Confirmed with Link: Penguins trade Derrick Pouliot to Canucks for Andrey Pedan, 4th rd. pick

[Jaded-Fan]

I also don't think you can dismiss the Penguins not using Pouliot well and not developing him well. I think it was a failure all across the board with Pouliot. Not only did he have faults that prevented him from being an everyday player, the organization didn't develop him well to either get rid of those flaws or use him appropriately to minimize the impact of those flaws.

Possibly.

But given how great they have been at defensive reclaimation projects does not bode well for him. Sure, he could be the exception, but the Pens have a pretty good record. especially of late, with players like Niskanen that failed on other teams. It is not a system not fitting either, on paper DP is just the kind of player that should fit Sullivan's system like a glove. If Gonchar and the others could not fix him why would anyone think that Calgary could?

 

[tantalum]

I also don't think you can dismiss the Penguins not using Pouliot well and not developing him well. I think it was a failure all across the board with Pouliot. Not only did he have faults that prevented him from being an everyday player, the organization didn't develop him well to either get rid of those flaws or use him appropriately to minimize the impact of those flaws.

Is that true though? I'm pretty sure when they acquired Schultz they did exactly that. Put him in protected situations and exploited the offensive talents he had and built him into a better D-man. Seems like the organization showed that they can do those things so the question is why wouldn't/didn't they do that with this player? Perhaps it's as simple as the player not being good enough to put forth that investment and effort?

Credit to the Penguins as they got some sort of asset for a guy who was destined for the waiver wire.

 

[Jacob]

I hope he pans out. He's got talent. It sucks that he was drafted about 12 spots higher than he should've been, and by a team with a lot puck-movers already and that can't afford to play a kid through their mistakes on D.

 

[Empoleon877130]

Possibly.

But given how great they have been at defensive reclaimation projects does not bode well for him. Sure, he could be the exception, but the Pens have a pretty good record. especially of late, with players like Niskanen that failed on other teams. It is not a system not fitting either, on paper DP is just the kind of player that should fit Sullivan's system like a glove. If Gonchar and the others could not fix him why would anyone think that Calgary could?

I feel like there's a difference between a reclamation project and actually developing a player. One is fixing a guys issues and getting him back to where he was. Another is actually developing a guy. I'm not sure the Penguins are good at developing.

Is that true though? I'm pretty sure when they acquired Schultz they did exactly that. Put him in protected situations and exploited the offensive talents he had and built him into a better D-man. Seems like the organization showed that they can do those things so the question is why wouldn't/didn't they do that with this player? Perhaps it's as simple as the player not being good enough to put forth that investment and effort?

Credit to the Penguins as they got some sort of asset for a guy who was destined for the waiver wire.

No, they didn't do that with Pouliot. They should have used him like they used Schultz, but only Johnston did that. If the Penguins believed Pouliot wasn't good enough and not worth the effort in 2015, they wouldn't have kept him until today.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Good thing they didn't take Dumoulin.

Their media is hilarious. What he's trying to say is that "The Pens didn't want to give this guy up when we were dealing Kesler!" and now they got him for a 4th round pick and a guy that probably has a better future than Pouliot does.

I can't wait to hear more of this crap all day today at the office, good times.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I hope he pans out. He's got talent. It sucks that he was drafted about 12 spots higher than he should've been, and by a team with a lot puck-movers already and that can't afford to play a kid through their mistakes on D.

He had stints of 34 games, 22 games, and 11 games. He was given time to play through his crap, but being drafted 5yrs later and you show virtually no improvement at the NHL level, you have to call a spade a spade and just move on.

I don't wish ill will towards the kid, I said before that if he gets traded he might get the kick in the rear he needed, but he's a guy that has shown he as the tools, but no tool box. Things like that don't change. I don't even know where he fits on that team to be honest.

Edler, Tanev, Gudbranson, Del Zotto, Hutton, and Stecher are their 6.
Then they have Biega, Weircioch and now Pouliot. They aren't known to "develop" much of anything. If anything, you'd think Pouliot would have figured it out for the Pens given that there have been guys that were former 1sts that have figured it out here - Schultz, Niskanen, Cole...etc.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

I also don't think you can dismiss the Penguins not using Pouliot well and not developing him well. I think it was a failure all across the board with Pouliot. Not only did he have faults that prevented him from being an everyday player, the organization didn't develop him well to either get rid of those flaws or use him appropriately to minimize the impact of those flaws.

He came up and looked offensively gifted but otherwise unreliable. For at least one season if not two in WBS they emphasized him learning the defensive side of the game. His best stretch here was playing some reliable defense with little of the offense he was drafted for. His worst stretch was last year getting outskated by players 10 years older than him and getting passed over for the likes of Cameron Gaunce. He just hasn't put it together at this level, and it's not like the team didn't take some time with him.

