Montreal vs Toronto - Who will win first?

[tmlms13]

this post was absurd then i remembered cannabis is legal in Canada

The roll out of the distribution systems has been awful though

 

[crowi]

I hope MTL as this site will be unusable if TO wins. It's already bad.

 

[TeddyBare]

Toronto by a significant margin.

 

[Positive Vibes]

Kfc

 

[superstar436]

Montreal will not win any cups soon.
The mentality of mgmt (Molson and gilette) is make playoffs in order to make money and that is it

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

Habs.

Toronto is going to be stuck in mediocrity for the next 5 years, see them as a consistent top 10 team but never the top team as they will lack solid depth due to cap issues and their elite talent won’t be able to single handedly carry them. Habs have an influx of good young players and could potentially be a championship team, but for that to happen a lot of things have to go right.

 

[ole ole]

Am I the only one that is finding it impossible to feel bad for a team that hasn't won in "over" 26 years?

Anyways, Toronto is a lot closer.

You shouldn't be.I still get much joy and laughter knowing a team hasn't won one in 52 yrs and counting.

 

[Stephen]

As long as Price is dominating, Montreal always has a chance for tche Cup. It all (mostly) depends of him.

I think Montreal is 2 players away from contending as much as Toronto. Add in a Stone, Hall or Panarin and top 4 defenceman or one that can play better with Weber, then I think it would be clearer.

I think of Montreal as the mid 2010s New York Rangers max. upside.

 

[KDOTO]

I like Dermott a lot, but he's not a #3 dman on a cup winning team for now... and you won't have money for a 3rd dman. Hardly depth players when we're talking second pairing.

Liljegren is far from NHL ready and a lot of scouts have gone sour on him lately, he's a complete enigma 2 years after his draft. Sandin is intriguing though, I guess you can hope he'll surprise next year, but we're talking stanley cup. If your stanley cup hopes are on a 19yo playing 2nd pair minutes next year... well...

Who are these scouts that says this about Lilly. Can you link me to any article or scout quote that says he is an enigma this year. Never mind alot just show me one, I've done this research more then once to prove shit talkers so now it's your turn to prove me wrong.

I've seen all the talks on him and nothing I've ever read or seen has what you say about him. Only thing I've seen is injuries and his offense might not translate to the elite types in the nhl. But go ahead and show Mr where you found alot of scouts saying this... Holla back when you find it

 

[sharks9]

Who are these scouts that says this about Lilly. Can you link me to any article or scout quote that says he is an enigma this year. Never mind alot just show me one, I've done this research more then once to prove **** talkers so now it's your turn to prove me wrong.

I've seen all the talks on him and nothing I've ever read or seen has what you say about him. Only thing I've seen is injuries and his offense might not translate to the elite types in the nhl. But go ahead and show Mr where you found alot of scouts saying this... Holla back when you find it

Corey Pronman on Liljegren from January:

"I’ve talked to scouts who love his game, and others who would pass on him in a trade discussion. There are days I see a skilled, intelligent, puck-moving defenseman who moves well and can help a power play. But the concerns are his game has a tad too much risk at times and his offense this season hasn’t been that significant. I’ve seen a bit too much of the bad this season that reminded me of the pessimism around him to make me flip from my rather high ranking in the summer. If someone wanted to argue him as a top-tier prospect, I could see the case, but I struggle to nail down what he is."

He doesn't use the word enigma, but the sentiment is there

 

[exporta]

Safer bet is TO, but Montreal always seems to have the ability to surprise and are going to be a headache for anyone in these playoffs.

 

[MattMartin]

I think Toronto wins this year or at worst next. I also can see 3 or 4 cup wins by them in the next 6 years.

 

[King Mapes]

Who the hell knows.. as good as the leafs are right now, there’s no guarantee they win. There’s plenty of great teams that blow right past their window

This. I hate questions like these. Toronto is much closer but what if they don't win with this core? Only one team wins a year and most times it's not even the best team that year. A few years ago Habs were closer and everyone would have answered Montreal but they didn't win with their window of hope.

