Olympics 2021

[TheMoreYouKnow]

If the DFB cares so little about the Olympics they should just let another country go instead. It's kind of a disgrace and fits the image of the DFB being a rudderless ship drifting without direction or purpose.

 

[Albatros]

I think of them more as an oil platform. Motionless, backwardly, and lubricating only certain pockets.

 

[cgf]

The DFB had to submit a list of over 100 players at the start of the year, I have a hard time blaming them for only 18 of those 100 accepting the call. Especially when most of the U23 players eligible for this tourney just won the U21 euros for us two months ago, and the season starts in less than a month.

Either way, hopefully Torunarigha & Uduokhai have great tourneys and get moves off the back of this. Dream scenario would be 'righa winning a move to BVB to play on the left of Hummels & Akanji, while opening more PT for Dardai & Netz at Hertha...and Uduokhai earning a move to one of the corporate clubs (Wolfsburg/Leverkusen).

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

If Spain sends guys who played their last minutes in ET vs Italy in the Euro semifinal a little over a week ago...then we can send guys who played in the U21 Euro like 6 weeks ago. Given that was a split tournament and they only played 3 of the matches in late May/early June, it's not exactly a massive requirement.

 

[cgf]

If Spain sends guys who played their last minutes in ET vs Italy in the Euro semifinal a little over a week ago...then we can send guys who played in the U21 Euro like 6 weeks ago. Given that was a split tournament and they only played 3 of the matches in late May/early June, it's not exactly a massive requirement.

That's on german clubs, not the DFB

I hate defending those idiots, but I'm not sure we can blame them for anything here.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

That's on german clubs, not the DFB

I hate defending those idiots, but I'm not sure we can blame them for anything here.

The DFB could - if it had a leadership worth calling such - apply some pressure on these clubs. And if that failed, they could indeed decline participation. I am sure the Portuguese would be able to put together a better team.

 

[cgf]

The DFB could - if it had a leadership worth calling such - apply some pressure on these clubs. And if that failed, they could indeed decline participation. I am sure the Portuguese would be able to put together a better team.

How does screwing over the 18 players who did answer the call, just because you're not satisfied with the team they are sending, make any sense? I just don't see what that's meant to accomplish other than to show everyone that we'll throw a hissy fit if we don't get your way, and make us less welcome in the future *shrug*

I also don't see why you're making such a big deal out of this...not like they're sending a B-team to the EM/WM, or even the U19/U21 Euros. It's just the olympics

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

How does screwing over the 18 players who did answer the call, just because you're not satisfied with the team they are sending, make any sense? I just don't see what that's meant to accomplish other than to show everyone that we'll throw a hissy fit if we don't get your way, and make us less welcome in the future *shrug*

I also don't see why you're making such a big deal out of this...not like they're sending a B-team to the EM/WM, or even the U19/U21 Euros. It's just the olympics

I think if we had to decline participation then there would be an outcry which would force the clubs to be more cooperative in the future. The only reason the clubs are acting like this is because they think it's going to not be noticed by the wider public.

I think the disregard shown for the Olympics is somewhat short-sighted. It clearly captures a lot of attention, especially in the emerging markets. It's very insular and backwards to think a U21 Euro is somehow more important than the Olympic Games. I guarantee you that view isn't held anywhere else in spite of FIFA's efforts to keep the Olympics small as a rival competition. I think the DFB should aim to win every competition it participates in, and that includes the Olympics.

 

[cgf]

I think if we had to decline participation then there would be an outcry which would force the clubs to be more cooperative in the future. The only reason the clubs are acting like this is because they think it's going to not be noticed by the wider public.

I think the disregard shown for the Olympics is somewhat short-sighted. It clearly captures a lot of attention, especially in the emerging markets. It's very insular and backwards to think a U21 Euro is somehow more important than the Olympic Games. I guarantee you that view isn't held anywhere else in spite of FIFA's efforts to keep the Olympics small as a rival competition. I think the DFB should aim to win every competition it participates in, and that includes the Olympics.

But we don't have to decline, we would be choosing to decline.

And you're really overblowing the olympics. Thinking that the u19 or u21 euros are more important competitions, isn't exactly a niche POV and players already play enough games without sending them to multiple NT tournaments.

Like what would be the benefit of sending the best team we could? Those players start their club seasons in worse form or become more vulnerable to injuries just so we have better chances of winning a meaningless medal?

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

But we don't have to decline, we would be choosing to decline.

And you're really overblowing the olympics. Thinking that the u19 or u21 euros are more important competitions, isn't exactly a niche POV and players already play enough games without sending them to multiple NT tournaments.

Like what would be the benefit of sending the best team we could? Those players start their club seasons in worse form or become more vulnerable to injuries just so we have better chances of winning a meaningless medal?

It's hardly meaningless. It's an Olympic medal. I bet you that features more prominently in an athlete's house than a U19 Euro medal or something. 9 million people watched Germany win Silver in 2016. That's considerably more than the Euro 21 final...

With regard to the club seasons, I don't think it's that big a deal. Again, if Leipzig is letting frickin Dani Olmo go for Spain then that complaint goes out the window.

