Speculation: Now what do we do?

[Lord Stan 2020]

I don't get why trading Killorn or Palat for space for a marginal upgrade in Nielsen helps us, especially when he'll end up having to take a reduced role compared to his time on Long Island.

palat is no go for me downgrade imho

 

[HoseEmDown]

That's a false dichotomy - we have several players who could be moved to bring back a center. Palat or Killorn could be traded (straight up or as part of a package if necessary) either for a 2C or to free up the cap space to sign someone like Nielsen in free agency (assuming he's looking to win a Cup more than he is to break the bank, of course.) Garrison is unlikely to bring back an established 2C but he might fetch a young player with some potential if there's a team in enough need of a 2/3D (probably somebody around Vladdy's level - not a guaranteed upgrade so much as another chance at finding our 2C on the cheap should Vladdy not work out.) DeAngelo is another option who a lot of teams would be interested in.

Finally you have to realize that signing Bishop puts us in absolute cap hell. We can't afford all the core players we have now; what do you think will happen when it comes time to pay Bennett? Letting Bishop walk (if he won't agree to a trade) and getting our 2C some other way will at least give us the breathing room to hang onto him.

Like All In said why trade a Palat or Killorn to sign Nielsen? He's a slight upgrade on Filpulla but not worth what he'll be paid at 32 and the cost to acquire, moving out a key player isn't worth it. At 23 years old Nielsen scored 3 points in the NHL while Namestnikov had 35, let Namestnikov take the 2C job and grow into it. Namestnikov has much higher offensive upside than him and is further along in his development at this age. Nielsen is not the answer at all.

 

[LightningStrikes]

Am I the only one around here against trading Bishop?

 

[Todd1a]

might invest in new glasses

look pretty much same to me with one having a shot at showing up in playoffs and is not our guy

So you would trade Callahan for Dustin brown straight up ?

 

[Todd1a]

Heard Stamkos will most likely make a Lightning decision by the 22nd as I heard that's the Lightnings deadline when they want to know ya or na

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

So you would trade Callahan for Dustin brown straight up ?

do i get a ride on zambroni

 

[Todd1a]

do i get a ride on zambroni

What did brown do in the playoffs this season ?

 

[tjs*]

Like All In said why trade a Palat or Killorn to sign Nielsen? He's a slight upgrade on Filpulla but not worth what he'll be paid at 32 and the cost to acquire, moving out a key player isn't worth it. At 23 years old Nielsen scored 3 points in the NHL while Namestnikov had 35, let Namestnikov take the 2C job and grow into it. Namestnikov has much higher offensive upside than him and is further along in his development at this age. Nielsen is not the answer at all.

I'm not saying that's the way to go; I'm simply saying that we have options other than giving up our starting goalie as of 2017 if we really feel the need to get somebody else to play 2C.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

What did brown do in the playoffs this season ?

dude your comical

put them side by side brown has had ok stanley cup runs callahan has none

last four years of brown is 28 points what did callahan have this year and 3 of last 4 about the same

what are expections from me for callahan? 30 points? blah whatever no wouldnt trade brown for callahan cause browns contract is longer but honestly they are in rivalry of becoming the WORST contracts in hockey

and like i said browns showed up in playoffs and won cups what has callahan done? ever?

 

[HoseEmDown]

I'm not saying that's the way to go; I'm simply saying that we have options other than giving up our starting goalie as of 2017 if we really feel the need to get somebody else to play 2C.

But the other options you suggested were just as bad, trading Palat or Killorn. Until Erne looks like he can potentially replace either we can't trade away top 6 forwards.

 

[FinnLightning26]

Am I the only one around here against trading Bishop?

No, you're not.

 

[tjs*]

But the other options you suggested were just as bad, trading Palat or Killorn. Until Erne looks like he can potentially replace either we can't trade away top 6 forwards.

I don't want to trade them either, but we have a plenty of top six wings and a serious shortage of top six centers. Our best bet may well be to hope Vladdy can fill the role, but if that doesn't work out how do you propose that we acquire one?

And any of those options is infinitely better than trading Vasy which is what I was providing alternatives to. That would force us to resign Bishop which would cost us a top six forward anyway AND wouldn't allow us to resign Bennett once it came time to pay him. Unless of course we're willing to lose BOTH goalies and hope we can find someone on the cheap who won't be a complete disaster.

You shoot down my ideas but I have yet to see you provide a better one. And weren't you the guy who was suggesting that we expose Killorn or Namestnikov to expansion if Filppula won't waive rather than simply buying Flip out? Why is Killorn expendable to keep a declining third line center but not tradeable to bring back a second line center? And if Namestnikov is our 2C going forward as you're saying now, how could we even consider exposing him as you suggested earlier?

