Rumor: P. Kane to Detroit?

[Steve Yzerlland]

you laugh but think about it. He comes here at 4 mil or 5. He lights it up but we are still not at the point of contending as yzerman would still feel like we are missing pieces. He ends up trading kane because his stock is crazy high at 50% retained to a contender. All of a sudden, we have a semi-free pickup that can be traded for massive gains.

disclaimer: my interpretation of "massive" in this way of thinking is a free 1st rounder + maybe a prospect that has been in the ahl for a year and is stuck because of "x" reason but has nothing to do with his gameplay. To a lesser degree, think berggren here or a solid goalie maybe.

Would nj devils be willing to trade their 1st + mercer/holtz (yes i know they are on the team but their fan base seems to dislike them a lot, probably for a good reason but may need a change of scenery so early in their career?) for a 2.5 mil kane that is producing on a fringe team and could possibly extend with them if he enjoys the point producing potential alongside hughes or hischier?

This is just an example to go off of people.

edit: if this trade proposal type is a potential thing, i would go more for mercer since he has played center/wing instead of holtz who doesn't play center at all. I think have more center style wingers vs pure wingers is better to have more of throughout the roster.

Listen I'm all for Kane coming here but other than money then potential trade later that's the only draw. We are not good and if we luckboxed into a playoff spot (unlikely) would be a first round exit.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Listen I'm all for Kane coming here but other than money then potential trade later that's the only draw. We are not good and if we luckboxed into a playoff spot (unlikely) would be a first round exit.

which we should be fine with if we did "unlikely" get into the playoffs and lose in round one.

We need playoff experience to our core players. They know nothing but losing right now, if they make the playoffs, it changes the perception. Ask buffalo fans at this point. They have had pretty good players on their team the past 10 years but never made the playoffs and it starts creating a culture that is very difficult to get out of.

This team is turning into a team with a culture of losing regardless of how "hard" they work. That needs to change this season or next. I would argue more for this year for it to change because that is perpetual losers and the same ole dead wings.

 

[ColdToiletSeats]

Listen I'm all for Kane coming here but other than money then potential trade later that's the only draw. We are not good and if we luckboxed into a playoff spot (unlikely) would be a first round exit.

we shouldn't make the playoff's until we win the cup .. gotcha

 

[13to40]

I’m all for signing Kane if it means getting into the playoffs. It will be good experience for some of our younger guys. I just hope in signing Kane we don’t boot a younger player out of the line up, or block a roster spot next year for a younger player.

At this point in his career, Kane is no longer a 1W. He doesn’t have his foot speed as he used to, so unless this surgery miraculously turned back the clock for him, he will just be a PP weapon who should be getting sheltered minutes. He will oooo and awww the crowd and add the extra excitement that’s at times lacking.

 

[RedWingzz]

I’m all for signing Kane if it means getting into the playoffs. It will be good experience for some of our younger guys. I just hope in signing Kane we don’t boot a younger player out of the line up, or block a roster spot next year for a younger player.

At this point in his career, Kane is no longer a 1W. He doesn’t have his foot speed as he used to, so unless this surgery miraculously turned back the clock for him, he will just be a PP weapon who should be getting sheltered minutes. He will oooo and awww the crowd and add the extra excitement that’s at times lacking.

We aren't even close to a playoff team as is, so adding a 35 year old Patty Kane isn't the piece we need to suddenly be considered a playoff team. Until management (and coaching) can admit they've made mistakes by bringing in too many washed up D, this team isn't even remotely close to the playoffs. The hot start was fun, but it looks like those were the anomalies, and the team is still straight up bad.

Larkin is pointless in 5 straight, and has 2 points in 7 games in November.
DeBrincat has picked it up of late, but still only has 4 points in November.
The team has lost 8 of it's lat 11 games.
The PP is absolutely struggling, and can't even set up in the offensive zone.
The team D is in shambles, and has allowed a whopping 24 goals against in the last 6 games.

