Nicklas Backstrom HHOF Chances?

[Big Phil]

Yea he definitely flies under the radar but I still think his resume is good enough to remember. I see him him getting in as an Oates kind of player. One of the best passers in the league over his career if not the best same as Oates and Francis and with similar fly under the radar voting records.

I think for his under the radarness (if that is a word) then he is like those two. But he won't have the same sort of careers as them. He didn't peak quite like Oates. And will he play as long as Francis? That's a stretch. It could still get him in the HHOF though.

 

[Weztex]

No awards no first team positions no thanks

Yeah, he should be buying a ticket with his bum friends Syd Howe, Adam Oates and Mike Modano.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Yeah, he should be buying a ticket with his bum friends Syd Howe, Adam Oates and Mike Modano.

Yup

 

[Voight]

Yeah, he should be buying a ticket with his bum friends Syd Howe, Adam Oates and Mike Modano.

Oates is arguably the best passer of all time other than Gretzky.

There are FAR worse selections in the hall than the 3 you mentioned.

Well, I mean the goal posts were already established. Letang was viewed as one of the best defensemen and arguably the best defenseman in 2013 and 2016. That is a fact. In both seasons I'm considering his contributions in the playoffs. Letang put up a Smythe worthy run in 2016 and was a PPG in 2013.

When was Backstrom ever viewed anywhere near that in his career?

Also, why are people picking up on one little sentence from my quote saying Backstrom will be in the HHOF?

Here is what my stance was in the beginning of this thread "I mean, in my personal HOF Letang and Backstrom are nowhere near it, but in reality Hossa was just a first ballot with no individual awards and Doug Wilson / Kevin Lowe got in as well.

Is the argument what we feel is HHOF worthy, or is it what will actually get into the HHOF. Because Hossa is pretty clearly in the realm of Backstrom outside of the additional cups, eh?"

Letang wasn't arguably the best defenseman in either of those years. Suter and Doughty (Karlsson as well in '16) were all better. There isn't an argument for Letang.

Smythe worthy run is pushing it..... he scored a bunch of points but he was nowhere near as good as say Hedman last year, Keith in 2015, Doughty in 2014.

What exactly would you call a player that plays all situations and over 22 minutes a night?

Anyways, Letang doesn't deserve to be in the HHOF, but as I said.. him and Backstrom kind of have that "third most important player" on two teams that defined the era so they most likely make it.

..... um Backstrom the 3rd most important player? More likely 2nd......

& PIT/WSH didnt solely define the era.... theres also teams like Chicago & Boston to consider.

 

[Hobnobs]

Oates is arguably the best passer of all time other than Gretzky.

There are FAR worse selections in the hall than the 3 you mentioned.

I think he was sarcastically mocking the guy that called Bäckström a bum and actually comparing him with people in the hall with the same or similar pedigree as him.

 

[GMR]

Yeah, he should be buying a ticket with his bum friends Syd Howe, Adam Oates and Mike Modano.

Would you actually rate him above any of those players?

 

[Hobnobs]

Would you actually rate him above any of those players?

Syd Howe? Yes
Adam Oates? Up to his 14th season about equal. He doesnt have his offensive peak but Bäckström did other things better than Oates.
Modano? It might surprise you but Modano offensively was never all that much in the context of all-time greats. So it would come down to who was better defensively and so on and if that off-sets the gap in offensive production.

 

[Moridin]

Would you actually rate him above any of those players?

not really.

but if I had to pick a center between Oates, Modano and Bäckström, its not an easy choice.

 

[GMR]

Syd Howe? Yes
Adam Oates? Up to his 14th season about equal. He doesnt have his offensive peak but Bäckström did other things better than Oates.
Modano? It might surprise you but Modano offensively was never all that much in the context of all-time greats. So it would come down to who was better defensively and so on and if that off-sets the gap in offensive production.

I believe Syd Howe retired as the all-time leading point scorer. Unlike Backstrom, he was a duel threat offensively who could score goals.

 

[Hobnobs]

I believe Syd Howe retired as the all-time leading point scorer. Unlike Backstrom, he was a duel threat offensively who could score goals.

Yes, he was helped immensely by playing during the war years. Def not saying he's bad but there is a huge asterisk next to players like him and Bill Cowley who became the all-time points leader the season after Howe retired.