 

[CupsOverCash]

I would rather focus on our bottom six than a 2C. I think if we have some secondary scoring in our bottom six our team will be dominant.

 

[Pointerspoint]

Am I the only one around here against trading Bishop?

No, absolutely not. I can't believe how many are ready to let him leave, it boggles.

 

[HoseEmDown]

I don't want to trade them either, but we have a plenty of top six wings and a serious shortage of top six centers. Our best bet may well be to hope Vladdy can fill the role, but if that doesn't work out how do you propose that we acquire one?

And any of those options is infinitely better than trading Vasy which is what I was providing alternatives to. That would force us to resign Bishop which would cost us a top six forward anyway AND wouldn't allow us to resign Bennett once it came time to pay him. Unless of course we're willing to lose BOTH goalies and hope we can find someone on the cheap who won't be a complete disaster.

You shoot down my ideas but I have yet to see you provide a better one. And weren't you the guy who was suggesting that we expose Killorn or Namestnikov to expansion if Filppula won't waive rather than simply buying Flip out? Why is Killorn expendable to keep a declining third line center but not tradeable to bring back a second line center? And if Namestnikov is our 2C going forward as you're saying now, how could we even consider exposing him as you suggested earlier?

Who do we have as top 6 wingers outside of Palat, Kucherov, Drouin and Killorn? I wouldn't rely on Callahan if that's who you're suggesting.

Why do we need to acquire a 2C? Filpulla can be an effective 2C when asked to be, he hasn't been since Johnson has emerged so his production has dropped. Namestnikov looks like he has 55 point 2C potential. Those are my suggestions for a 2C, not a soon to be overpaid 32 year old in Nielsen. Bennett would be great but don't see a realistic trade that works.

I suggested exposing Killorn or Namestnikov because they are the current weakest of the forwards who I would protect. If Namestnikov shows he's a 2C than Killorn is exposed unless Palat or Johnson fall off the face of the earth. Buying out Filppula is another 1.6 in dead space for 4 years that with Carle's 1.8 is 3.4 we can't have. We also don't know if Filppula needs to be protected. We also can trade someone prior to the draft when the season ends to a team who has a spot open. We have a lot of internal options for a 2C instead of looking elsewhere.

 

[Todd1a]

dude your comical

put them side by side brown has had ok stanley cup runs callahan has none

last four years of brown is 28 points what did callahan have this year and 3 of last 4 about the same

what are expections from me for callahan? 30 points? blah whatever no wouldnt trade brown for callahan cause browns contract is longer but honestly they are in rivalry of becoming the WORST contracts in hockey

and like i said browns showed up in playoffs and won cups what has callahan done? ever?

Yzerman signed Callahan to that bad contract not me

 

[tjs*]

Who do we have as top 6 wingers outside of Palat, Kucherov, Drouin and Killorn? I wouldn't rely on Callahan if that's who you're suggesting.

Why do we need to acquire a 2C? Filpulla can be an effective 2C when asked to be, he hasn't been since Johnson has emerged so his production has dropped. Namestnikov looks like he has 55 point 2C potential. Those are my suggestions for a 2C, not a soon to be overpaid 32 year old in Nielsen. Bennett would be great but don't see a realistic trade that works.

I suggested exposing Killorn or Namestnikov because they are the current weakest of the forwards who I would protect. If Namestnikov shows he's a 2C than Killorn is exposed unless Palat or Johnson fall off the face of the earth. Buying out Filppula is another 1.6 in dead space for 4 years that with Carle's 1.8 is 3.4 we can't have. We also don't know if Filppula needs to be protected. We also can trade someone prior to the draft when the season ends to a team who has a spot open. We have a lot of internal options for a 2C instead of looking elsewhere.

Again, the post I was responding to said our only options for a 2C are to trade Vasy for one or stick with Namestnikov. My post in response pointed out that if we do need to bring somebody in that we have several alternatives that are superior to trading Vasy. That is the context in which you entered the debate.

Shooting down my alternatives to trading Vasy and then saying that you'd stick with what we have is pointless when I'm saying that these are our options IF we are looking to bring somebody in from outside the organization. So unless you're saying that you'd rather trade Vasy than any of the guys I mentioned then you're agreeing with me.

 

[HoseEmDown]

Again, the post I was responding to said our only options for a 2C are to trade Vasy for one or stick with Namestnikov. My post in response pointed out that if we do need to bring somebody in that we have several alternatives that are superior to trading Vasy. That is the context in which you entered the debate.

