

Duchene is a far superior player but was never going to sign here. I spend a lot of time in Nashville and Duchene bought a place there last fall and has made it widely known he wants to play/live there. The issue is that the Preds are right up against the cap. They are going to try and move Subban and possibly others to afford Josi and Duchene. Hayes may not sign here but it was a smart gamble with little downside as we may be able to flip him to someone else for a 6th or so now that we can have an open dialogue with him and know if he will sign here or not. Like Duchene/Panarin/Tavares FA's know the league and know which couple of cities/teams interest them. Very few have an open competition.

They could have just negotiated with him on July 1 without giving up a damn thing if that’s the case.

 

[NYCFlyer]

They could have just negotiated with him on July 1 without giving up a damn thing if that’s the case.

Lets say you were one of three teams he was considering and he was the only FA C that was willing to come here and would improve the team. It makes sense to take two weeks and see if you can convince him to pull the trigger in a non competitive bidding environment. If not flip him to someone else and recover the pick. This is a Holmgren strategy that has worked for him before.

 

[Stizzle]

this and the gm saying, everyone except giroux, can be traded may be a reason as well.

That's taken out of context. He said anyone could be traded, except Giroux (NMC), if he got a crazy offer, and that every player has a value. He made it clear there's a big difference in being willing to trade a player at high cost, and looking to trade a player.

 

[Rich Nixon]

I don't care about the 5th-round pick but giving up anything to get a couple weeks extra negotiating time is just stupid. Especially when it essentially locks you out of signing some of the better UFAs.

Not sure how it does that, you talking about the cap room if he signs? I honestly think they might wait on the RFA deals at this point until after the opening salvo of unrestricted free agency...which is kinda scary, but possible, and certainly logical if you're planning on having a big cash-and-trade orgy this summer.

I think the late-pick-for-negotiating rights thing is weird. It makes sense if you really want the player, you're signalling to him "Hey, we've already given up assets because we're serious about getting you in the fold." But it does seem unnecessary because, most of the time, the player just wants to check the market anyway.

In theory, I guess, you can almost consider it sort of a research thing, with the upside being the possibility of signing. Things happen very fast on July 1st and you need to have your offers ready. If Hayes at a given dollar amount is on your radar, and you acquire him and find out he wants more than you'd be willing to give him, and other teams might be interested, then you can kinda gauge prices for the upcoming frenzy and start building better offers for other players. It's like "We wanted you, but now we don't, so we can stay out of the bidding war on 7/1 and focus our efforts elsewhere."

 

[Tripod]

Trade for trouba only to lose him in the expansion draft 12 months away? Seems like a chiarelli like move.

Expansion is in 2 years...not 1.

 

[Stizzle]

At this rate. To get Hayes to sign, nobody will be happy with the contract other than Kevin Hayes himself.

If they want to bring casuals back, they need to aim higher.

You bring casuals back by winning. Not Matt Duchene.

 

[Tripod]

Maybe Fletch is actually negotiating instead of just handing Hayes and his agent the contract he wants.

 

[Psuhockey]

You bring casuals back by winning. Not Matt Duchene.

You also have to be entertaining. Grinding out 2-1 wins isn’t going to bring anyone back.

 

[Psuhockey]

Maybe Fletch is actually negotiating instead of just handing Hayes and his agent the contract he wants.

Dude if he didn’t sign within an hour of the trade, he is walking.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Duchene is a far superior player but was never going to sign here. I spend a lot of time in Nashville and Duchene bought a place there last fall and has made it widely known he wants to play/live there. The issue is that the Preds are right up against the cap. They are going to try and move Subban and possibly others to afford Josi and Duchene. Hayes may not sign here but it was a smart gamble with little downside as we may be able to flip him to someone else for a 6th or so now that we can have an open dialogue with him and know if he will sign here or not. Like Duchene/Panarin/Tavares FA's know the league and know which couple of cities/teams interest them. Very few have an open competition.

Good info about Duchene & Nashville. I long knew about Panarin buying a house in Miami last summer; did not know about Duchene re: Nashville.

Personal tastes can have huge influences on players. That’s how Minnesota got Parise & Suter. How Vancouver got Hamhuis. Pacioretty pushed to get traded to Vegas knowing he wanted to sign there. Etc etc

 

[NYCFlyer]

Maybe Fletch is actually negotiating instead of just handing Hayes and his agent the contract he wants.

I personally hope Hayes signs here as there will be less pressure on Fletch to be "aggressive" in the trade market. Fletch did a good job of holding off Scott at the trade deadline but I think Scott was stupid to publicly say things that back Fletch into a corner and damage his ability to effectively negotiate with FA's and in trades.

 

[deadhead]

Of course personal preferences decide where people sign, it's not like the general parameters of contracts aren't known before FA, including the tax rates at different locations, and when you're making a decision where to spend the next 7 years of your life, do you really think a player making $45-50M after taxes will pick a place he hates for an extra half million a year (after taxes and agent fees)?

Money matters for a few players, there's always the guy who wants bragging rights as the highest paid, and for second tier guys, the money is smaller so it matters more since this is often their only chance to make their retirement stash (5x5 ends up around $15M after-taxes).

But most of the time it's location (where you want to live), whether the franchise is competitive, where your family (and your spouses') family lives.
Things like PT don't matter if you're getting a big contract, since your new team has plenty of incentive to play you.