Player Discussion Pavel Buchnevich: Part VI

[aufheben]

This is actually a really good summary of how he was viewed at the time:

Pavel Buchnevich – The Next Ones: NHL 2013 Draft Prospect Profile

Danke

 

[The Crypto Guy]

I'm not ready to give up on him..but it is heading toward that direction..

 

[Chaels Arms]

Averaging about the same amount of ice time per game under Quinn as he did under AV last season. I remember reading posts in almost every single GDT from posters with their hair on fire because AV wasn't giving him 20+ a night. AV had the right read on Buchnevich. He kind of reminds me of Namnestnikov. He'll show you flashes but the night in, night out aggression needed to be a top player isn't there.

And, to be fair, I'm not knocking him. He's absolutely an NHL player. I don't think he's lazy either. That's a term that's too often thrown at Russian players out of, ironically, laziness.

I think for offensive players with Buchnevich's skill set to hit their potential in the NHL there's a personality element that's just as important as the on-ice skill set. You have to be cocky. Confidence is so important for players like this because they have to be comfortable making high risk decisions and living with the consequences even when it doesn't work out. I don't think Buchnevich has the confidence or cockiness to take the next step.

Listen to Adam Oates' interview on Spittin Chiclets when he talks about himself and Brett Hull. A little bit of IDGAF goes a long way if you're trying to be a goal scorer in the NHL.

 

[Good Intentions]

Buchnevich is a case study of how utterly meaningless a “good value pick” is. He doesn’t move the needle whatsoever. Irrelevant is the operative word. Addition by subtraction, he’ll be in the KHL before he’s a formidable top 6 forward.

 

[Rongomania]

Buchnevich is a case study of how utterly meaningless a “good value pick” is. He doesn’t move the needle whatsoever. Irrelevant is the operative word. Addition by subtraction, he’ll be in the KHL before he’s a formidable top 6 forward.

Watch we trade him to the sharks or some **** and then he gets flipped to the Penguins in the summer and scores against us for the rest of Crosby\Malkins careers.

 

[Good Intentions]

Watch we trade him to the sharks or some **** and then he gets flipped to the Penguins in the summer and scores against us for the rest of Crosby\Malkins careers.

A bit dramatic. My point is that he’s just not relevant. 6 years of ‘Development’ - he’s an interchangeable part with a KHL import or go sign Vanek for a year, Buchnevich moves the needle zero. He’s as irrelevant as his horrible body language. Do you think we have any chance at winning with a guy like him as an important piece? You lose before the game begins. Opponents know the difference - you can smell blood in the water.

I’m comfortable punting #89 to Minsk. I hope he has a nice career in the KHL, there is no chance he’s a winning NHL player.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

There is a lot of truth to this.

Lazy players don't make it to the NHL

 

[Rongomania]

A bit dramatic. My point is that he’s just not relevant. 6 years of ‘Development’ - he’s an interchangeable part with a KHL import or go sign Vanek for a year, Buchnevich moves the needle zero. He’s as irrelevant as his horrible body language. Do you think we have any chance at winning with a guy like him as an important piece? You lose before the game begins. Opponents know the difference - you can smell blood in the water.

I’m comfortable punting #89 to Minsk. I hope he has a nice career in the KHL, there is no chance he’s a winning NHL player.

I wholeheartedly agree with you. I am just f***in’ around man.

This team has changed me. It’s cool. I’m coping with it in it own ways.

 

[McRanger]

Lazy players don't make it to the NHL

Sorry but you’re wrong. Lazy players do NOT make it to the NHL.

I’m afraid our opinions are just too far apart to continue this argument.

(Maybe check the post I quoted?)

 

[Inferno]

Lazy players don't make it to the NHL

I'd disagree with this. Plenty of floaters made the nhl based on their ability to shoot the puck or get to the net and tip shots.

Honestly if Laine didn't shoot the puck the way he did I'm not sure he's an nhler.

 

[Mikos87]

I agree with @Lias Andersson . Buchs doesn't have the swagger to be that type of scorer, you need that, you need to feel like your that stud out there whose going to take it to other team every time the pucks on your stick.

I've seen it a couple of times, but he doesn't have the confidence.

 

[East Coast Bias]

Buchnevich is a case study of how utterly meaningless a “good value pick” is. He doesn’t move the needle whatsoever. Irrelevant is the operative word. Addition by subtraction, he’ll be in the KHL before he’s a formidable top 6 forward.

This post makes no sense at all.

If you get a 15 goal, 40-45 pt guy in the 3rd round it’s absolutely good value.

Because people have/had higher expectations of him doesnt mean it’s a bad pick at all.

We’ve done a good job of developing post lottery and undrsfted guys here over the years. That they’re missing a top player isn’t an indictment on that.

 

[Good Intentions]

This post makes no sense at all.

If you get a 15 goal, 40-45 pt guy in the 3rd round it’s absolutely good value.

Because people have/had higher expectations of him doesnt mean it’s a bad pick at all.

We’ve done a good job of developing post lottery and undrsfted guys here over the years. That they’re missing a top player isn’t an indictment on that.

Why is 40 points a barometer of success? This guy is an NHL minus is most facets of the game. I agree he has some offensive skill. So do most forwards in the KHL.

His 'value' is minimal.

 

[doomscroll]

We may have made our own beds in anticipation of Buchnevich, since this team's prospect pool was so thoroughly depleted when he arrived in NY. If Pavel was mixed in with Chytil, Kravtsov, Andersson, etc. perhaps a streaky 40-50 pt winger would have been more welcome.
This team is currently 28th in GF/60, so to indict a 23-year-old for not "moving the needle" seems kind of silly. The Rangers are a mediocre team rife with holes, and that fact relays itself in the production of otherwise useful NHLers.