We have NJ and Boston coming up here after a horrendous Sweden trip, so I completely expect the team to look disengaged and flat. I wish I could be more optimistic, but I'm a realist, and the reality is that the team sucks. The hot start is making it seem like were competitive, but give it 2 weeks and were closer to the bottom than we are to the playoffs.

Could they turn it around and play like they did in October? I guess they could, but until the team attempts to actually fix what is going wrong, nothing will change. Yzerman's reluctancy to make a move right now is worrisome...

but...YZERPLANNNNNNNNN and all that, right?

 

[Axel Sandy Pelikan]

We aren't even close to a playoff team as is, so adding a 35 year old Patty Kane isn't the piece we need to suddenly be considered a playoff team. Until management (and coaching) can admit they've made mistakes by bringing in too many washed up D, this team isn't even remotely close to the playoffs. The hot start was fun, but it looks like those were the anomalies, and the team is still straight up bad.

Larkin is pointless in 5 straight, and has 2 points in 7 games in November.
DeBrincat has picked it up of late, but still only has 4 points in November.
The team has lost 8 of it's lat 11 games.
The PP is absolutely struggling, and can't even set up in the offensive zone.
The team D is in shambles, and has allowed a whopping 24 goals against in the last 6 games.

We have NJ and Boston coming up here after a horrendous Sweden trip, so I completely expect the team to look disengaged and flat. I wish I could be more optimistic, but I'm a realist, and the reality is that the team sucks. The hot start is making it seem like were competitive, but give it 2 weeks and were closer to the bottom than we are to the playoffs.

Could they turn it around and play like they did in October? I guess they could, but until the team attempts to actually fix what is going wrong, nothing will change. Yzerman's reluctancy to make a move right now is worrisome...

but...YZERPLANNNNNNNNN and all that, right?

That's not being a realist. Realistically, the Wings obviously weren't as good as their hot start. They also aren't as bad as losing 8 of 11.

Also, the whiny "YZERPLAN!!?" at the end kinda gives away you're not a realist either. The Red Wings are a far better team in 2023 than they were in 2019. The minors are more stocked, they have more players who are good enough that what's going on can be considered a cold streak and not "this is as good as they get".

Why is the hot start an anomaly and not Larkin going pointless for over a week and 2 points in seven games the real thing?

What move specifically would you like him to make? Let me guess, call up Edvinsson and give him 20 minutes a night?

we shouldn't make the playoff's until we win the cup .. gotcha

It's not worth winning if you can't win big!

If you're not first, you're last!

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

 

[RedWingzz]

That's not being a realist. Realistically, the Wings obviously weren't as good as their hot start. They also aren't as bad as losing 8 of 11.

Also, the whiny "YZERPLAN!!?" at the end kinda gives away you're not a realist either. The Red Wings are a far better team in 2023 than they were in 2019. The minors are more stocked, they have more players who are good enough that what's going on can be considered a cold streak and not "this is as good as they get".

Why is the hot start an anomaly and not Larkin going pointless for over a week and 2 points in seven games the real thing?

What move specifically would you like him to make? Let me guess, call up Edvinsson and give him 20 minutes a night?



It's not worth winning if you can't win big!

If you're not first, you're last!

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

No, I'm a realist, I see things as they are. Given your response, you are an optimist, and that's fine. But pretending things are going well is not something I'm gonna do.

Let's see tonight lol. Prove me wrong Red Wings! A team defence with Petry, Holl, Chiarot, Maatta is not gonna cut it in this league, and it's showing. Let's see how they play tonight against NJ and Friday against Boston. If they lose both, and suddenly have lost 10 of 13, you still ok with that?

 

[Snuggs]

I'm not ready to say they're off the rails, but Sweeden was a huge disappointment. HUGE! Like a loss to TOR on a back-to-back... ok, but the number of goals and whatever vs OTT, disaster.

Points very valid in that these next "handful" games are basically the fulcrum of the season already...

(NJ,BOS,MIN,NYR) All good teams, 1 win or less buries the Red Wings in the standings with December just starting.

Also, 26 goals against in the last 6 games, 4.33 per game. VERY much-so, a losing formula right there.

