OEL on the move?

[Jormungandr]

Because you're taking away a player they have penciled in for a position that's on an ELC, which is super important to cap teams. He's not really available.

Making a trade of OEL to, say Boston for example, is almost guaranteed to include us taking on a cap dump. It’s why you see players like Berglund, and Sobotka included in an O’Reilly trade. So the “wild ass” swing in salary is a severe display over exaggeration on your part. And an entry level contract is not the only way to find a low salary bottom six center. There will be plenty available in free agency for a team looking to win right now. Hell Brad Richardson could be available for 1mil more than likely.

 

[XX]

Making a trade of OEL to, say Boston for example, is almost guaranteed to be include us taking on a cap dump. It’s why you see players like Berglund, and Sobotka included in an O’Reilly trade. So the “wild ass” swing in salary is a severe display over exaggeration on your part. And an entry level contract is not the only way to find a low salary bottom six center. There will be plenty available in free agency for a team looking to win right now. Hell Brad Richardson could be available for 1mil more than likely.

Boston doesn't have a great pool and Studnicka is heir apparent to Krejci's spot. The FA market is really bad and continues to get bad for centers. Granlund, Soderberg, and Haula are basically the top FA centers available this year. Studnicka at 770k for two years is super valuable to them. ELC players are gold to cap teams. That's why DeBrusk is in trade rumors and not Studnicka.

Boston fans are entirely correct when they say he's not really available. There are easier ways to make guys like Moore and Ritchie go away.

 

[Jormungandr]

Boston doesn't have a great pool and Studnicka is heir apparent to Krejci's spot. The FA market is really bad and continues to get bad for centers. Granlund, Soderberg, and Haula are basically the top FA centers available this year. Studnicka at 770k for two years is super valuable to them. ELC players are gold to cap teams. That's why DeBrusk is in trade rumors and not Studnicka.

Boston fans are entirely correct when they say he's not really available. There are easier ways to make guys like Moore and Ritchie go away.

I understand the “super valuable” position you’re trying to take. Cheap contracts are valuable. I get it. My argument is Studnicka doesn’t have the top line potential that should hold up a trade for a top pair dman because he’s on an entry level contract. Cheap players are always available. My desire for him is to solve the long term 3c position. It’s a valuable position considering we always have issues with filling out our roster with centers. Hell, he really hasn’t proven any more than Lane Pederson has in the A.

 

[_Del_]

Making a trade of OEL to, say Boston for example, is almost guaranteed to include us taking on a cap dump

They don't have a big money dump. moore is the closest thing. Their money is in good players not guys they'd throw in to make money work.

 

[_Del_]

My desire for him is to solve the long term 3c position

I think Frederic is just as capable of becoming that and more, and he'd actually be more available because he's seen as less ready.

 

[XX]

Hell, he really hasn’t proven any more than Lane Pederson has in the A.

I think the Boston org. feels very differently. Frederic fits the mold you are looking for better and is probably much more attainable. There's a lot of options for Boston to explore in terms of LD that don't involve trading Studnicka as well. OEL doesn't have an unlimited market. I'd be perfectly happy with DeBrusk as the principle return with good sweeteners.

 

[Jormungandr]

I think Frederic is just as capable of becoming that and more, and he'd actually be more available because he's seen as less ready.

If that were true then Boston wouldn’t consider Studnicka so unavailable. I think the disconnect here is the overrating of Studnicka. I like him, I do, I’ll admit. But the heir apparent to Krejci? No. I think he’s a safe bet to be a 3c for a good chunk of his career. A 2c is possible but not realistic IMO. Of course I could be way wrong in the end. I only watch from OHL live.

edit: to be clear for the inevitable OHL live remark. I know Studnicka didn’t play in the ohl last year. I’m not basing my opinion of him from just last year.

 

[Jormungandr]

I think the Boston org. feels very differently. Frederic fits the mold you are looking for better and is probably much more attainable. There's a lot of options for Boston to explore in terms of LD that don't involve trading Studnicka as well. OEL doesn't have an unlimited market. I'd be perfectly happy with DeBrusk as the principle return with good sweeteners.

I get what you are saying. I do. I like Frederic as well. I just think he’s a future 4th line center with the shot at a 3c. With Studnicka he has the outside shot at blossoming into a 2nd line center. I prefer to ask for the player that is slightly better than settle for lesser player when it comes to OEL.

I guess I should add that I don’t subscribe to the HF boards hive mind when it comes to player values. I don’t think he’s he’s worth junk because his contract sucks. I believe he’s not going to return his max value because of it and his play as of late, but he should still return a decent haul.

 

[RABBIT]

What did I miss? What is happening Friday that could be telling for this franchise?

 

[XX]

I get what you are saying. I do. I like Frederic as well. I just think he’s a future 4th line center with the shot at a 3c. With Studnicka he has the outside shot at blossoming into a 2nd line center. I prefer to ask for the player that is slightly better than settle for lesser player when it comes to OEL.

You can ask for whatever, but you have to consider the strengths and needs of your counterparty. Boston would much, much rather parlay DeBrusk's value into an LD answer because he is owed a raise. There's nothing forcing them to target OEL either, as this year has a pretty solid number of D in FA and available in trade that don't cost as much.

I think if you agree to DeBrusk, Moore ($$), Ritchie ($$), you can ask for two nice sweeteners because you're going right down the plate for what Boston wants to do. That has value to them.

In a vacuum, yeah you should be able to get Studnicka in an OEL deal. But if you consider market factors and team needs/wants, it's not a realistic ask, nor is it the ask that gets you the most value from Boston.

