Proposal: Nash/NYI

[72hockey guy]

Tim Kerr was very much on the decline when I started watching a ton of hockey (late 80s), but sounds like it.

Kerr didnt have the skills of lee, (Elite Hands and Feet) but what Kerr did have was incredible toughness, He simply would not let you move him from the crease. Where lee uses his feet to continually move around the crease and uses his hands to dig at the puck and make space for a redirect, Kerr simply would not let you move him, by sheer force of will, He was the epitome of the Broadstreet Bullies, the man took crosscheck after crosscheck and took an incredible physical beating. He could fight too. and earned every goal he scored

Where Bobby Clarke could be kind of chippy, much like Sidney Crosby can be, Kerr was simply the toughest guy on ice, much Like Clark Gillies was the Islanders "tower of power"so was Kerr for the Flyers. as much as he frustrated opponents with his incredible strength and toughness, you had to respect him

Like a TIMEX watch he took a licking but kept on ticking, Kerr and Bossy were easily the 2 most punished players physically I ever saw and both had shortened careers because of it

 

[LeapOnOver]

How many trades between a team pushing for a playoff spot and a team moving a ufa , involve quality nhlers going back to the team moving the impending ufa.

Almost all involve picks and prospects.
The year Matt Barzal fell in the draft, he fell because a knee injury that cost him his season.

Is that your bright idea? Trade a 40 goal scorer and pray a top prospect gets hurt and falls into the mid teens?

I do not know which of your arguments make the least sense:
1. Lee may look for $7m per ( which MaxPac & Kane got).
2. Lee may not live up to the new contract.
3.Isles got a steal drafting Barzal 16th overall.

I have to keep going back and looking at what I wrote to see where the disconnect is. I think you are just one of those people who operate by shifting the words around in your head to try to make what people say sound bad so you don't have to think very hard to debate it.

I do not know which of your arguments make the least sense:
1. Lee may look for $7m per ( which MaxPac & Kane got). --- this wasn't my argument, this was the information provided in the lighthouse article. I don't even know what you think i'm arguing here, this is just what I found fact checking if Lee had even began contract negotiations.
2. Lee may not live up to the new contract. -- I put a big IF there that you are conveniently leaving out. Need to see how Lee performs at least half a season to make sure he's for real. When you start paying players based on things like: he's a good guy, does lots of charity work, he's handsome, players wanted him to be team captain; you end up with Dustin Brown and Andrew Ladd type signings.
3.Isles got a steal drafting Barzal 16th overall. -- don't even know what this is supposed to mean. Are you saying that I argued Barzal was a steal at 16th overall? Are you arguing that he wasn't? I never proposed any argument on his skill vs draft position and I'm not even sure why you brought this up. You should put down the scotch though.

Lastly, is your strong argument that Matt Barzal is the only draft steal ever? Really? It has to rely on one and only one example because Matt Barzal is the only steal to ever come out of a draft class? This never happens (happens EVERY draft)? Damn, people could argue even Anders Lee was a steal in his draft. [MOD]

 

[CREW99AW]

I have to keep going back and looking at what I wrote to see where the disconnect is. I think you are just one of those people who operate by shifting the words around in your head to try to make what people say sound bad so you don't have to think very hard to debate it.

I do not know which of your arguments make the least sense:
1. Lee may look for $7m per ( which MaxPac & Kane got). --- this wasn't my argument, this was the information provided in the lighthouse article. I don't even know what you think i'm arguing here, this is just what I found fact checking if Lee had even began contract negotiations.
2. Lee may not live up to the new contract. -- I put a big IF there that you are conveniently leaving out. Need to see how Lee performs at least half a season to make sure he's for real. When you start paying players based on things like: he's a good guy, does lots of charity work, he's handsome, players wanted him to be team captain; you end up with Dustin Brown and Andrew Ladd type signings.
3.Isles got a steal drafting Barzal 16th overall. -- don't even know what this is supposed to mean. Are you saying that I argued Barzal was a steal at 16th overall? Are you arguing that he wasn't? I never proposed any argument on his skill vs draft position and I'm not even sure why you brought this up. You should put down the scotch though.