 

[Frk It]

No, I'm a realist, I see things as they are. Given your response, you are an optimist, and that's fine. But pretending things are going well is not something I'm gonna do.

Let's see tonight lol. Prove me wrong Red Wings! A team defence with Petry, Holl, Chiarot, Maatta is not gonna cut it in this league, and it's showing. Let's see how they play tonight against NJ and Friday against Boston. If they lose both, and suddenly have lost 10 of 13, you still ok with that?

I mean you are taking a small sample size and making it smaller so it finds your agenda. You don't see that?

Even though we aren't currently playing how we did earlier this season, it happened. It shows what this team is capable of, even if they aren't doing it now. All the data matters. You can't just cut stuff out to make a point.

 

[RedWingzz]

I mean you are taking a small sample size and making it smaller so it finds your agenda. You don't see that?

Even though we aren't currently playing how we did earlier this season, it happened. It shows what this team is capable of, even if they aren't doing it now. All the data matters. You can't just cut stuff out to make a point.

I get what you're saying, but here my sample size is 11 games. We've played 17 games, so my sample size here is 65% of the season. So yeah, I understand that I'm "cherry-picking" my argument by excluding the first 6 games where the team was rolling, but I mean we've played like **** for the last 11 games, and that's two-thirds of the season.

It's just frustrating, I will always support this team, we could miss the playoffs 25 years in a row and I'll be there the next year watching all the games, but it's just frustrating that the team seems to be stuck in mediocrity.

When is the last "complete game" this team has played? We look great in spurts, but for some reason can't play with any consistency. We either go down 2,3 goals, and then work our ass off to come back, or we go up a couple and then squander the lead.

I guess the Saturday game against Boston early in November was the last time the Wings played a complete game? (and we even fell down 2-0 early in that game too)... That's not good enough.

 

[Detroit Knights]

I get what you're saying, but here my sample size is 11 games. We've played 17 games, so my sample size here is 65% of the season. So yeah, I understand that I'm "cherry-picking" my argument by excluding the first 6 games where the team was rolling, but I mean we've played like **** for the last 11 games, and that's two-thirds of the season.

It's just frustrating, I will always support this team, we could miss the playoffs 25 years in a row and I'll be there the next year watching all the games, but it's just frustrating that the team seems to be stuck in mediocrity.

When is the last "complete game" this team has played? We look great in spurts, but for some reason can't play with any consistency. We either go down 2,3 goals, and then work our ass off to come back, or we go up a couple and then squander the lead.

I guess the Saturday game against Boston early in November was the last time the Wings played a complete game?... That's not good enough.

The only games where I think we played complete games are that boston game and the first CBJ game. Last year, when we actually played the system we were promised by lalonde when he got here, we won those games every time. It would just be astounding if we could keep playing the damn system.

This is why Hanafin makes a lot of sense, even though we have a large logjam of LD right now. A left side of walman - hanafin - ed - maatta (7th d) would be an elite left side defense. Our right side is seider - ghost - chiarot, of which is not terrible at all. Chiarot has been playing pretty well and petry is dragging him down, interestingly enough.

walman - seider
hanafin - ghost
ed - chiarot
maatta

That is a very good defense that can get you into the playoffs. Or it will at least not be the reason why you don't make the playoffs. That has 4 defenseman that can play defensively defense while the other two are the main point producers from the back end. Obviously the others will produce, but we don't need to sit here and count on them to do that, it would just happen organically.

 

[RedWingzz]

The only games where I think we played complete games are that boston game and the first CBJ game. Last year, when we actually played the system we were promised by lalonde when he got here, we won those games every time. It would just be astounding if we could keep playing the damn system.

This is why Hanafin makes a lot of sense, even though we have a large logjam of LD right now. A left side of walman - hanafin - ed - maatta (7th d) would be an elite left side defense. Our right side is seider - ghost - chiarot, of which is not terrible at all. Chiarot has been playing pretty well and petry is dragging him down, interestingly enough.

walman - seider
hanafin - ghost
ed - chiarot
maatta

That is a very good defense that can get you into the playoffs. Or it will at least not be the reason why you don't make the playoffs. That has 4 defenseman that can play defensively defense while the other two are the main point producers from the back end. Obviously the others will produce, but we don't need to sit here and count on them to do that, it would just happen organically.