 

[KDOTO]

Corey Pronman on Liljegren from January:

"I’ve talked to scouts who love his game, and others who would pass on him in a trade discussion. There are days I see a skilled, intelligent, puck-moving defenseman who moves well and can help a power play. But the concerns are his game has a tad too much risk at times and his offense this season hasn’t been that significant. I’ve seen a bit too much of the bad this season that reminded me of the pessimism around him to make me flip from my rather high ranking in the summer. If someone wanted to argue him as a top-tier prospect, I could see the case, but I struggle to nail down what he is."

He doesn't use the word enigma, but the sentiment is there

I don't do pronman so thats probly why didn't see the writing hvnt for years. But a little context though is that he was used on the top pair, 1pk, and against top ahl players. He was doing what I would expect for a 19 yo moving up.

He was suppose to get a call up this year prior to injury. From the games I've seen of him he progress to my expectations, offensively wise .5 ppg is good for an underager. He had his hiccup but for me it was expected but like I said he was showing well enough for an expected call up. So I'm guessing leafs scout felt different from proman, as do I...also in those 19 game, I saw more positive then anything that would deemed him an enigma, which is what the poster said.

I just think if he was an enigma more would be said of him pointing to him being that and other then what you shown me I havnt seen any other write up on him that backs up what the post wrote... Blogs or mainstream media, about all have indicated he was doing great for the new role he was presented this season.

 

[sharks9]

I don't do pronman so thats probly why didn't see the writing hvnt for years. But a little context though is that he was used on the top pair, 1pk, and against top ahl players. He was doing what I would expect for a 19 yo moving up.

He was suppose to get a call up this year prior to injury. From the games I've seen of him he progress to my expectations, offensively wise .5 ppg is good for an underager. He had his hiccup but for me it was expected but like I said he was showing well enough for an expected call up. So I'm guessing leafs scout felt different from proman, as do I...also in those 19 game, I saw more positive then anything that would deemed him an enigma, which is what the poster said.

I just think if he was an enigma more would be said of him pointing to him being that and other then what you shown me I havnt seen any other write up on him that backs up what the post wrote... Blogs or mainstream media, about all have indicated he was doing great for the new role he was presented this season.

You said in your last post to just show you one saying he's an enigma and I did. I'm sure Leafs scouts do feel differently or else they wouldn't have drafted him in the first place, but obviously not every scout feels the way the Leafs do.

There were also people saying in the aftermath of the Muzzin trade that the Kings preferred Durzi over Liljegren, another sign that his stock has dropped since being drafted. But anyways, this isn't the Liljegren thread.

 

[TDotMassive]

Weird how that group which is apparently SO much better is a whopping 4 points ahead in the standings...

Leafs are finding their consistency as young team and integrating Tavares... but when they are clicking they are so deadly. Their ceiling is much higher than Montreal right now. Only Tampa can compare to their level of firepower, and even then... Leafs handled the Bolts well this season. I'm a Leafs fan first, but I also like the the Habs, I follow them too and want them to do well... Leafs just have a higher top end right now.

 

[Yamazaki]

I assumed the cap was going up not down.

Can’t take him seriously look at his post history. He’s obsessed with hating the leafs lmao.

 

[KDOTO]

You said in your last post to just show you one saying he's an enigma and I did. I'm sure Leafs scouts do feel differently or else they wouldn't have drafted him in the first place, but obviously not every scout feels the way the Leafs do.

There were also people saying in the aftermath of the Muzzin trade that the Kings preferred Durzi over Liljegren, another sign that his stock has dropped since being drafted. But anyways, this isn't the Liljegren thread.

You didn't show me anyone saying he was an enigma, what proman did was I guess as close as you can find which isn't saying much.

How has his stock dropped, he was holding his own as a 19 yo, nothing he did this year made him drop, who has dropped him, hf posters?

Ok so now show me who are these people that says kings wanted durzi over Lilly. Don't post somthing and just say people, who? Also leafs amateur scouts recommended him to be drafted. I'm talking about their ahl pro scout and coaches who are seeing his play in the A.

Who in their right mind would take the older prospect with less pedigree and not signed to the other one who is younger and playing pro to expectation. Especially since durzi has stayed the same this season.