Lastly, is your strong argument that Matt Barzal is the only draft steal ever? Really? It has to rely on one and only one example because Matt Barzal is the only steal to ever come out of a draft class? This never happens (happens EVERY draft)? Damn, people could argue even Anders Lee was a steal in his draft. You are confusing as f***.

Funny you feel my arguments make no sense because I thought the exact same about your arguments.

1. The cap is rising. The isles will have a lot of cap space. The only issue I am concerned about is term. You bought up salary.
2. Even when not on Tavares line, Lee in put up 25 goals.
You are grasping for straws if your best argument is Lee will have to prove himself. Lou's attempt to get him signed shows Lou does not think he was carried by Tavares.
3. I am pointing out that picks and unproven prospects are crapshoots. Yes the isles landed Barzal at 16th overall. They also used top 5 picks on Strome, Reinhart,MDC .
With plenty of cap space,the isles clearly prefer rewarding Lee for his nhl production over whatever mid to late 1st and B prospect he would bring back as a rental.

You seem more concerned with having a top prospect pool then building am nhl team that is a serious SC contender

 

[GeauxPreds1]

Sooooo what would you guy want for Lee if he is available? Lee is probably more of a player Nashville needs

 

[PWJunior]

Sooooo what would you guy want for Lee if he is available? Lee is probably more of a player Nashville needs

Likely the usual rental price of a 1st + prospect. After being named Captain and reports that contract negotiation happening, he's probably not available.

Eberle and Nelson are the available rentals, no news of any contract talk with them.

 

[GeauxPreds1]

Likely the usual rental price of a 1st + prospect. After being named Captain and reports that contract negotiation happening, he's probably not available.

Eberle and Nelson are the available rentals, no news of any contract talk with them.

I'd like to have him. He's exactly what we need. I'd be willing to give a younger top 6 left winger in fiala go for him with an extension.

 

[72hockey guy]

I'd like to have him. He's exactly what we need. I'd be willing to give a younger top 6 left winger in fiala go for him with an extension.

not nearly enough, Id much rather keep him with an extension than trade him with one

 

[GeauxPreds1]

I'd like to have him. He's exactly what we need. I'd be willing to give a younger top 6 left winger in fiala go for him with an extension.

Would fiala+ get the conversation started

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

Would fiala+ get the conversation started

That would be extraordinarily short-sighted.

 

[Outofbodyinhungary]

I doubt lee gets dealt from the islanders, and anyways I want to see what fiala looks like this season, he’s only 22. We should look at acquiring a player a few years younger than lee anyways.

 

[PWJunior]

I doubt lee gets dealt from the islanders, and anyways I want to see what fiala looks like this season, he’s only 22. We should look at acquiring a player a few years younger than lee anyways.

In the unlikely event that Lee is dealt, I would think the Isles would be looking for a center prospect considering they have nothing after Barzal. Cizikas gets banged up a lot and Filppula is a stop gap.

 

[Outofbodyinhungary]

In the unlikely event that Lee is dealt, I would think the Isles would be looking for a center prospect considering they have nothing after Barzal. Cizikas gets banged up a lot and Filppula is a stop gap.

Yeah and the preds don’t really have anything to offer on that front.

 

[72hockey guy]

Would fiala+ get the conversation started

not even a consideration to be honest, even fiala plus a first , given that with Lee, Nashvilles first would be 27-30 range, so its not something any team wouldnt beat, Fiala himself doesnt even put you in the conversation, the plus would need to be better than Fiala himself

being a small forward Fiala doesnt bring any of the Elements Lee brings, which is I assume, why you want him. but which is also why Fiala doestnt even get you in the conversation, Sorry its no knock on Fiala, but his skills just dont fill a need or replace what we'd be giving up.

its like replacing a ford F-150, With a Chevy Cruze.

hopefully the example gives you a fair representation of why

 

[LeapOnOver]

Funny you feel my arguments make no sense because I thought the exact same about your arguments.

