Confirmed with Link: Nylander Re-signs (6 yrs x $6.9 AAV) Pt III

[hotpaws]

Burke lost a fair bit of credibility when he stated the Leafs are not a contender. Um, take a look at the standings pal, consider that we're adding a top line forward in Nylander to that team that's already in a virtual tie for 1st overall and then consider how many games Matthews has missed. Nope sorry but I don't accept Burke as any kind of authority on anything after that comment, the guy was just so angry you would have though he had to pay Nylander himself, take that guy's opinions at your won risk I say. And LOL Cherry, he ridiculed the contract because Nylander is a 20 goal scorer and then said Marner's agent must be thrilled - um, how many goals did Marner score? I love Cherry but come on now, we all know he's way out there at times, don't we?

who gives a damn what Burke says/thinks , the guys is a bitter fool who's failed multiple times

outside of being very good at promoting himself he's been no better than Feaster who also has a cup on his resume

i always did find him entertaining however and he's perfect for what he's doing now since i don't put much stock in any of there opinions

 

[PromisedLand]

500k or 8% of what he should be making. If everyone that comes up for contract gets an 8% bump then assuming a cap of 80m is like 6.4million dollars OR Jake Gardiner as a contract. That's the correct way to look at this stuff.

Given the way his contract is structured; if nylander fails to live up to his contract he is going to be dealt; whether or not he will have the same "value" as he does now is another question

 

[Walshy7]

It's kinda frustrating now thinking about how it played out.
7x6 was fair enough. That was Pasta plus inflation. There were so many rumors of Nylander starting at 8 and Leafs at 6, and we waited till 30min before to the deadline to meet in the middle?
I'm angry at someone, I just don't know who was the stubborn one in this situation.

It could well be both. Dubas said willy called him at 4:15 and said let’s make a deal. Perhaps both were sure the other would blink.

 

[Brobust]

For some reason, it won't let me insert the link. But look up Andrew Berkshire's article on Sportsnet.

Nylander is an amazing, bordering on elite offensive player. He'll also help Toronto's defence by a huge amount with his ability to transition the puck and his takeaway ability.

 

[Warden of the North]

the way the league has gone is we should be paying the stars coming out of there elc's and the roughly 30 yr old ufa's should be taking the hit since most under perform there ufa deals

Yes. Thats whats happening. Only the truely exceptional players are cashing in in their late 20s.

I heard an interesting take that the older guys may make this an issue with the PA and ask for further RFA restrictions to be put in place in the next collective agreement, which I could see GMs liking.

 

[therealkoho]

Ooh your salty tears are going to delicious when plugs like brown are traded instead.

The anti-nylander brigade using mental gymnastics to justify the deal as “he will be gone in July” is outrageously funny

Could nylander be traded? Of course, so could marner if someone wants to pay through the nose for elite talent you have to take it

i get it but the logic is flawed, Brown for a 2nd does exactly what for the Leafs, when you still have to replace him with a guy making a million less, what is gained when you need 4m or so in space?

moving the bigger money for picks and/or prospects actually opens a door to flexibilty and allows you to keep the biggest dogs

 

[Mess]

Not to mention Nylander gets UFA in 6 years, not 7 or 8. Win Nylander.
Plus he suffered no loss for missing 2 months as the Leafs receive little to no cap bonus years 2-6.
Win Nylander.
This counts as a year.
So next year is a 5 year deal to UFA.

What will make Leafs management look bad is if the CBA is reopened next year and there is a lockout.

Lewis Gross got Willy a $8.3 mil signing bonus guaranteed on July 1st 2019 and only a mere $700k base salary which is the only part at risk if there is a lockout..

On the surface it looks like a management front-loading making the contract moveable once that SB is paid (which is true), but as far as Nylander is concerned his deal is now lockout protected as he will be getting 40% or $17.7 mil in his bank account in the next 6 months, and then can sit around relaxing if there is a work stoppage as he will be rewarded handsomely for holding out and missing 2 months this year.

Two sides to every story and while Nylander is in greater risk now of being traded he is also being well compensated above market comparables for his time and effort.

 

[Joey Hoser]

I heard an interesting take that the older guys may make this an issue with the PA and ask for further RFA restrictions to be put in place.

I can't imagine them having a very strong case for that.

 

[PromisedLand]

Voting:
Good deal for Nylander; Poor deal for the Leafs


Until unless nylander proves it wrong with his on-ice performance (i hope he does); me thinks leaf over paid slightly

 

[34]

Both sides win.