 

[cgf]

It's hardly meaningless. It's an Olympic medal. I bet you that features more prominently in an athlete's house than a U19 Euro medal or something. 9 million people watched Germany win Silver in 2016. That's considerably more than the Euro 21 final...

With regard to the club seasons, I don't think it's that big a deal. Again, if Leipzig is letting frickin Dani Olmo go for Spain then that complaint goes out the window.

A) what's fine for one player isn't fine for all players
B) we don't know that Olmo won't have a bad season because he's exhausted

C) that's influenced significantly by how long it had been since we had qualified for the olympics, I bet that number is way down this time around.
D) And I dunno what to tell you but the Olympics just aren't that important in this sport; clubs send fewer scouts to that tourney & FAs put less importance on it

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

A) what's fine for one player isn't fine for all players
B) we don't know that Olmo won't have a bad season because he's exhausted

C) that's influenced significantly by how long it had been since we had qualified for the olympics, I bet that number is way down this time around.
D) And I dunno what to tell you but the Olympics just aren't that important in this sport; clubs send fewer scouts to that tourney & FAs put less importance on it

Again, you don't have to tell me where the Olympics traditionally rank in this sport. But I think it's changing. As we have more of a global audience for the game, the Olympics gain in status. It's a massive brand and most of the new audiences don't know about the way FIFA has treated the Olympics. When Neymar won the Gold for Brazil in a sold out Maracana in 2016 and called it the greatest moment of his life - do you think the guys broadcasting that across the world were like "oh this is a 2nd rate tournament, nobody cares"? Obviously not. If you're in the DFB and you're not interested in making that platform work for you, you suffer from a decided lack of vision.

 

[cgf]

Again, you don't have to tell me where the Olympics traditionally rank in this sport. But I think it's changing. As we have more of a global audience for the game, the Olympics gain in status. It's a massive brand and most of the new audiences don't know about the way FIFA has treated the Olympics. When Neymar won the Gold for Brazil in a sold out Maracana in 2016 and called it the greatest moment of his life - do you think the guys broadcasting that across the world were like "oh this is a 2nd rate tournament, nobody cares"? Obviously not. If you're in the DFB and you're not interested in making that platform work for you, you suffer from a decided lack of vision.

There was absolutely a patronizing tone of "oh that's nice...wonder how they'll do in 2 years when the real tournament starts..." when Neymar won his olympic gold. It may be rising in viewership with the overall rise in football viewership, as all tournaments are, but it's nowhere near what it was before the World Cup rose to prominence.


Ultimately I just don't see the point of being upset about this, like...is Havertz going to develop better if he had gone from the Euros to this tourney instead of getting a little rest before diving into preparation for his season at Chelsea...getting his first training camp in with Tuchel? Is the answer any different for Musiala, Wirtz, or Baku? I think it's a resounding no for all 4, right?

If you're with me this far, then who would benefit from a tourney of this caliber? My answer is B-level vets who won't play for the senior team, like Arnold...who you would be punishing by turning down our invitation...2nd tier young talents who are unlikely to be staples for the senior team, like Uduokhai, Raum, Richter, etc...and top tier young talents who should be close to cracking the senior team but whose development has hit some snags the past few years, like Torunarigha, Henrichs, Maier & Amiri, and who are now looking unlikely to become senior NTers.

When I filter those options for who is healthy, didn't change clubs this summer, and not there...Dennis Geiger is the only eligible U23 player who comes to mind for me, and I'm not about to get mad because they couldn't get one kid who should be there

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

There was absolutely a patronizing tone of "oh that's nice...wonder how they'll do in 2 years when the real tournament starts..." when Neymar won his olympic gold. It may be rising in viewership with the overall rise in football viewership, as all tournaments are, but it's nowhere near what it was before the World Cup rose to prominence.


Ultimately I just don't see the point of being upset about this, like...is Havertz going to develop better if he had gone from the Euros to this tourney instead of getting a little rest before diving into preparation for his season at Chelsea...getting his first training camp in with Tuchel? Is the answer any different for Musiala, Wirtz, or Baku? I think it's a resounding no for all 4, right?

If you're with me this far, then who would benefit from a tourney of this caliber? My answer is B-level vets who won't play for the senior team, like Arnold...who you would be punishing by turning down our invitation...2nd tier young talents who are unlikely to be staples for the senior team, like Uduokhai, Raum, Richter, etc...and top tier young talents who should be close to cracking the senior team but whose development has hit some snags the past few years, like Torunarigha, Henrichs, Maier & Amiri, and who are now looking unlikely to become senior NTers.

When I filter those options for who is healthy, didn't change clubs this summer, and not there...Dennis Geiger is the only eligible U23 player who comes to mind for me, and I'm not about to get mad because they couldn't get one kid who should be there

Well I'm not *that* upset about it. Aside from my selfish motivation of wanting to watch meaningful football involving Germany, I would say that a good performance there would (1) be a great experience for the players and (2) would be beneficial to Germany's reputation as a powerhouse in this sport. If it gets even a few kids into the sport who were turned off by Germany's performance at the last World Cup and Euro...then that's a win.

