Confirmed with Link: [NYI/PHI] Andrew MacDonald for Matt Mangene, 2015 2nd and 2014 3rd round picks

[Hiesenberg]

5/25 wouldn't be really that bad, it hinges on what Kimo comes back for, if at all. And if they want to keep Grossman/Coburn/Schenn. You can really offset a lot of that salary if you move one.

 

[BleedOrange]

I could live with 5/25. Not ideal, but it's not as bad as I'm sure people will make it out to be. I'd rather see 4/18, but 5/25 is ok.

4-4.5 /4yrs or we maybe surpise he may sign for 4 or less

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

If Timonen comes back, I do hope it is for cheaper. Like 3 or 4M or something... but you have to remember, the cap may not be as high as we would like because of the Canadian Dollar.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

5/25 wouldn't be really that bad, it hinges on what Kimo comes back for, if at all. And if they want to keep Grossman/Coburn/Schenn. You can really offset a lot of that salary if you move one.

I have to imagine that the only real change on the blueline is going to be Kimmo. If he comes back, I think we are looking at the same guys unless Grossmann or Coburn is dealt at the draft, which I think is unlikely. Honestly, I'm not all that interested in Kimmo coming back, unless it is at a greatly reduced price. I love the guy, one of my favorite players, but if he is looking for $6 million (or hell, even more than three or four million) I think you let him walk. I may feel differently when the time comes, but I think he's getting VERY close to the end of the line.

If the Flyers win the Cup, I think he goes out on top. If not, I think he comes back for another year. Is he really connected to this area or is there a shot he would go elsewhere if he just wants a shot at the Cup?

 

[BackWithaVengeance]

What if the Flyers offer him a 6-7 year deal till his mid 30's? Would it be enough to get the cap hit down?

Like an 6-year, 27 Mil.$ deal (4.5 Mil.$ cap hit) or an 7-year, 29.75 Mil.$ deal (4.25 Mil.$ cap hit).

 

[BleedOrange]

MacDonald has been steady since he came here and Luke has been better since they have been partners

 

[Curufinwe]

He's not worth a 7 year deal. I'd let him walk rather than do that.

 

[ericWONT]

I think resigning MacDonald should be an absolute priority this offseason. Although it wouldn't hurt to pick up a solid #1 or another D-man to basically send Grossmann packing, he really has been the piece that's been missing in the defense. There's plenty of room for improvement, and I think more little team chemistry could cause the Flyers to become Cup contenders.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

I think 6 @ 4.5M per should be fine. Only give a NTC for the first 3 years or something.

 

[dats81]

MacDonald has been solid so far in his short tenure with they Flyers but are they playing better because of him or is it just a coincidence of him joining at the right time?

I like his allround play and that he does not seem to have any major flaws but is he really that much of an improvement over Schenn/Grossmann/Gustafsson to give him an extra Million or two?
Maybe if he starts to get on the scoresheet more often...but right now I don't want him long term if his pricetag is 4.5M!

 

[TheKingPin]

MacDonald has been solid so far in his short tenure with they Flyers but are they playing better because of him or is it just a coincidence of him joining at the right time?

I like his allround play and that he does not seem to have any major flaws but is he really that much of an improvement over Schenn/Grossmann/Gustafsson to give him an extra Million or two?
Maybe if he starts to get on the scoresheet more often...but right now I don't want him long term if his pricetag is 4.5M!

The simplest explanation is often the correct one. We only started looking better after he came. He makes the rest of the group better filling his spot. There are a lot of little things that he does such as first pass, getting possession in the D zone, no turnovers, which are all subtle but very important. Plus he has been good on the island for awhile. I know they bashed him this year but this year he was playing top pair minutes and he's not top pair guy.


Id be happy with anything at or under 5 tbh. Im hoping 5 years 4.25 though.

 

[Teezax]

4 yrs 18 million, book it

 

[Hiesenberg]

4 yrs 18 million, book it

No way...too little.