 

[_Del_]

If that were true then Boston wouldn’t consider Studnicka so unavailable

It would be if they think Studnicka fills a roster spot immediately going forward as their core ages and Frederic needs time... They have a window to consider. It's the same reason teams trade futures for talent.

 

[Mosby]

What did I miss? What is happening Friday that could be telling for this franchise?

Armstrong challenged Tocchet to a fight. If he can pin him he gets to keep his job.

 

[hbk]

What did I miss? What is happening Friday that could be telling for this franchise?

Just me and my theory that all bad news gets done on a Friday.

 

[Jormungandr]

You can ask for whatever, but you have to consider the strengths and needs of your counterparty. Boston would much, much rather parlay DeBrusk's value into an LD answer because he is owed a raise. There's nothing forcing them to target OEL either, as this year has a pretty solid number of D in FA and available in trade that don't cost as much.

I think if you agree to DeBrusk, Moore ($$), Ritchie ($$), you can ask for two nice sweeteners because you're going right down the plate for what Boston wants to do. That has value to them.

In a vacuum, yeah you should be able to get Studnicka in an OEL deal. But if you consider market factors and team needs/wants, it's not a realistic ask, nor is it the ask that gets you the most value from Boston.

That’s a good reply. I agree . I’m just saying I’d push for 2 of those 3 assets. Not saying we’d ultimately get them.

 

[WrinkledPossum]

How can "stripping it down" not include trading the only two decent trade-chips you have over the age of 25?

We could get some good picks for Demers and Goligoski, especially if we retain. With the cap situation in the league a first maaay be had if we retained 50% on them. If not then a 2nd+. Moving them would change the dynamic in the room a lot. Demers sounds like he's one of the most popular players in the room. Sounds like a good dude but laid back.

We could also move one of the younger, soft forwards like Schmaltz.

Grabner could be moved for a player who'd make a bigger impact. (Roussel)

Kuemper still sounds possible to go.

I also get the feeling we don't want picks for this draft with Armstrong not being able to draft. He has a five year plan, so it would make sense to skip on this draft.

If we move 2 Dmen, 2 forwards, and let Vinny walk (+Hall). That would let us bring in 6 new players, a third of the lineup.

 

[Jormungandr]

It would be if they think Studnicka fills a roster spot immediately going forward as their core ages and Frederic needs time... They have a window to consider. It's the same reason teams trade futures for talent.

My whole point is that Boston HAS a window. A very limited window IMO. And you shouldn’t consider a prospect like Jack Studnicka as a non starter for an actual top pair defenseman. It doesn’t matter if he’s on an entry level contract or not IMO. It’s a replaceable contract/spot in a lineup. For example, Tyler Pitlick is a fantastic bottom line player who wouldn’t be much more expensive than the Studnickas ELC and was great for the Flyers this past year.(kinda hoping we sign him for our fourth line to play the gritty 2nd and 3rd effort forward Armstrong talks about) Especially if you’re losing Krug and Chara. This is exactly what teams in Boston’s position should be doing. Go for it. If the opportunity arises, you dump the picks and prospects for RIGHT now players. No one cares what happens 2 or 3 years down the road If you bring the cup home. That’s my opinion at least.

 

[rt]

Armstrong challenged Tocchet to a fight. If he can pin him he gets to keep his job.

Damn. I couldn’t place odds on that. Between those two and Scott Walker and Mark Bell, I honestly think we could take the Montreal staff.

 

[Grimes]

Adding DeBrusk allows us to move Schmaltz much easier. Which player do you think has more untapped potential?

 

[Grimes]

Love the avatar @hbk

 

[hbk]

Love the avatar @hbk

8 Ball!

 

[Jormungandr]

Adding DeBrusk allows us to move Schmaltz much easier. Which player do you think has more untapped potential?

Boston was offering DeBrusk for Schmaltz before they(Chicago) traded him here. Why not straight up?

 

[_Del_]

Adding DeBrusk allows us to move Schmaltz much easier. Which player do you think has more untapped potential?

Like production? Schmaltz. Neither one is exactly the model of consistency.

 

[Jamieh]

Boston was offering DeBrusk for Schmaltz before they(Chicago) traded him here. Why not straight up?

I doubt Debrusk is getting Schmaltz 's contract. I also highly doubt Boston wants it.

 

[Jakey53]

Don't care. He's not there to be a franchise player

We need smart players who know when and where to rough things up, not some air head.

 

[WrinkledPossum]

My whole point is that Boston HAS a window. A very limited window IMO. And you shouldn’t consider a prospect like Jack Studnicka as a non starter for an actual top pair defenseman. It doesn’t matter if he’s on an entry level contract or not IMO. It’s a replaceable contract/spot in a lineup. For example, Tyler Pitlick is a fantastic bottom line player who wouldn’t be much more expensive than the Studnickas ELC and was great for the Flyers this past year.(kinda hoping we sign him for our fourth line to play the gritty 2nd and 3rd effort forward Armstrong talks about) Especially if you’re losing Krug and Chara. This is exactly what teams in Boston’s position should be doing. Go for it. If the opportunity arises, you dump the picks and prospects for RIGHT now players. No one cares what happens 2 or 3 years down the road If you bring the cup home. That’s my opinion at least.

Boston has had a window for like 10 years. They aren't going to make any decisions that will make that window close in the future. If they view Studnickas as a a cheap roster player or a replacement for Krejci then they're going to keep him. Pasta and McAvoy are young. Marchand and Task have many good years left. They look to have a hole at C in a 2+ years. They won't want to make that hole larger than it already is. They likely value Studnicka more than he actually is worth.

It would be much smarter to ask for prospects they're willing to part with.