Trade: [NY/DAL] Porzingis, Burke, Hardaway, and Lee for 2021 and 2023 1sts, DAJ, Matthews, and DSJ

[EpochLink]

The Knicks are on a 20 year ineptitude streak ever since they lost the 1999 Finals.
Outside of a couple years of playoff runs, they've been downright terrible in:

-Front office management
-Head coaching carousel
-Inconsistent draft picks
-High price free agent signings that turn out to be busts
-Ownership
-Scandals

I mean every bad team during that time seems to have gotten out of that funk (Golden State, Philadelphia, Cleveland, Toronto, LA Clippers just to name a few)...but it seems like the Knicks are the only consistently bad team that has never gotten out of it.

 

[No More Subban]

My god. What a trade for Dallas!

Luka/Porzingis duo can easily lure FAs than Luka/DSJ.

I think Porzingis will be a Maverick for a long time. He idolizes Dirk and I don't see any reason why he wouldn't want to play alongside Luka for the rest of his career. Seems like the smart thing to do for himself.

 

[No More Subban]

The pick and pop is going to be dirty next year. This is a reincarnation of Nash/Dirk in the early 2000’s. Kristaps and Luka just became the best young duo that are going to rival Ben and Embiid. Their playing styles fit so well together because Luka’s court vision is off the charts and he’s going to be able to feed Porzingis on the block all day long. I’m going to be watching so many Mavericks games next year. This trade proves the Knicks organizational dysfunction is beyond fathomable and that it won’t be easy to fix. They won’t be getting Zion unless they trade the pieces they just acquired. You just got Deandre who is a good center in this league along with DSJ who is athletically gifted and able to create his own shot off the dribble. Pair with that Zo, Frank and Knox and the Knicks are looking like a team that would end up around 11th in the east, subsequently taking them out of the conversation for Zion. This trade makes no sense for the Knicks in any way. They just cleared up cap space for free agents that will never ever join them. There is no chance Ky/KD/Klay/Kawhi/Kemba see this ineptitude and want to join the Knicks. They also just got rid of their franchise cornerstone. Who’s going to want to go there now? I have no clue how people still like the Knicks. Right across the bridge, DLo and the Nets are playing amazing basketball. It’s amazing to me how the Nets had no picks for 4 years but still have a better roster than the Knicks. I feel bad for Knicks fans.

Nice to see another Habs fan who knows basketball! I'm a Habs fan and also a Mavericks fan since 2001 (well, more of a Nowitzki fan).

Luka/Porzingis will be a must-watch next season.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Knicks are gonna Knick

 

[NJDevs26]

The funny part is when you have to defend a deal by talking about cap space for a team that just doesn't attract top FA's, that's a pretty weak defense. They cleared cap space for LeBron and company years ago and wound up with Amare and Carmelo. Players want to play in the Garden but they don't want to play for NY.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Doncic/Porzingis is going to do some damage in the coming years.

What a move by Dallas.

Knicks have a ton of cap space, but who the **** wants to play there now?

 

[Five Alarm Fire]

Again, to reiterate:
- There was little league interest in Porzingis due to the injury risk. An ACL tear for someone who's 7'3 is not an easy recovery. It's already been a year and he's likely not going to play this season.
- KP's intentions were to sign a qualifying offer and leave as a UFA in 2020. He was going to be a one year rental.
- Despite the lack of leverage, the Knicks still got DSJ, two first round picks, and $43 million in cap space. I know that cap space is a meme right now with the Knicks, but it really is valuable. Free capital is an asset more than ever now, even if they don't fill both max slots this year.
- Again, I think everyone is too quick to laugh off the possibility of FA's coming to NYC. The prospects of teaming up with another star, potentially having a top-3 pick in the mix that can also be traded, and playing at MSG can outweigh the reputation of the front office. There's been a ton of smoke, more than any other year, that players are looking at NYC.

 

[Voight]

The Knicks are on a 20 year ineptitude streak ever since they lost the 1999 Finals.
Outside of a couple years of playoff runs, they've been downright terrible in:

-Front office management
-Head coaching carousel
-Inconsistent draft picks
-High price free agent signings that turn out to be busts
-Ownership
-Scandals

I mean every bad team during that time seems to have gotten out of that funk (Golden State, Philadelphia, Cleveland, Toronto, LA Clippers just to name a few)...but it seems like the Knicks are the only consistently bad team that has never gotten out of it.