 

[Walshy7]

Yes. Thats whats happening. Only the truely exceptional players are cashing in in their late 20s.

I heard an interesting take that the older guys may make this an issue with the PA and ask for further RFA restrictions to be put in place.

The old guys can go f*** themselves. Too f***ing bad you guys are missing out now. Even if they restrict RFAs more then the money won’t go to the old guys. Remeber with RFAs getting their money now they probably will vote to lessen rfa restrictions in truth because some of them are still RFAs after their 2nd deal.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

I'd describe the signing as a mediocre contract for the Leafs, but one that still gives them everything they needed. For the player, this is obviously good. It's a lot of money, it's got long-term security, he gets to play and he gets to stay. But overall, it's neither problematic or great.

I've said it before. I have no idea how people think who says that he should have gotten $6.5M and that they need to trade him now. Even if that's the case, that's 400K overpayment. I wonder why the same posters barely acknowledge the Marleau or Zaitsev contracts, where you're talking about multi-million overpayments.

Nylander might be traded. I doubt it, considering the consistent message from management. But he might. But if it happens, it will be because the trade in itself is beneficial to the Leafs, not because their whole cap structure falls apart due to 400K, or out of spite because the negotiations were tough.

Good deal for Nylander, average (not poor) deal for the Leafs.
The team made the greater consessions IMO.

Agree with all the points that are bolded above. OK (fair to midland) deal for the Leafs, but good for Willy.

Its a tough balancing act trying to keep replacing good but non-core players once they get older and need to get paid more. A couple of bad drafts (the best source for low cost ELC replacement players) along with some overpayments such as those that are in bolded blue above can get us into that position unfortunately. Its tougher to do than it looks, or than some want to admit.

 

[Babcocks Marner]

Yup!

here is hoping matthews and marner agents don't use this analogy in bargaining or else either we over pay for them to be here at training camp or they are dec. 1st signing as well

I love Marner, and even I don't think he is worth 9mil.
You know their agent is going in there saying Nylander got 7.5. If Marner ends up with 90ish points, how can you say with a straight face he doesn't get 9?
My dream of Nylander 6.5, Marner 8, and Matthews 10.5 is dead

 

[thewave]

You've evaluated his worth down to a specific percentage?

What if he scores like, 3-5 more goals or assists than you predict? Then he's worth it.

Seems like a pretty flimsy premise to me.

Yeah, the same value as Ehlers. That's what he is worth to me and no more or less. I think that in hindsight the team is going to wish they did not leave that extra cap space dangling this year before negotiations. It was a big mistake and Nylander outsmarted us. We would have been better giving a 1 year deal to Nash or something.

 

[Mess]

Marner and matthews won’t be able to use the same loophole if they hold out. It only worked this way due to having a ton of cap space this year and structuring it aonthe 2-6 equal $7m (rounding up due to whinging from other poster) they are welcome to sit too but there won’t be a deal with this kind of “overpay” for them

That's True, but that cuts both ways..

Dubas can't afford for Leafs cap management reasons to allow for an extended negotiation with Matthews and Marner . With Marleau on the books Leafs are in some real hot soup cap wise next summer so it would be impossible to fit both Matthews and Marner into Leafs cap it they're not signed by the beginning of the season.

Essentially he can't do to them what happened with Nylander to try and squeeze the best deal out for Leafs. The deadline to sign AM an MM is game #1 of the season. That is a pressure point and in fact leverage for the agents of both Auston and Mitch.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

What will make Leafs management look bad is if the CBA is reopened next year and there is a lockout.

Lewis Gross got Willy a $8.3 mil signing bonus guaranteed on July 1st 2019 and only a mere $700k base salary which is the only part at risk if there is a lockout..

On the surface it looks like a management front-loading making the contract moveable once that SB is paid (which is true), but as far as Nylander is concerned his deal is now lockout protected as he will be getting 40% or $17.7 mil in his bank account in the next 6 months, and then can sit around relaxing if there is a work stoppage as he will be rewarded handsomely for holding out and missing 2 months this year.

Two sides to every story and while Nylander is in greater risk now of being traded he is also being well compensated above market comparables for his time and effort.

These are all things that incentivised him to play this season. Willy plays on the wing, but he proved to be a capable Center and he wants to be a centre, he has the talent and will be Draisaitl good as a centre and will be extremely valuable Center depth when Kadri wants a big pay increase.