1. The cap is rising. The isles will have a lot of cap space. The only issue I am concerned about is term. You bought up salary.
2. Even when not on Tavares line, Lee in put up 25 goals.
You are grasping for straws if your best argument is Lee will have to prove himself. Lou's attempt to get him signed shows Lou does not think he was carried by Tavares.
3. I am pointing out that picks and unproven prospects are crapshoots. Yes the isles landed Barzal at 16th overall. They also used top 5 picks on Strome, Reinhart,MDC .
With plenty of cap space,the isles clearly prefer rewarding Lee for his nhl production over whatever mid to late 1st and B prospect he would bring back as a rental.

You seem more concerned with having a top prospect pool then building am nhl team that is a serious SC contender

Funny, Barry Trotz in the post game explicitly stated that they are still learning what the players are about and what their strengths and weaknesses are. Seems to me that directly contradicts what you are stating. I'm glad I'm the one "grasping at straws" though.

 

[LeapOnOver]

[MOD]

Due to his very sensitive need to hold on to Lee he's suddenly taken my statement that Lee may be available based on his salary demands and production this season and twisted it into a narrative where I'm actively shopping Lee because I just want shiny prospects (me, the same guy who admittedly and stupidly would have traded Barzal for Duchene). I propose to wait and see on Lee where Crew wants to roll up the truck and pay him whatever he wants. Don't know why he has a problem with prudence.

 

[BHD]

Critique the post - not the poster.

 

[CREW99AW]

Funny, Barry Trotz in the post game explicitly stated that they are still learning what the players are about and what their strengths and weaknesses are. Seems to me that directly contradicts what you are stating. I'm glad I'm the one "grasping at straws" though.

Months ago, after joining the isles, Lou spoke about taking time to evaluate the players in the organization .

Now months later he A) named Lee captain and B) started extension talks with Lee.

Clearly, Lee is a player Lou has decided he wants to be part of his core going forward. He wouldn't have started extension talks,would not be trying to lock him up in a new contract.

 

[72hockey guy]

Months ago, after joining the isles, Lou spoke about taking time to evaluate the players in the organization .

Now months later he A) named Lee captain and B) started extension talks with Lee.

Clearly, Lee is a player Lou has decided he wants to be part of his core going forward. He wouldn't have started extension talks,would not be trying to lock him up in a new contract.

considering that the trade deadline is 4 months away that is what he should be doing. if with the passage of time, something changes, closer to the deadline THEN YOU CAN RE-EVALUATE. I see no reason to poison the negotiation with trade considerations at this point, sure Nashville may want lee earlier but there is no reason to let that interfere with whats best for the Islanders.

there is ZERO evidence currently despite Leap on overs idle speculations that Lee may be available and to the contrary, all available current information, points to the the desire that he remain from both the team and the player. Leap everyone knows that if the situation changes, there can be a different outcome, but why even consider it when there is no evidence of any change in perspective? we all would like to get the top 3 picks in each of the next 3 drafts but untill we're in that position to do that, why speculate on it?

your kind of jumping the gun dont you think Leap? if We are 2-23 after 25 games and Lee has 18 goals thats one thing, but if we are 14-11 and lee has 18 goals thats another situation entirely. And you have to evaluate based upon the known circumstances. Its simply too soon to draw any conclusions other than what Crew has from the current evidence

 

[LeapOnOver]

considering that the trade deadline is 4 months away that is what he should be doing. if with the passage of time, something changes, closer to the deadline THEN YOU CAN RE-EVALUATE. I see no reason to poison the negotiation with trade considerations at this point, sure Nashville may want lee earlier but there is no reason to let that interfere with whats best for the Islanders.

there is ZERO evidence currently despite Leap on overs idle speculations that Lee may be available and to the contrary, all available current information, points to the the desire that he remain from both the team and the player. Leap everyone knows that if the situation changes, there can be a different outcome, but why even consider it when there is no evidence of any change in perspective? we all would like to get the top 3 picks in each of the next 3 drafts but untill we're in that position to do that, why speculate on it?

your kind of jumping the gun dont you think Leap? if We are 2-23 after 25 games and Lee has 18 goals thats one thing, but if we are 14-11 and lee has 18 goals thats another situation entirely. And you have to evaluate based upon the known circumstances. Its simply too soon to draw any conclusions other than what Crew has from the current evidence