Because Dolan is incompetent and a trust fund kid. He knows good or bad the Knicks bring in a crap ton of money. He is also one of those owners who thinks he needs to be involved in everything despite hiring people to do just that.

The funny part is when you have to defend a deal by talking about cap space for a team that just doesn't attract top FA's, that's a pretty weak defense. They cleared cap space for LeBron and company years ago and wound up with Amare and Carmelo. Players want to play in the Garden but they don't want to play for NY.

Carmelo really only stayed because he spent his early years in NY and his wife is from there. Plus they were the only team who could offer him that much money.

We knew Melo wasnt serious about winning when he took a 5 year deal from the Nuggets instead of a 3 year deal like Bron & Wade.

Again, to reiterate:
- There was little league interest in Porzingis due to the injury risk. An ACL tear for someone who's 7'3 is not an easy recovery. It's already been a year and he's likely not going to play this season.
- KP's intentions were to sign a qualifying offer and leave as a UFA in 2020. He was going to be a one year rental.
- Despite the lack of leverage, the Knicks still got DSJ, two first round picks, and $43 million in cap space. I know that cap space is a meme right now with the Knicks, but it really is valuable. Free capital is an asset more than ever now, even if they don't fill both max slots this year.
- Again, I think everyone is too quick to laugh off the possibility of FA's coming to NYC. The prospects of teaming up with another star, potentially having a top-3 pick in the mix that can also be traded, and playing at MSG can outweigh the reputation of the front office. There's been a ton of smoke, more than any other year, that players are looking at NYC.

- ACL tear is a lot easier to come back from when you're as young as he is
- Maybe if they got their shit straight he would have been more open to stay. Lets not forget the fans absolutely hated that the team picked him
- Cap space is great, but when you fail to sign stars you end up paying middle tier players in a desperation attempt. By the time those 1sts materialize the Mavs will be a playoff team, with or without Porzingis.
- History has taught us players really dont care to play for the Knicks. The prestige of Playing at MSG is the biggest falsehood in the NBA, sure its historic and you have a bunch of celebs but when the team sucks there is no appeal. It has never outweighed a disaster of a front office, The Knicks have been "rumored" to sign every top free agent for the last 20 years. All they got was a worn down Amar'e.

 

[zombie kopitar]

Again, to reiterate:
- There was little league interest in Porzingis due to the injury risk. An ACL tear for someone who's 7'3 is not an easy recovery. It's already been a year and he's likely not going to play this season.
- KP's intentions were to sign a qualifying offer and leave as a UFA in 2020. He was going to be a one year rental.
- Despite the lack of leverage, the Knicks still got DSJ, two first round picks, and $43 million in cap space. I know that cap space is a meme right now with the Knicks, but it really is valuable. Free capital is an asset more than ever now, even if they don't fill both max slots this year.
- Again, I think everyone is too quick to laugh off the possibility of FA's coming to NYC. The prospects of teaming up with another star, potentially having a top-3 pick in the mix that can also be traded, and playing at MSG can outweigh the reputation of the front office. There's been a ton of smoke, more than any other year, that players are looking at NYC.

I agree with all of this

Knicks did exactly what a team in their current position should do, blow it the **** up and put themselves in a better position to get Zion this summer. Jordon and Matthews are also better trade deadline chips than Lee and Hardaway (due to contract)

Idk how much people have actually heavily watched Porzingis play, but I swear to god he's got toothpicks for legs and it makes me super uncomfortable to watch, as I'm literally just waiting for them to snap and get injured (which has already happened multiple times)

Kyrie has already basically come out and said that it's very possible he's not signing in Boston this summer, and it seems like Knicks and Lakers are front runners. Anthony Davis also allegedly prefers New York over Boston (go to r/nba for sources)

I think it's way more likely Boogie goes there before Durant...they should develop Knox at the 3, but if they get Zion it will draw more talent wanting to play there than KP ever would have.

 

[zombie kopitar]

Now the real interesting thing that has come out from this is that Porzingis is essentially cleared to play and there's been tension between him and Knicks office on when he should have been back playing. So we might see him sooner than later in Dallas and that should be fun. People should lower their expectations though, because his usage in New York was insane, he won't get that in Dallas and for the better.
KP taking up crappy shots in conjunction with putrid offensive rebounding was a huge part of the problem.