To wit, a 40-point season is top-six production in today's NHL.

 

[Rangers in 7]

I think people are frustrated because they always want more from him, but to be honest a 40-50 point player who was drafted in the THIRD round is great value

people hold him to this standard like he was a first round pick

hes a top 9 winger who should slot in between a high skilled 3rd liner or a passing 2nd liner that can set up other scorers....I don't get the hate with him

 

[Harbour Dog]

A couple posters (only one that I remember for sure) blew him way out of proportion while he was playing in the KHL, and we're still judging him based on their unrealistic expectations.

We want to trade him because he's only a middle6 skill guy. And then what? We finally get Lettieri the minutes he deserves?

If Gorton fits him into a trade that makes sense, then okay. If not, then we have a middle6 skill guy who has more points than 17/30 of the guys taken in the first round, and than ALL of the 44 guys taken before him after that round.

Realistic. Expectations.

 

[Rangers in 7]

A couple posters (only one that I remember for sure) blew him way out of proportion while he was playing in the KHL, and we're still judging him based on their unrealistic expectations.

We want to trade him because he's only a middle6 skill guy. And then what? We finally get Lettieri the minutes he deserves?

If Gorton fits him into a trade that makes sense, then okay. If not, then we have a middle6 skill guy who has more points than 17/30 of the guys taken in the first round, and than ALL of the 44 guys taken before him after that round.

Realistic. Expectations.

this.....100% this

I understand he dominated play in the KHL and im not expecting him to do so, but hes a young kid who can put up 50 points a year....i'll take that everyday, I mean could you imagine if every draft pick we had played above their draft position?!!?

to be fair I still think there is more in there for him, id also like to point out on a team competing for a cup he'd be playing on the third line with a player like Hayes...I mean thats the type of depth Stanley cup teams have, hell he could be a competent second liner on a cup team surrounded with the right players

 

[TheDirtyH]

I'd disagree with this. Plenty of floaters made the nhl based on their ability to shoot the puck or get to the net and tip shots.

Honestly if Laine didn't shoot the puck the way he did I'm not sure he's an nhler.

yeah, but then the shot and stick skills aren't accidents... (sidney crosby's basement pic. etc.)

 

[East Coast Bias]

Why is 40 points a barometer of success? This guy is an NHL minus is most facets of the game. I agree he has some offensive skill. So do most forwards in the KHL.

His 'value' is minimal.

Go look at the 2013 draft in the 3/4th round range and tell me where the value is.

In the 90s 3rd rounders had about a 15% chance to play in the league. TSN did a study from 2000-2009 and found 3rd rounders making the league at 30%. That’s just making the league. Putting up .5 PPG over 175 games is much more than just making it. Go pull the 3rd round up from the 2013 draft. Most of the other picks don’t even have Wikipedia pages to click. And everyone has a Wikipedia page.

This is a really weird hill to die on, because you’re so clearly wrong, and just trying to shoehorn your feelings of a guy into the discussion.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

A couple posters (only one that I remember for sure) blew him way out of proportion while he was playing in the KHL, and we're still judging him based on their unrealistic expectations.

We want to trade him because he's only a middle6 skill guy. And then what? We finally get Lettieri the minutes he deserves?

If Gorton fits him into a trade that makes sense, then okay. If not, then we have a middle6 skill guy who has more points than 17/30 of the guys taken in the first round, and than ALL of the 44 guys taken before him after that round.

Realistic. Expectations.

Not every winger will be Ovechkin and not every center will be Crosby. Yet some people think we should trade players if they aren't at that level. People want to trade Hayes and Zibanejad because they are not elite centers. Okay, let's say we trade them... Then what?

I'd love to have a Ferrari but should I sell my Mercedes in the hope I win a Ferrari in the lottery? What if I don't? I end up having to take the train to work every day and I just sold my perfectly fine Mercedes for some scratch offs.

 

[Good Intentions]

Go look at the 2013 draft in the 3/4th round range and tell me where the value is.

In the 90s 3rd rounders had about a 15% chance to play in the league. TSN did a study from 2000-2009 and found 3rd rounders making the league at 30%. That’s just making the league. Putting up .5 PPG over 175 games is much more than just making it. Go pull the 3rd round up from the 2013 draft. Most of the other picks don’t even have Wikipedia pages to click. And everyone has a Wikipedia page.

This is a really weird hill to die on, because you’re so clearly wrong, and just trying to shoehorn your feelings of a guy into the discussion.

You are not comprehending my point.

I do not care that he’s played in games - his production is a minus and his value is minimal.

I’m not doubting that most 3rd round picks don’t play a lick. I’d put Buchnevich in the same category as Duclair - has some skill, but not a player you win with.

Duclair is on his fourth team in four years. How much ‘value’ does he have?

Buchnevich will be in the KHL in 2 years.

 

[Off Sides]

Seems like the perfect bridge candidate in my opinion.

 

[East Coast Bias]

You are not comprehending my point.

I do not care that he’s played in games - his production is a minus and his value is minimal.

I’m not doubting that most 3rd round picks don’t play a lick. I’d put Buchnevich in the same category as Duclair - has some skill, but not a player you win with.

Duclair is on his fourth team in four years. How much ‘value’ does he have?

Buchnevich will be in the KHL in 2 years.

You started off your rant saying he's not productive for a 3rd rounder, which was wrong.

His production is not remotely a minus or KHL level. You're wrong there as well. The bolded is entirely your opinion, and if we're basing it on production, atypical historically.

His production may not be what some have expected to be, which is a different conversation entirely.

Somehow this place has gotten so swept up in ELITENESS that anyone under 25 who isn't a PPG is now trash non NHLers.

 

[Mike in Houston]

Bridge deal in the offseason.

 

[Ana Crusis]

Can he sign in khl at the end of the year?