 

[Tripod]

If we can't have a #1 D, the next best thing is to have 5 top 4 guys. If we lose MacD and Kimmo leaves, we are in deep trouble.

 

[jabba2]

I would pay MacDonald $5M per unless he would take less. Clear as day he'll get that on the open market, and he's young so why not? MacDonald's not a potential sunken cost like Lecaveiler or Streit will be in another year or two.

 

[dats81]

AMac teared apart statswise in this little write up: http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/3/27/5553356/a-10-game-review-of-andrew-macdonald

 

[Jtown]

AMac teared apart statswise in this little write up: http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/3/27/5553356/a-10-game-review-of-andrew-macdonald

I watched those videos. Yikes.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Yeah, I'm still not sure why we had to trade for Mac when we had/have a good Dman just sitting around.

 

[Hiesenberg]

Two losses in a row and it starts.

When they were on that streak, enough positive things couldn't have been said.

BTW, I stop reading when I see a stat called WOWY.

Screw you and your made up stat.

 

[Jtown]

Two losses in a row and it starts.

When they were on that streak, enough positive things couldn't have been said.

BTW, I stop reading when I see a stat called WOWY.

Screw you and your made up stat.

watch the videos.

 

[Harold Bingo]

I watched those videos. Yikes.

I guarantee you could put together a similar video for every defensemen that has suited up for the Flyers this season.

Perhaps I'm just being naive and not putting any weight behind these advanced stats, but to me, MacDonald's been good. And I still don't understand how shots for/shots against and the like can be attributed to just one player on the ice. It's a team game.

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

Yeah, I'm still not sure why we had to trade for Mac when we had/have a good Dman just sitting around.

While it's clear enough that the coaches don't trust Gus, MacDonald provides more depth on D, especially after shipping out Mez.

Even with MacDonald, we're two D injuries away from seeing Hal Gill in the line up every night.

 

[Random Forest]

I guarantee you could put together a similar video for every defensemen that has suited up for the Flyers this season.

Perhaps I'm just being naive and not putting any weight behind these advanced stats, but to me, MacDonald's been good. And I still don't understand how shots for/shots against and the like can be attributed to just one player on the ice. It's a team game.

To be fair, WOWY stats are designed to mitigate these effects. Those numbers track the difference in corsi when on the ice with specific players. When you look at each player's WOWY stats, you can get a general idea of who is carrying their weight.


That being said, at 5v5, MacDonald plays the bulk of his minutes with Simmonds, Schenn, and Lecavalier amidst one of their weakest 5v5 stretches of the year.

On top of that, I still hate using corsi for players like LSchenn and MacDonald. These are players who defend by blocking shots, and corsi classifies blocking shots negatively. I'd be more interested in their fenwick stats, but I'm too lazy to look it up.


Advanced stats are useful, but they are not gospel. There is a lot they don't account for. Sure, he may be a negative corsi player, but that doesn't account for the weight of his good and bad plays. A lot of what MacDonald does well, he does better than anyone else on the roster. For example, his ability to retrieve the puck in the D zone and navigate out of trouble is excellent. That's been a phenomenal improvement on our D core, and advanced stats don't shed light on it. Though their proponents will tell you that all these skills are inherently included in their stats. I'm not convinced. Especially when you're playing with weak 5v5 forwards.


EDIT: I do agree with one thing in that article if nothing else, Gustafsson deserves to be in the lineup.

 

[Hiesenberg]

watch the videos.

I can definitely find a several videos on just about every dman that gets beat.

 

[Harold Bingo]

To be fair, WOWY stats are designed to mitigate these effects. Those numbers track the difference in corsi when on the ice with specific players. When you look at each player's WOWY stats, you can get a general idea of who is carrying their weight.

Ah, I see.

I'll admit, this stuff (advanced stats) doesn't really interest me, though I can see how it can be useful when used correctly.

Right or wrong, I just enjoy watching the game on it's own.