 

[cgf]

Well I'm not *that* upset about it. Aside from my selfish motivation of wanting to watch meaningful football involving Germany, I would say that a good performance there would (1) be a great experience for the players and (2) would be beneficial to Germany's reputation as a powerhouse in this sport. If it gets even a few kids into the sport who were turned off by Germany's performance at the last World Cup and Euro...then that's a win.

I don't think it really matters. Either Flick fixes Jogi's mess and the NT becomes exciting again even if Kuntz' crew goes out in the group stages; or Flick fails to cover up for our CBs and even a gold medal wouldn't get kids hyped for the NT. If the NT can't contend at the major tournaments, then no one will care about how we do at the Olympics, Nation's League, U21s, or U19s.

So the best thing this tourney could do for our NT would be to giving our mobile, left-footed, CBs who are about to graduate from the youth teams, a platform to put themselves in senior NT consideration...which, with Uduokhai & Torunarigha, they have done.

 

[gary69]

I think that at least historically, Olympics have had a positive influence on some of the future greats. For example, Romario - Bebeto started their partnership in 1988 that led them to WC in 1994. Klinsmann and Riedle were also contributors in that same tournament and the former was pivotal in WC 1990 title and Riedle was a good squad member in Italia'90 as well.

Tournaments like these could be important for a young player's career and shouldn't be discarded in favour of a youngster playing a couple of pre-season friendlies and practice time with their club. I like the Spanish approach, although not necessarily picking players that already took part at the Euros.

 

[cgf]

I think that at least historically, Olympics have had a positive influence on some of the future greats. For example, Romario - Bebeto started their partnership in 1988 that led them to WC in 1994. Klinsmann and Riedle were also contributors in that same tournament and the former was pivotal in WC 1990 title and Riedle was a good squad member in Italia'90 as well.

Tournaments like these could be important for a young player's career and shouldn't be discarded in favour of a youngster playing a couple of pre-season friendlies and practice time with their club. I like the Spanish approach, although not necessarily picking players that already took part at the Euros.

I appreciate youth tourneys, I just don't see what makes this one more important than the U21s or U19s. I can't speak for NTs outside of UEFA, but if we wanna look at the names who won trophies at the youth levels, then I'm pretty sure that the winners of the U19s euros will have a lot more stars than any other...at least for german kids, I know that to be true.

That's why I have no qualms with our FA having prioritized the U21 & senior team euros for our top young talents this summer; and don't mind them having mostly avoided taking kids to multiple tourneys...especially with the cramped season that they are all coming off of.

 

[gary69]

I appreciate youth tourneys, I just don't see what makes this one more important than the U21s or U19s. I can't speak for NTs outside of UEFA, but if we wanna look at the names who won trophies at the youth levels, then I'm pretty sure that the winners of the U19s euros will have a lot more stars than any other...at least for german kids, I know that to be true.

That's why I have no qualms with our FA having prioritized the U21 & senior team euros for our top young talents this summer; and don't mind them having mostly avoided taking kids to multiple tourneys...especially with the cramped season that they are all coming off of.

U 19's for sure most of the time, but U21's not so much, best young players have grown beyond those teams usually by that time.

Cramped seasons because of Covid is a valid argument though. But all of this was known well before and the DFB and the clubs should have planned everything well in advance. So much for German reputation regarding organization (but I do understand the tug of war between clubs and DFB)

 

[cgf]

U 19's for sure most of the time, but U21's not so much, best young players have grown beyond those teams usually by that time.

Cramped seasons because of Covid is a valid argument though. But all of this was known well before and the DFB and the clubs should have planned everything well in advance. So much for German reputation regarding organization (but I do understand the tug of war between clubs and DFB)

They planned, that's why Wirtz & Baku were there to carry the U21 team to victory

We just don't have the depth for the euros, u21s, & olympics without kids playing multiple tourneys in one summer. If we could send Havertz, Musiala, Wirtz, & Baku to Tokyo too, then I'd like our chances even against Spain & Brazil...but I can't blame any of those players for not wanting to play a 2nd tournament.

 

[Eye of Ra]

sweden vs usa starts soon, 10.30

usa win or draw

 

[Eye of Ra]

sweden won 3-0 over usa

 

[luiginb]

I don't usually watch women's football, but I just tuned in for the Japan-Canada match and the Canadian scorer has 300 international matches and 180 international goals. Take that Messi & Ronaldo!!

 

[Albatros]

In men's football Olympic fixtures and such do not count as international caps, many players would have more appearances and goals than they officially do now if they would.

 

[John Price]

sweden won 3-0 over usa

USA was just flat early. Sweden dominated and had more shots on goal. It could have been 3-0 early on in the game but US made some big plays to stay in it. And then the doors came down 2nd half.

 

[East Coast Bias]

Dutch women win 10-3 over Zambia.

I'm assume we're going to do the thing we did last Olympics when the US women beat up Thailand where we call the Dutch classless? Poor sports. Poor example. They should apologize.

Lots of Canadians were very concerned about Sportsmanship last time!