That said, Nylander came down to 6.9x7 because of those perks. And if there is any time Leafs are not happy with the contract and need to move him, they will be able to next summer.

 

[Joey Hoser]

Yeah, the same value as Ehlers. That's what he is worth to me and no more or less. I think that in hindsight the team is going to wish they did not leave that extra cap space dangling this year before negotiations. It was a big mistake and Nylander outsmarted us. We would have been better giving a 1 year deal to Nash or something.

Nylander outstmarted us? What are you talking about?

I don't even know what the bolded means. Having extra cap space this year and dragging this on until the end worked out beneficial for both sides.

 

[Walshy7]

True but that cuts both ways ..

Dubas can't afford for Leafs cap management reasons to allow for an extended negotiation with Matthews and Marner . With Marleau on the books Leafs are in some real hot soup cap wise next summer so it would be impossible to fit both Matthews and Marner into Leafs cap it the are not signed by the beginning of the season.

Essentially he can't do to them what happened with Nylander to try and squeeze the best deal out for Leafs. The deadline to sign AM an MM is game #1 of the season. That is a pressure point and in fact leverage for the agents of both Auston and Mitch.

Matthews doesn’t need leverage imo. His floor is Eichel and ceiling Mcdavid that’s a gap of 2.25m. Marner well I can’t see him getting more than kucherov a 40 goal 100 point guy

 

[Throw More Waffles]

the way the league has gone we should be paying the stars coming out of there elc's and the roughly 30 yr old ufa's should be taking the hit since most under perform there ufa deals

I wonder if this will be a focus of the upcoming cba negotiations.

The current cba is specifically designed to keep young players contracts down. Offer sheet compensation is very high, and rarely happens.

The only real leverage a player has is sitting out the year and making no money. If the leafs weren't legitimate cup contenders this very year, they probably would have been willing to let Nylander sit if he wouldn't come down to their terms. Nylander took advantage of a somewhat rare situation where the leafs simply couldn't let him sit.

So, other than Nylanders situation, rfa's have very little leverage and it won't really change until the cba changes.

 

[hotpaws]

Yes. Thats whats happening. Only the truely exceptional players are cashing in in their late 20s.

I heard an interesting take that the older guys may make this an issue with the PA and ask for further RFA restrictions to be put in place in the next collective agreement, which I could see GMs liking.

it's easy for the PA to sell out kids who aren't even in the league (elc's) but the guys already here and would be rfa's aren't going to sit back and get bent over for older guys who want to cash in and won't be worth the money for the duration of there contract

and as a fan who understands that with a hard cap the money's all going somewhere i'd much rather give it to a kid who probably will be worth his deal than a ufa that probably won't be

the top end ufa's will still get there cash and if the Ladd's/Backes and Clarkson's don't get the retirement deals they don't deserve i really could care less

 

[Warden of the North]

I can't imagine them having a very strong case for that.

Why not? They took less when younger believing they would cash in in their late 20s. Now they get their and the cash is gone.

They make a large part of the PA and have considerable voting pressure.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

For 50 threads we were talking what the cap hit would look it in years 2-6 ......

I am truly confused on this, I'm not a cap guy at all.

There's simple way to approach this that covers the most important base. $41.77 contract for 6 years = $6.96 per year. That's the AAV which is important for (most) teams as it relates to the Cap.

 

[thewave]

Nylander outstmarted us? What are you talking about?

I don't even know what the bolded means. Having extra cap space this year and dragging this on until the end worked out beneficial for both sides.

They held us hostage with the cap we had left for this season. That's how they got his number up to 7m. The fact that close to 90% of people think this deal is fair for both is testament to why the top 10% of families hold 76% of the wealth of the world.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Matthews doesn’t need leverage imo. His floor is Eichel and ceiling Mcdavid that’s a gap of 2.25m. Marner well I can’t see him getting more than kucherov a 40 goal 100 point guy

$11.4m-$14m is the range of Eichel to McDavid for next season. Sounds about right.

 

[Gary Nylund]

We're fifth in the league in GA.

What position do we have to sit in for you to think we're adequate defensively? 1st? Or might 2nd be acceptable?

Did you watch the game last night? If you did, what did you think of our D?

I think we can win a cup with this team but it's clear that our D is our weak spot and Andersen keeps bailing them out.