Other Chicago & General Sports Thread LXI: Bulls Talk

[x Tame Impala]

Seabrook won us 3 Cups ... literally gave up his brain and body for it. I love ripping on Stan for giving Seabrook that atrocious deal. I love making fun of Seabrook in a light hearted way.

That said, Seabrook is a homegrown guy who met all expectations. Seabrook's contract is OUR mistake. So it's kind of different.

Explicitly in terms of not living up to the contract.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Pretty expensive motivational speech.

I'd take his contract + the world series over the lack of his contract + still in a drought, thank you very much. There were a lot of pieces that put the 2016 team over the top, and to a T the entire clubhouse credited him for rallying the team during the rain delay.

 

[Easy E]

Lol... forget about anyone who says Heyward was a bust... won the World Series, all past sins have been absolved.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Eh, that's a bit too simplistic, and he will need to be a better batter for our longterm goals in all likelihood, but he's firmly circled as a guy we should be eternally grateful for.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

I don't think they win in 2016 without him.

Based on what? A speech and good defense?

He hit 5/48 in 2016 playoffs.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Yeah, pretty much. As I mentioned, literally the entire team credited him for rallying the team. Pro players are a superstitious bunch, and I would not be at all shocked if heading into the clubhouse during the rain delay, the ghosts of Cubs past were bouncing around in a bunch of their heads and they were already imagining themselves added to the pantheon of disappointments of the curse. From all accounts, he played a huge role in getting the team back on focus and pumping them up, something that very probably was the make or break moment of the game and series.

 

[OhCaptainMyCaptain]

From a pure value compared to contract standpoint, he’s for sure been a bust.

But as other people have mentioned, there is more to it than that.

But yeah, I consider him a bust. Still glad to have him on the team, though, if that makes sense.

Feel bad for him that he won’t be able to play right field anymore. Pretty excited to see Bryce out there, though.

 

[AmericanDream]

are there any worse contracts in baseball currently than Heyward?? I am asking on a pure monetary value vs performance...who else has an ugly contract right now?

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Pujols jumps to mind.

 

[TLEH]

Chris Davis 100%

 

[HawksBeerFan]

Chris Davis contract is pretty bad too.

Heyward's is probably top 5.

 

[MurrayBannerman]

Jacoby Ellsbury and Miguel Cabrera, too.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Yeah, pretty much. As I mentioned, literally the entire team credited him for rallying the team. Pro players are a superstitious bunch, and I would not be at all shocked if heading into the clubhouse during the rain delay, the ghosts of Cubs past were bouncing around in a bunch of their heads and they were already imagining themselves added to the pantheon of disappointments of the curse. From all accounts, he played a huge role in getting the team back on focus and pumping them up, something that very probably was the make or break moment of the game and series.

Even if you accept that story as the reason they rallied, which is unknowable, I'd submit that having league average OF play instead of him probably avoids them being in that situation in the first place.

.150 avg and OBP in the WS and that was his best round of the playoffs.

 

[piteus]

are there any worse contracts in baseball currently than Heyward?? I am asking on a pure monetary value vs performance...who else has an ugly contract right now?

The Mets are still paying Bobby Bonilla. Are the BoSox still paying Carl Crawford? Pablo Sandoval's contract runs through 2020. Yu Darvish ... but there's still some hope he comes back from injury.

Robinson Cano is on the downtrend and was suspended for PEDs. Wei In Chen of the Marlins still has $60mn left on his deal until 2021. Jake Arrieta's deal doesn't look very good anymore. Eric Hosmer of the Padres signed for $144mn last year.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Even if you accept that story as the reason they rallied, which is unknowable, I'd submit that having league average play instead of him probably avoids them being in that situation in the first place.

.150 avg and OBP in the WS and that was his best round of the playoffs.

Certainly possible, but at that point we're dealing with loads of hypotheticals versus something we actually know. Maybe a different player would mean we still would've won, or even won earlier, but maybe a worse fielder screws us over earlier, too.

 

[AmericanDream]

Chris Davis 100%

looking at his contract, that is pretty rough...his drop is massive...Heyward at least contributes in the field, but $106 mil left owed is absolutely brutal for Heyward

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Was gonna say, I don’t think Heyward’s the worst contract on the team.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Certainly possible, but at that point we're dealing with loads of hypotheticals versus something we actually know. Maybe a different player would mean we still would've won, or even won earlier, but maybe a worse fielder screws us over earlier, too.

We don't know that the speech made any difference what so ever. Players credit it and I get it, but personally I imagine something similar was said on the Cleveland side during the delay and they lost and because they did, we never hear about it.

 

[Elvis P]

I can't believe the Cub hate on here. Historically, Americans have supported underdogs and we've won one title since 1908. I thought teams such as the Yankees and Cowboys who were too successful or claimed to be America's Team were the villains. I thought we were flying the W flags and singing the Cubs song before we won the WS. Now I'm being told we started these things after the WS and we are obnoxious favorites, because we won one measly WS in 110 years. I just don't get it.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

We don't know that the speech made any difference what so ever. Players credit it and I get it, but personally I imagine something similar was said on the Cleveland side during the delay and they lost and because they did, we never hear about it.

When everybody went out of their way to volunteer his speech, I'd imagine that it at least played a role.

 

[Elvis P]

We don't know that the speech made any difference what so ever. Players credit it and I get it, but personally I imagine something similar was said on the Cleveland side during the delay and they lost and because they did, we never hear about it.

Agreed. It's super naive and speculative to think any speech has ever made any difference. (It's the stuff of fiction. Joe Montana said Rudy was pure fiction) When you walk on the court/field and know you can beat the other guy, that's what matters and makes a difference. I've only felt that confidence once, but it was awesome, and I had the game of my life.

 

[MurrayBannerman]

 

[RayP]

The right decision IMO.

 

[piteus]

Theo always said change is a good thing. No organization should remain static ... and this was an answer referring to the idea of changing manager. I don't think it should surprise anyone if Theo looks for a change next year ... short of winning or at least making a WS.

Who started the Maddon rumors? Was it Kaplan? Those Skokie guys are trouble.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Makes sense. Keep the guy that you've accomplished a lot with but leave the door open for either party to part ways if need be after next year.