First of all this whole thread is started over a fictional trade proposal. So the whole point of this is speculation. It's like asking why I dressed in costume for a costume party. Now sure, speculation can get out of hand, but my whole point is we should be listening to offers for everyone who is a pending UFA. That includes Lee. If Nashville's GM has a Chiarelli moment and wants to trade us Forsberg for Lee, you are not going to not take his call? All I was saying to the other poster is that Lee is a UFA and may be available. That means, all of us playing armchair GM here, can continue to make offers and discuss possibilities. Instead I'm met with "real" GMs who say it's not possible, because it's their team and they know for a fact (one source stating that preliminary, very preliminary contract extensions have begun) that Lee is not available because they just know better. Nah, sorry. Their opinion holds as much water as mine does.

 

[ThreeLeftSkates]

First of all this whole thread is started over a fictional trade proposal. So the whole point of this is speculation. It's like asking why I dressed in costume for a costume party. Now sure, speculation can get out of hand, but my whole point is we should be listening to offers for everyone who is a pending UFA. That includes Lee. If Nashville's GM has a Chiarelli moment and wants to trade us Forsberg for Lee, you are not going to not take his call? All I was saying to the other poster is that Lee is a UFA and may be available. That means, all of us playing armchair GM here, can continue to make offers and discuss possibilities. Instead I'm met with "real" GMs who say it's not possible, because it's their team and they know for a fact (one source stating that preliminary, very preliminary contract extensions have begun) that Lee is not available because they just know better. Nah, sorry. Their opinion holds as much water as mine does.

Lee was not named captain so he could be traded.
Short and sweet answer.

 

[seabass45]

In the unlikely event that Lee is dealt, I would think the Isles would be looking for a center prospect considering they have nothing after Barzal. Cizikas gets banged up a lot and Filppula is a stop gap.

Think if we want a center prospect, we'll have to draft one (or a few, in 2019).

 

[72hockey guy]

First of all this whole thread is started over a fictional trade proposal. So the whole point of this is speculation. It's like asking why I dressed in costume for a costume party. Now sure, speculation can get out of hand, but my whole point is we should be listening to offers for everyone who is a pending UFA. That includes Lee. If Nashville's GM has a Chiarelli moment and wants to trade us Forsberg for Lee, you are not going to not take his call? All I was saying to the other poster is that Lee is a UFA and may be available. That means, all of us playing armchair GM here, can continue to make offers and discuss possibilities. Instead I'm met with "real" GMs who say it's not possible, because it's their team and they know for a fact (one source stating that preliminary, very preliminary contract extensions have begun) that Lee is not available because they just know better. Nah, sorry. Their opinion holds as much water as mine does.

except their speculations are based on actual relevant occurrences, Like being named captain, real negotiations, all of yours speculations are based inside your imagination

 

[LeapOnOver]

except their speculations are based on actual relevant occurrences, Like being named captain, real negotiations, all of yours speculations are based inside your imagination

So, to clarify, in your world being named captain and having contract negotiations means it's impossible for you to be traded. That's never happened in the history of the NHL so I must be idiotic. Again, the omniscient people posting here who always think their opinions hold more weight is nauseating. I need to go clean off my keyboard.

 

[Islanders4Cups]

So, to clarify, in your world being named captain and having contract negotiations means it's impossible for you to be traded. That's never happened in the history of the NHL so I must be idiotic. Again, the omniscient people posting here who always think their opinions hold more weight is nauseating. I need to go clean off my keyboard.

Pretty close to it. Unless Lee basically says he wants to leave he will be signed.
I think a captain is held in pretty high regard. Imagine what the players would think if you name a player the captain of the team ( a player that supposedly the entire team was all in to name captain) and then turn around and trade him. I know what I would think. This front office is building for the future and would not do something that idiotic.

 

[Glory Days]

soo hartman + 2020 2nd for Eberle?

Yes I would do that from Isles perspective. I think that is equal value for Eberle as a rental.