I'm all for bringing in Hanifin, but we'd have to trade a Maatta or something back, and boot Jeff Petry to Mars.

But yeah, a top 6 of Mo, Walman, Ghost, Hanifin, Ed would be far better than what we're seeing. The move to bring Petry in was such nonsense. Everyone knew Petry was washed up and trash, not sure how the GM didn't see it this way.

 

[Detroit Knights]

I'm all for bringing in Hanifin, but we'd have to trade a Maatta or something back, and boot Jeff Petry to Mars.

But yeah, a top 6 of Mo, Walman, Ghost, Hanifin, Ed would be far better than what we're seeing. The move to bring Petry in was such nonsense. Everyone knew Petry was washed up and trash, not sure how the GM didn't see it this way.

Yeah, we would probably trade maatta or holl (i would assume maatta) ++. We would have to waive petry and force him to want to be traded to a bad team for future considerations (sjs).

I think petry was a knee jerk reaction move tbh. I think they were wanting a 7th D that had playoff experience over lindstrom riding the bench and just took a shot. If petry would have clicked, it would have been the perfect fit, but he just hasn't and probably never will.

I do think Yzerman is trying to build a team that loves the state of michigan or at least the detroit area. When you have players that enjoy the area, they can tell their friends (other players) about the beauty in the area and not to get hung up on downtown. I think thats why we have what 4 michigan alums, and dbc, even czarnik to a lesser extent. Have these guys say they love playing here, have the team continuously get incrementally better, and then free agents start looking at detroit a little bit differently.

man, if we were able to get helly before he signed that extension, i think it would have been a complete 180 to our FA process. Players would probably start taking a lot longer looks than they currently do to our contract offers.

 

[GarlicbreadTB]

 

[Frk It]

I get what you're saying, but here my sample size is 11 games. We've played 17 games, so my sample size here is 65% of the season. So yeah, I understand that I'm "cherry-picking" my argument by excluding the first 6 games where the team was rolling, but I mean we've played like **** for the last 11 games, and that's two-thirds of the season.

It's just frustrating, I will always support this team, we could miss the playoffs 25 years in a row and I'll be there the next year watching all the games, but it's just frustrating that the team seems to be stuck in mediocrity.

When is the last "complete game" this team has played? We look great in spurts, but for some reason can't play with any consistency. We either go down 2,3 goals, and then work our ass off to come back, or we go up a couple and then squander the lead.

I guess the Saturday game against Boston early in November was the last time the Wings played a complete game? (and we even fell down 2-0 early in that game too)... That's not good enough.

Oh, I am also frustrated with how the team has played more recently, and have gotten more on board with the “Edvinsson not being on the team is ridiculous” soapbox you started the year with.

I just also think the team can play better than it has the last 10 games or so.

Honestly I like Lalonde, but I think some of its on him… as far as the team not showing up for the first period or him not deploying players the best way (see Moritz Seider).

I’ll be curious to see if we make some moves coming up? Bc if we are going to be a middle of the pack team let’s at least he one with Berggren and Edvinsson on it.

 

[SirloinUB]

Honestly, I’m struggling to understand the aversion to Kane.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not expecting a point per game player but from a fan base that consistently bitches about elite talent, I don’t get it. Kane would bring a level of pure skill above anyone we have. That’s not to say he’d be the most productive players but even on one leg, his skill and IQ can make those around him better.

Maybe it fails spectacularly and he puts up 5 goals 20 point in 55 games or whatever, but really, what does this team have to lose? He’s a free asset that has true talent well beyond anyone on our roster.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Oh, I am also frustrated with how the team has played more recently, and have gotten more on board with the “Edvinsson not being on the team is ridiculous” soapbox you started the year with.

I just also think the team can play better than it has the last 10 games or so.