Shooting down my alternatives to trading Vasy and then saying that you'd stick with what we have is pointless when I'm saying that these are our options IF we are looking to bring somebody in from outside the organization. So unless you're saying that you'd rather trade Vasy than any of the guys I mentioned then you're agreeing with me.

I guess I'm agreeing with you. I just haven't mentioned bringing in a 2C when we have two of our own who could fill in that role without moving. I responded to the Vasilevskiy for Bennett post then yours when you suggested other options for a 2C, I'm completely against resigning Stamkos and bringing in an outside 2C unless it's a package with Filpulla going the other way.

 

[Todd1a]

I guess I'm agreeing with you. I just haven't mentioned bringing in a 2C when we have two of our own who could fill in that role without moving. I responded to the Vasilevskiy for Bennett post then yours when you suggested other options for a 2C, I'm completely against resigning Stamkos and bringing in an outside 2C unless it's a package with Filpulla going the other way.

Don't need to I think we are going to sign Stamkos to a deal before June 25th

 

[HoseEmDown]

Don't need to I think we are going to sign Stamkos to a deal before June 25th

Then we should start a who do we now trade thread if that's the case.

 

[tjs*]

I guess I'm agreeing with you. I just haven't mentioned bringing in a 2C when we have two of our own who could fill in that role without moving.

IMO Filppula isn't worthy of playing on the second line and frankly I don't even like him on the third. A guy who flat out refuses to shoot the puck and costs $5M per is not only useless, he's a liability. In any event we need his cap space to resign our core and if we can't trade him we'll have to buy him out, dead money be damned. If he can't be traded this summer I could see us carrying him for another year to minimize the length of his buyout, but he's at best a third line center at this point.

That leaves Namestnikov and while I think he has the potential to be a solid 2C he is unproven in that role. And even if he does work out if he or Johnson gets injured we don't have anybody else who can step up and perform in a top six role. Next season we could suffer through Filppula again if he's still around, but after that Point better be ready because otherwise we're looking at Boyle playing on our second line if somebody gets injured.

 

[HoseEmDown]

IMO Filppula isn't worthy of playing on the second line and frankly I don't even like him on the third. A guy who flat out refuses to shoot the puck and costs $5M per is not only useless, he's a liability. In any event we need his cap space to resign our core and if we can't trade him we'll have to buy him out, dead money be damned. If he can't be traded this summer I could see us carrying him for another year to minimize the length of his buyout, but he's at best a third line center at this point.

That leaves Namestnikov and while I think he has the potential to be a solid 2C he is unproven in that role. And even if he does work out if he or Johnson gets injured we don't have anybody else who can step up and perform in a top six role. Next season we could suffer through Filppula again if he's still around, but after that Point better be ready because otherwise we're looking at Boyle playing on our second line if somebody gets injured.

He had 25 goals and 58 points his first season here. He's more than capable of being a decent stop gap 2C. He passes way too much and doubt he gets 25 but can potentially 15-20 with close to 50 points if asked to be a 2C in an offensive role. Still don't know why you think he needs to be bought out, 5mil for someone with Filpulla's resume for 2 more years isn't some anchor, he could be easily movable.

 

[tjs*]

He had 25 goals and 58 points his first season here. He's more than capable of being a decent stop gap 2C. He passes way too much and doubt he gets 25 but can potentially 15-20 with close to 50 points if asked to be a 2C in an offensive role. Still don't know why you think he needs to be bought out, 5mil for someone with Filpulla's resume for 2 more years isn't some anchor, he could be easily movable.

Problem is his offense has fallen off the cliff the last three seasons and nobody is going to want a $5M player who only contributes defensively. That's before we even consider the issue of whether or not he requires protection in the expansion draft. I hope you're right but I just don't see us moving him easily, or at all if he requires protection.

 

[HoseEmDown]

Problem is his offense has fallen off the cliff the last three seasons and nobody is going to want a $5M player who only contributes defensively. That's before we even consider the issue of whether or not he requires protection in the expansion draft. I hope you're right but I just don't see us moving him easily, or at all if he requires protection.

I don't think his offense has fallen off that bad. His goal scoring has but I believe it's because the amount of shots he takes has gone down, I haven't looked that up so not certain. He's looked ok with a shooter like Stamkos, he needs a shooter on his wings and our only good ones he doesn't play with often. Kucherov will be with Johnson or Namestnikov and Stamkos most likely gone. So I can see him struggle a bit but it's because we lack shooters more than Filppula being bad.

 

[DFC]

Am I the only one around here against trading Bishop?

I'm with you. I think there's still a big gap between Bishop and Vasy.