If he was picked closer to where he was projected to go in the draft I don't think anyone's trying to point fingers at anyone but him.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Yeah, I'm not even sure where Pouliot fits on that Vancouver blueline. They've already got "puck movers with questionable defense" in Del Zotto, Hutton, and Stecher, so he's not taking their spots. Edler's their best all-around defender, so he's obviously not taking his spot. And Gudbranson and Tanev are stay at home defenders, which is something Pouliot wouldn't know the first thing about.

I'm not entirely sure why Vancouver pulled the trigger.

 

[madinsomniac]

Classic case of Backlogging a draft pick... with a minors roster chalk full of defensemen with NHL talent we overstocked them then stuck vets in front of them and most ended up not reaching their potential... Pouliot needed to play through his issues at a much younger age, go back down to work on them, then come up with a realistic chance to play... Shultz pretty much doomed his final progress, though im fine with Shultz being in his role...

Had they Drafted FF as they should have, the clear path to the NHL probably gets him here earlier and we have a superstar winger... but then maybe Kessel never arrives... hard to say

Anyhow good luck pooh.. hope you weren't totally ruined by us

 

[Corvidae]

4th round pick? 'Nucks got hosed.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

I also don't think you can dismiss the Penguins not using Pouliot well and not developing him well. I think it was a failure all across the board with Pouliot. Not only did he have faults that prevented him from being an everyday player, the organization didn't develop him well to either get rid of those flaws or use him appropriately to minimize the impact of those flaws.

Did they? Was Pouliot developed so badly that it derailed him this badly? How did it go down? Something like he was drafted, shoulder surgery, reached AHL eligibility, started the season in the AHL, was brought up, I think he was kept up for too long, sent down again to work on things, an injury kept him out of the playoffs, disastrous preseason, back to the AHL to work on things, back up later in the season with Sullivan as HC, played with Cole, replaced with Schultz, arguably a blow to Pouliot, finally takes his fitness seriously, meh preseason, gets hurt, maybe stays in the press box when healthy, back to the AHL work on things, abomination in the ice when he gets back to the NHL, Sullivan doesn't let him play through every horrendous f*** up, jumped by Streit and Ruhwedel, healthy offseason and once again a weak preseason.

How much of that sounds like a terrible misuse of him?

1) kept up too long under johnston
2) usurped by Schultz when looking competent. Probably not great for Pouliot but right for the Pens imo
3) kept in the press box
4) maybe Sullivan doesn't coddle him enough?

It's not perfect development but it's not a disaster that gives the Pens much of the blame for this result sceptical for drafting him there, It's not bylsma's hatred of Despres, rushing Bennett often on his off wing or... was it morrow they tried to breakdown and rebuild? The Pens can't force him to understand defense or not be a lazy bastard on the ice. They can't give a player whose offensive game is questionable at the NHL level all of the O zone starts, they can't let him single handedly lose them games.

Not all flaws can be developed out and not all problems can be masked by useage.

Possibly.

But given how great they have been at defensive reclaimation projects does not bode well for him. Sure, he could be the exception, but the Pens have a pretty good record. especially of late, with players like Niskanen that failed on other teams. It is not a system not fitting either, on paper DP is just the kind of player that should fit Sullivan's system like a glove. If Gonchar and the others could not fix him why would anyone think that Calgary could?

But it should be remembered that players like Niskanen and Schultz had successful seasons and then fell apart. That's a lot different than the Pouliot problem.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

He came up and looked offensively gifted but otherwise unreliable. For at least one season if not two in WBS they emphasized him learning the defensive side of the game. His best stretch here was playing some reliable defense with little of the offense he was drafted for. His worst stretch was last year getting outskated by players 10 years older than him and getting passed over for the likes of Cameron Gaunce. He just hasn't put it together at this level, and it's not like the team didn't take some time with him.

If he was picked closer to where he was projected to go in the draft I don't think anyone's trying to point fingers at anyone but him.

The team took the time to develop the guy, he spent a lot of time in WBS, his conditioning never looked anywhere as good as it should have been given that time frame, yet no one else had that issue on the god damned team. I do not buy this the Pens failed him narrative at all. He had all the tools everyone else was provided, if he refused to use those resources available to him, it isn't the Penguins fault. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink situation with Pouliot.

The guy was out played at the NHL level by Ruhwedel and Gaunce last year. There were a lot of key injuries, he failed to take advantage of each of those scenarios.

He averaged 14:53 per game last year, was still out played by Gaunce who averaged almost 3mins less than him per game.