I don't mind talking hockey but if your gonna jump in a convo, bro bring more to the table then pronman and people. Also give me what I asked for, not some variation of it or as u say "sentiment" of it. If what the other poster said and you believe to be true that a lot of scouts feels this way then you should be able to easily pull me more then God damn pronman and his "scouts" to back it up. If you don't got it then y u jumping in my convo like a white knight for.
please don't give the freidman stuff as your reasoning

 

[sharks9]

Leafs are finding their consistency as young team and integrating Tavares... but when they are clicking they are so deadly. Their ceiling is much higher than Montreal right now. Only Tampa can compare to their level of firepower, and even then... Leafs handled the Bolts well this season. I'm a Leafs fan first, but I also like the the Habs, I follow them too and want them to do well... Leafs just have a higher top end right now.

Montreal is a younger team than Toronto though and I don't think Tavares is struggling too much at integrating with 33 goals and 63 points in 57 games. The Leafs definitely have a lot of firepower, but I wouldn't say anyone compares to Tampa Bay this year. Toronto's in that next tier with Calgary and San Jose.

 

[oooooooooohCanada]

Toronto is the better team right now no question but looks like they'll be dealing with a Tampa team that I think is the best built team since the lockout for the next few years (among other teams). I wouldn't be surprised to see them come up empty then their window closes.

Obviously you need to build a good team but a lot of it is luck and timing and not running into Warrior style teams. When the Habs are ready to contend, their path might be easier even if their team isn't built as well. Regardless, answer to this is probably Leafs

Toronto's window is pretty long. Hell, look at Tampa. They were a contender in like 2011 weren't they? San Jose, Washington, etc have 'windows' that are open for a long time. That happens when you have elite players. Toronto's window will be open until their star players are gone or get worse, assuming the team is managed well.

 

[TDotMassive]

Montreal is a younger team than Toronto though and I don't think Tavares is struggling too much at integrating with 33 goals and 63 points in 57 games. The Leafs definitely have a lot of firepower, but I wouldn't say anyone compares to Tampa Bay this year. Toronto's in that next tier with Calgary and San Jose.

Tampa is the best team overall this year, no doubt... but the Leafs dominated them in both games this season. Not saying that means anything post-season, but it certainly wouldn't be a lock for Tampa to win that series.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I fully expect Toronto to win at least one cup in the next five years. If they play their cards right they could be dominant for over a decade.

Montreal had a great young core about six years ago and promptly f***ed it up. This season I expected a bottomfeeder and have been pleasantly surprised. They still have Carey Price but they haven't surrounded him well. If they got some help on the LD and a scorer then they might actually be able to make a run. Right now though, those loom as huge holes and I don't see them being filled anytime soon. Smart money says they stay in the middle and waste more prime years of Weber and Price. Not what I want to see but it's what I think will happen.

 

[KDOTO]

Montreal is a younger team than Toronto though and I don't think Tavares is struggling too much at integrating with 33 goals and 63 points in 57 games. The Leafs definitely have a lot of firepower, but I wouldn't say anyone compares to Tampa Bay this year. Toronto's in that next tier with Calgary and San Jose.

How is Montreal younger in a way that would matter in the future.
Top guys going forward:
Weber '85 Matthews 97
Drouin' 95 Mariner 97
Domi '95 JT 90
Gally' 92 Willy 96
Kot' 00 Reilly 94
Dany '93 Kadri 90

Secondary:
Armia' 93 Kap 96
Lek '95 johnsson 95
Mete 98 dermott 96
Tatar?' 90 hymen 92
Byron? '89 brown? 94
Petry? 87 muz? 89
Price 85 Freddy 88

Prospect
Suzuki Sandin
Poling lily
Brook Bracco
Juulsen moore

Tell me moving forward which team has the guys that makes more of an impact, who would you pick and combine who is younger. About the same with top guys, leafs secondary are younger, goalie is younger, then your left with the prospects which I don't see a game changer a where on either team, unless someone makes a big leap.

Toronto's older now cuz of marleau and hainsey on the nhl roster. Leafs core is elite and younger then Montreal moving forward. So I don't know how you can say being younger matters next five year cuz leafs core is miles ahead to anyone not bias and their best players are younger and actually elite compared with Montreal.

 

[SurferBroChad]

A decade? The cap will hurt their chances in two years...

The Leafs window is right now...

"the leafs will have a good shot for a decade because players never age and contracts never end"

 

[KDOTO]

"the leafs will have a good shot for a decade because players never age and contracts never end"

Players age but leafs core is 24 and under plus jt, if leaf do it right then yeah they have the capability to do it. I don't know how you can say they definitely can't...