 

[MS]

If they don't induct Backstrom, it will be moving the bar.

There's no other player not inducted with a comparable resume. 5x top-10 in scoring with a Cup ring. Will hit 1000 points shortly.

Has basically had the same career as guys like Hawerchuk/Savard/Sittler, only with a Cup.

 

[Weztex]

Oates is arguably the best passer of all time other than Gretzky.

There are FAR worse selections in the hall than the 3 you mentioned.

That was sarcasm. I was pointing out how limited his metric was by bringing up legit HoFers who wouldn't have made the cut.

Would you actually rate him above any of those players?

My post was more me criticizing the approach than comparing Backstrom to those three but since you ask...

I have him at least on par with Modano and behind Oates. Howe is a bit tricky to rank.
I don't like the idea of a hall of fame where Sundin is in and Backstrom is out.

 

[Yozhik v tumane]

That was sarcasm. I was pointing out how limited his metric was by bringing up legit HoFers who wouldn't have made the cut.



My post was more me criticizing the approach than comparing Backstrom to those three but since you ask...

I have him at least on par with Modano and behind Oates. Howe is a bit tricky to rank.
I don't like the idea of a hall of fame where Sundin is in and Backstrom is out.

Edit: Sorry, accidentally pressed send early.

Man, you had me until the last paragraph, but I guess us Swedes are higher on Sundin than most non-Maple Leaf North Americans. I can’t fathom the idea of Sundin being a low bar of HoF entry, and I struggle to grasp the notion of Bäckström being considered superior to him. Maybe, I guess, but Sundin never had anything remotely close to a generational winger on his line in Toronto, was one of the most consistent and highest scoring centers, and perhaps the best goal scoring ditto save for Sakic in the dead puck era, and with actual quality support on the national team, he generally proved to be just as good or even better than the likes of Forsberg or Lidström.

 

[Blitzkrug]

I would argue yes. He's basically his generation's answer to Adam Oates.

Competent two way player, silky af playmaking ability, consistently good. Much like Oates he was also overshadowed by a flashier player at his peak (Hull and arguably even Neely for Oates and Ovechkin for Backstrom) and had to deal with tough competition for individual awards.

Backstrom has less points because he played in a tighter checking era so logic would dictate if you can put Oates in with no individual awards, you can put Backstrom in.

Edit: Also Backstrom has a cup which definitely not irrelevant to the selection committee

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

If they don't induct Backstrom, it will be moving the bar.

There's no other player not inducted with a comparable resume. 5x top-10 in scoring with a Cup ring. Will hit 1000 points shortly.

Has basically had the same career as guys like Hawerchuk/Savard/Sittler, only with a Cup.

an inexact comparison but john leclair is super close to your benchmarks, other than the 1,000 pts

4 x top 10s, plus a 13th (1 pt out of 11th, 2 pts out of 10th), and a 16th

and while he only won a cup in a secondary role (albeit memorable af), he did later made a finals as a key player

i’d say what backstrom lacks vs hawerchuk and savard, even sittler, is one over the top superduperstar season

edit: he’s maybe more of a federko in that respect?

 

[Hobnobs]

Edit: Sorry, accidentally pressed send early.

Man, you had me until the last paragraph, but I guess us Swedes are higher on Sundin than most non-Maple Leaf North Americans. I can’t fathom the idea of Sundin being a low bar of HoF entry, and I struggle to grasp the notion of Bäckström being considered superior to him. Maybe, I guess, but Sundin never had anything remotely close to a generational winger on his line in Toronto, was one of the most consistent and highest scoring centers, and perhaps the best goal scoring ditto save for Sakic in the dead puck era, and with actual quality support on the national team, he generally proved to be just as good or even better than the likes of Forsberg or Lidström.

Bäckström has shown himself to be somewhat equally good in best on best compared to Sundin. I agree that Sundin def didn't have a Ovechkin by his side but I don't if Bäckström should be punished for that. Sundin might be ahead of Bäckström in the "ranking" but its not a large gap and both are hofers.