 

[flaneur]

Perhaps a change in scenery is what the doctor ordered for Pouliot. He will probably have a better chance of making the team in Vancouver than in Pittsburgh. That said, the Pens have developed a well earned reputation with reclamation projects in the past few seasons (especially first round D-men), and yet bizarrely wasn't able to do the same with Pouliot... it's a bit of a red flag about the player.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

The Pens traded the 8th overall pick for a 4th round pick and getting rid of Shero and Bylsma.

I think that the team got a bargain.

 

[Empoleon877130]

Pouliot was drafted as an OFD that can QB a PP, and the Penguins used him under Sullivan with a ton of defensive zone starts and very little PP time. That's what I mean when I say he was misused. They turned him into a high risk OFD to a bland D that was not good enough offensively or defensively. They didn't build off his strengths, which caused him to be bland and do nothing to stand out at the NHL level.

Pouliot did himself no favors, but Sullivan's use of Pouliot when he did play would be one area I said Sullivan made a mistake on.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

Sucks that we absolutely biffed our best pick in likely 10-15 years, but whatever. Got something for an utter bust, I guess.

 

[Zen Arcade]

I saw Pedan literally pick someone up and throw them when he played for Bridgeport. That has to be worth something, right?

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

Pouliot was drafted as an OFD that can QB a PP, and the Penguins used him under Sullivan with a ton of defensive zone starts and very little PP time. That's what I mean when I say he was misused. They turned him into a high risk OFD to a bland D that was not good enough offensively or defensively. They didn't build off his strengths, which caused him to be bland and do nothing to stand out at the NHL level.

If he didn't make glaring mistakes in his brief time in the NHL, including multiple fumbles at the blue line leading to breakaways, I'd agree with you. You have to walk before you can run though. No one is instructing a defenseman to just use his offensive instincts and the rest will come. Stabilizing himself in his own end and then letting his natural talents come out once confident is not at all an unusual approach.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Pouliot was drafted as an OFD that can QB a PP, and the Penguins used him under Sullivan with a ton of defensive zone starts and very little PP time. That's what I mean when I say he was misused. They turned him into a high risk OFD to a bland D that was not good enough offensively or defensively. They didn't build off his strengths, which caused him to be bland and do nothing to stand out at the NHL level.

But at the same time, rookies/youngsters usually start in "less than ideal" situations and work their way up based on their play. Both Guentzel and Sheary started as bottom six wingers, but then impressed enough to get looks in the top six when something opened up. They didn't immediately get glued to Crosby's wing and be granted top unit PP time just because their strength is offense.

Pouliot's problem was he didn't defend very well. I think in order to gain the coaching staff's trust, he needed to be better in his own zone so they'd trust him with more and more ice time, then he'd start to get cushy minutes.

 

[Corvidae]

Pouliot was drafted as an OFD that can QB a PP, and the Penguins used him under Sullivan with a ton of defensive zone starts and very little PP time. That's what I mean when I say he was misused. They turned him into a high risk OFD to a bland D that was not good enough offensively or defensively. They didn't build off his strengths, which caused him to be bland and do nothing to stand out at the NHL level.

I know he only saw second unit time, but he didn't look nearly good enough on the PP to look past the rest of his game. He didn't exactly rack up "#1 PP QB" points in the AHL either. I imagine that the Pens (and specifically Jackie Martin) wanted to make him more well rounded, and not just because his face use to be super fat.

 

[vikingGoalie]

i never saw a single thing out of Poo that showed me why we would burn an 8th overall pick on him. Good riddance, he might figure it out, but I doubt it.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Pouliot was drafted as an OFD that can QB a PP, and the Penguins used him under Sullivan with a ton of defensive zone starts and very little PP time. That's what I mean when I say he was misused. They turned him into a high risk OFD to a bland D that was not good enough offensively or defensively. They didn't build off his strengths, which caused him to be bland and do nothing to stand out at the NHL level.

And, ironically, his season with the highest d zone start percentage was his season with the best PPG and when he looked the most like an NHL player.

The other side of this argument is that he didn't get pp time because he struggles to get shots through and his offensive game didn't translate to the NHL. He can't be high risk because his decision making is bad and his skating/anticipation makes it disastrous. He's bland because he's not good enough at anything at the NHL level and he's shown to be mentall weak. His offensive game wasn't good enough to make up for an awful defensive game.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

I saw Pedan literally pick someone up and throw them when he played for Bridgeport. That has to be worth something, right?

We won two cups the past two years with players like that. Reeves, now this guy. The Pens proved that is the way to go to win a cup. Or two.

 

[Penguins23]

Could be worse, we could have drafted Forsberg instead of Pouliot and then we'd be in cap trouble.

 

[Peat]

Shultz pretty much doomed his final progress, though im fine with Shultz being in his role...

You don't say

Schultz has been about the best possible reason to block a prospect's path I can imagine. I'm optimistic that he can get even better in his own zone as well.