Honestly I like Lalonde, but I think some of its on him… as far as the team not showing up for the first period or him not deploying players the best way (see Moritz Seider).

I’ll be curious to see if we make some moves coming up? Bc if we are going to be a middle of the pack team let’s at least he one with Berggren and Edvinsson on it.

I would love to blow up the roster with a lindholm hanafin trade. I was against lindholm but I've seen some things in his game that we need terribly right now.

I wouldn't mind a blowup of hanafin and markstrom too. But we need a shakeup of something. It all depends on what calgary wants to do but I am pretty sure they just want a retool situation, so we aren't the best trading partners.

These are the players I wouldn't mind trading (some would hurt probably):
Copp
Perron
Kostin
Fischer
Rasmussen
Usual suspects on defense minus chiarot (see my earlier comments if need be)
Ghost
Husso
Reimer
Lyon
Fabbri

So I guess, in essence:
DBC - Larkin - Raymond
x - compher - x
x - veleno - Sprong
x - Czarnick - x

walman - seider
chiarot - x
x - x

I would be willing to give any of those guys up for some type of combo (not including pick/prospects, we can add those as well obviously) of markstrom/lindholm/hanafin. If we did just that, I wouldn't complain the rest of this season.

Honestly, I’m struggling to understand the aversion to Kane.

Don’t get be wrong, I’m not expecting a point per game player but for fan base that consistently bitches about elite talent, Kane would bring a level of pure skill above anyone we have. That’s not to say he’d be the most productive players but even on one leg, his skill and IQ can make those around him better.

And look, maybe it fails spectacularly and he puts up 5 goals 20 point in 55 games or whatever, but really, what does this team have to lose? He’s a free asset that has true talent than anyone on our roster.

A lot of this discourse gives off beggars being choosers vibes.

it also makes more sense to sign him (even if we ultimately ltir or whatever) for raymond to learn from someone elite in the same position at 21 years old. His development could sky-rocket because he could learn not only the skills and whatever, but how to maneuver as a smaller player in the league for 15+ years.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Who says no???? (11x7 lineup)

dbc - larkin - kane (video just came out from seravelli(?) that teams have said his lateral movement is exceptional right now..)
Kostin - Lindholm - Raymond
Sprong - compher - veleno
Fischer - ras -

walman - seider
hanafin - ghost
ed - chiarot/holl

Husso
lyon/reimer

Don't know why I put kostin - lindholm - raymond as a line but I don't hate it tbh.

 

[OneMoreTry]

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

 

[RedWingzz]

Oh, I am also frustrated with how the team has played more recently, and have gotten more on board with the “Edvinsson not being on the team is ridiculous” soapbox you started the year with.

I just also think the team can play better than it has the last 10 games or so.

Honestly I like Lalonde, but I think some of its on him… as far as the team not showing up for the first period or him not deploying players the best way (see Moritz Seider).

I’ll be curious to see if we make some moves coming up? Bc if we are going to be a middle of the pack team let’s at least he one with Berggren and Edvinsson on it.

That's exactly it. I'd rather play .500 hockey with a bunch of futures in the lineup, and see what we have in the asset, than play .500 hockey (or worse) and lose with vets that won't be on the team when we're ready to compete.

I realized I argued the Edvinsson thing to exhaustion at the start of the year, to the point where I was getting annoying, so I stopped mentioning him, and gave the current team a chance. With the state of the current D though, maybe having him on the team all year was in fact the correct call. It's impossible to say for sure that our record would be better had he been here all along, but I mean at this point, I really can't think of any reason not to call him up.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

we shouldn't make the playoff's until we win the cup .. gotcha

Work on your reading comprehension dude. How did you get that from my message,LOL?

 

[Run the Jewels]

 

[The Flying Octopus]

I wouldn’t mind entertaining the idea, especially since it would put all the hawk slappies in a total frenzy

 

[stillwater]

If you can't trust Lars Thorsell, who can you trust?

 

[Henkka]

Sign Kane, make the team better, never look back.

More talent is more talent.