 

[MS]

an inexact comparison but john leclair is super close to your benchmarks, other than the 1,000 pts

4 x top 10s, plus a 13th (1 pt out of 11th, 2 pts out of 10th), and a 16th

and while he only won a cup in a secondary role (albeit memorable af), he did later made a finals as a key player

Leclair should probably be inducted, but 4x top-10 with 800 points is substantially worse than 5x top-10 with 1000 (or really, probably 1100+ by the time he's done) points.

i’d say what backstrom lacks vs hawerchuk and savard, even sittler, is one over the top superduperstar season

edit: he’s maybe more of a federko in that respect?

I mean, he's had a 101-point 4th in scoring season that graded out at 107 adjusted points. Hawerchuk's best was 3rd in scoring with 103 adjusted points. Savard 3rd in scoring with 110 adjusted points.

He's definitely miles better than Federko.

And miles better defensively than all these guys - consistent Selke votes through his career and 7th/9th/11th/12th place finishes for that award.

6x top-3 in assists.

I don't see how he isn't a bang-obvious HHOFer.

 

[seventieslord]

I think he's more on the HHOF side than not, but come on, you can't think that his 2009-10 season is like a top-end Hawerchuk or Savard season. There's a big difference between:

- coming 4th in scoring with 1.23 PPG because you centered a guy with 1.51 PPG all season,

and...

- being 3rd behind two Oilers with your next-best teammate being the winger you dragged up to 101 points,

or...

- being 3rd behind two generational talents in their primes with 131 points and your next-best teammate being the winger you dragged to 89 points

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

Leclair should probably be inducted, but 4x top-10 with 800 points is substantially worse than 5x top-10 with 1000 (or really, probably 1100+ by the time he's done) points.



I mean, he's had a 101-point 4th in scoring season that graded out at 107 adjusted points. Hawerchuk's best was 3rd in scoring with 103 adjusted points. Savard 3rd in scoring with 110 adjusted points.

He's definitely miles better than Federko.

And miles better defensively than all these guys - consistent Selke votes through his career and 7th/9th/11th/12th place finishes for that award.

6x top-3 in assists.

I don't see how he isn't a bang-obvious HHOFer.

70lord said what i was going to say.

i’m ok with backstrom > federko for all round game, but i don’t think the distance is huge. i’ll admit i don’t follow washington closely enough to have a good gauge on what an adjusted backstrom without ovechkin looks like in an all time sense, though.

in any event i don’t think (by actual HHOF standards) federko in there is a travesty, unlike many who do.

 

[Hobnobs]

I think he's more on the HHOF side than not, but come on, you can't think that his 2009-10 season is like a top-end Hawerchuk or Savard season. There's a big difference between:

- coming 4th in scoring with 1.23 PPG because you centered a guy with 1.51 PPG all season,

and...

- being 3rd behind two Oilers with your next-best teammate being the winger you dragged up to 101 points,

or...

- being 3rd behind two generational talents in their primes with 131 points and your next-best teammate being the winger you dragged to 89 points

Savard didn't drag Larmer to 89 points...

 

[seventieslord]

Savard didn't drag Larmer to 89 points...

If your point is that Larmer was a pretty good player himself, sure, he was, but he played on Savard's wing for most of a decade and there were obvious benefits to that in his point totals.

 

[Hobnobs]

If your point is that Larmer was a pretty good player himself, sure, he was, but he played on Savard's wing for most of a decade and there were obvious benefits to that in his point totals.

You mean like when he scored a 101 points during a season with a mix of Creighton, Thomas, Graham, Roenick and Goulet as his linemates?

 

[seventieslord]

You mean like when he scored a 101 points during a season with a mix of Creighton, Thomas, Graham, Roenick and Goulet as his linemates?

No one's saying Larmer never had a great season himself.

It's possible to be very good and have an even better player on your line with you. This thread is about Backstrom after all...

 

[Hobnobs]

No one's saying Larmer never had a great season himself.

It's possible to be very good and have an even better player on your line with you. This thread is about Backstrom after all...

Yes but if you're very good you're not dragged to 89 when you obviously can score without that player...

And are you now saying Ovechkin dragged Bäckström to 101 points? The guy that had 21pts in 12 games without Ovie on the ice? Strange take but ok.

 

[rmartin65]

He's going to have the numbers, so he is going to make the HHoF.

I don't think he is an HHoF caliber player, though. No individual awards. Never made a post-season AS team. Never THE guy for his team. Above average defensively, but hardly someone that opposing offenses planned around.

He's not going to be the weakest guy in the hall... but he's not a player I would vote to induct. Great career, though.