 

[Voight]

 

[cgf]

FWIW if KP really wanted out, I'd be able to accept this return...if I had any faith in this FO using that capspace to eat salary & add picks while continuing to tank for another couple of years; assuming that KD & Kawhi/Kyrie are not coming this summer...

But as long as Mills is still around, how can I trust this FO to show any patience or forward-thinking?


*sigh* If only Ntilikina had been sent to the Mavs to, then maybe jumping ship would've been easier...

 

[No More Subban]

The funny part is when you have to defend a deal by talking about cap space for a team that just doesn't attract top FA's, that's a pretty weak defense. They cleared cap space for LeBron and company years ago and wound up with Amare and Carmelo. Players want to play in the Garden but they don't want to play for NY.

Very well said.

I wonder if James Dolan knows the difference.

 

[Voight]

 

[darko]

Mavericks will apparently chase Nikola Vucevic who is UFA at the end of the season. Yes please.

 

[Avs_19]

Also, not that anyone actually believed the Knicks only looked to trade him after that meeting since there's no chance a trade comes together that quickly, Dirk was on Zach Lowe's podcast and he said he first heard about the negotiations a few days before the Mavs played at MSG the other day.

 

[Cassano]

Mavericks will apparently chase Nikola Vucevic who is UFA at the end of the season. Yes please.

Should just trade for Giannis, Goran, Mirotic and Jokic. Get the whole Euro superteam involved.

 

[No More Subban]

Should just trade for Giannis, Goran, Mirotic and Jokic. Get the whole Euro superteam involved.

Dallas could've actually picked him in his draft year but freakin' Cuban interfered with the GM. Smh.

 

[cgf]

Also, not that anyone actually believed the Knicks only looked to trade him after that meeting since there's no chance a trade comes together that quickly, Dirk was on Zach Lowe's podcast and he said he first heard about the negotiations a few days before the Mavs played at MSG the other day.

Yeah, I'm dubious of that tweet since it's previously been reported that the knicks had fairly extensive talks throughout the season with 9 other teams about KP.

 

[Bob Richards]

Knicks are banking on 2 max slot free agents and the first overall pick this off season.

Does Kyrie want to play there? What about KD as he's gonna be looking for the max contract as well.

Knicks better have tampered the shit out of the league. Like Cold War era espionage shit.

 

[Voight]

Dallas could've actually picked him in his draft year but freakin' Cuban interfered with the GM. Smh.

To be fair a lot of teams didn't want him... he wasn't highly scouted and there was a legit 50% chance he'd be another Jan Vesley. Of course the other 50% was he'd be a star, and I don't think even the Bucks knew he'd be this freaking good.

 

[darko]

Dallas could've actually picked him in his draft year but freakin' Cuban interfered with the GM. Smh.

Hard to pin that one on anyone because I don't think anyone predicted Giannis to be this good.

 

[No More Subban]

Hard to pin that one on anyone because I don't think anyone predicted Giannis to be this good.

Maybe not, but Donnie Nelson was already set to pick Giannis with their 13th overall but Cuban decided to trade down to "save some money."

Mavs' Donnie Nelson wanted to draft Antetokounmpo, Mark Cuban said no

 

[dahrougem2]

- Again, I think everyone is too quick to laugh off the possibility of FA's coming to NYC. The prospects of teaming up with another star, potentially having a top-3 pick in the mix that can also be traded, and playing at MSG can outweigh the reputation of the front office. There's been a ton of smoke, more than any other year, that players are looking at NYC.

We laugh off the possibility of FA's coming to NYC because as long as Dolan is running that team, FA's aren't going to want to sign there. Who have they signed in the last 15 years that was a significant player? Amare Stoudamire?

The summer is going to come and go and, once again, the Knicks are going to have nothing to show for it. Unless, that is, they make the same mistake of giving bad players big contracts to further screw themselves.

 

[Five Alarm Fire]

We laugh off the possibility of FA's coming to NYC because as long as Dolan is running that team, FA's aren't going to want to sign there. Who have they signed in the last 15 years that was a significant player? Amare Stoudamire?

The summer is going to come and go and, once again, the Knicks are going to have nothing to show for it. Unless, that is, they make the same mistake of giving bad players big contracts to further screw themselves.

Rumors have more credence in 2019, players use the media as an indirect way to tamper. I really do get the cynicism, but I really think this time is different.