Dreger: (Mod warning post 661) Marner's camp to take negotiations beyond July 1st and to visit teams startin

[93gilmour93]

Without Tavares you have a extra 10+ million. Everything would have been fine.

Without Lou signing Marleau and Zaitsev everything would have been fine also

 

[7even]

f*** him. Tired of our young core players talking out of both sides of their mouths about how excited they are to win in this city and then bending us over the barrel in contract negotiations. Look at Tampa. If you want to be a perennial contender you need to make small sacrifices on your already absolutely obscene paychecks, oh no. f*** that. I'll take my picks Mitch.

 

[Liferleafer]

Without Tavares you have a extra 10+ million. Everything would have been fine.

So that makes Marleau's contract good? Sure. We definately should have never signed Tavares because we had Marleau for another year....makes sense. Imagine having 10.75 million in cap (Lou's shitty Marleau/Zaitsev signings) right now...and Tavares.

 

[Saidin]

I've seen this for a while and why do people selectively ignore insiders comments when they don't agree with it, but they take the 1 report of SJ offering 13m for Taveres as gospel that TO got a deal on that contract? Unless there were numerous sources on that 13m offer I'm missing, but every time I only see 1 article quoted.

 

[ToDavid]

Without Tavares you have a extra 10+ million. Everything would have been fine.

I mean, sure, if we didn't have good players we would have tons of cap space.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Now don't say Kyper has no sources. But the discussion point was 72M. We can assume this was for 8 years. Which is right in the 9-9.5 range. Dubas thought it was too rich, and he is now in this predicament of his own making,

Suggested and my understanding? Ah....gotcha.

Oh...and you mean this Kypreos? The guy that said Marner wouldn't become a go to guy with Babcock? The guy that said Connor Brown and Zach Hyman are ahead of Marner on the depth chart? The guy that called Maener a 3rd line winger?? The guy that said they were more committed to Bozak so they should trade him?? The guy that said Marner would never be a top 3 player on Toronto??

Ya, he's a ****ing genius.
/QUOTE]

Asks for a source, is presented the source, now the source is not good. Gotcha.

 

[Liferleafer]

Suggested and my understanding? Ah....gotcha.

Oh...and you mean this Kypreos? The guy that said Marner wouldn't become a go to guy with Babcock? The guy that said Connor Brown and Zach Hyman are ahead of Marner on the depth chart? The guy that called Maener a 3rd line winger?? The guy that said they were more committed to Bozak so they should trade him?? The guy that said Marner would never be a top 3 player on Toronto??

Ya, he's a ****ing genius.
/QUOTE]

Asks for a source, is presented the source, now the source is not good. Gotcha.

That wasn't a source, that was someone's opinion. A source would be something directly from management or Marner....which there isn't one.

 

[NiL8r87]

Now don't say Kyper has no sources. But the discussion point was 72M. We can assume this was for 8 years. Which is right in the 9-9.5 range. Dubas thought it was too rich, and he is now in this predicament of his own making,

Why? People, including yourself I believe, scoffed at 6.9 million for consistent 60 pt production in Nylander's case. But Dubas wasn't supposed to scoff at 2-2.5 million more for 10 more points?

 

[lomiller1]

I can see Marner the Leafs end up having to pay Marner the same money as AM but on a longer term.

An offer sheet of 5x$10.5 or 3X$10.5 would be 2 firsts a second and a third and there may be some teams willing to do this. 5x$10.5 is still less than AM, but probably comparable to 8x$11.5 when you look at UFA years being bought.

 

[Legion34]

Without Tavares you have a extra 10+ million. Everything would have been fine.

But without Tavares. We wouldn’t have Tavares so that’s kinda the problem.

Tavares for free plus whatever we can get for. Nylander or Marner or whomever is much better than no Tavares.

Worst case scenario. We will take our free 47 goal no 1 C plus whatever we can get and be thrilled

 

[Legion34]

I've seen this for a while and why do people selectively ignore insiders comments when they don't agree with it, but they take the 1 report of SJ offering 13m for Taveres as gospel that TO got a deal on that contract? Unless there were numerous sources on that 13m offer I'm missing, but every time I only see 1 article quoted.

The agent reported it. Not just dredger

Insiders all said that Tavares wasn’t coming here.

The thing is that the insiders who have to create media daily have to create content.

The “insiders” who report contract details 8 months later.... but didn’t report them at the time are suspect.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Well at the time Marner's numbers didn't justify that contract but after a season with JT his numbers took off. It would have been a great deal to sign but like I said at the time Dubas was right to not sign it

You are making a case of Dubas dropping the ball even more. If he didn't notice Marner trending to a PPG player after a slow start the year before? A good GM would so, especially playing with Tavares for an entire year. Dubas really missed the boat even more than just not signing him for 9-9.5 the summer before.

 

[WesMcCauley]

As much as Nylander held out, he only got 500k or something a season more than comparable players (like Forsberg after adding for the cap going up). Matthews' contract really drives the price of Marner up. 11,643m a season for only 5 years was an awful contract for Toronto.
Eichel got 10m but signed for 8 years, Seguin got under 10m as an upcoming ufa for 8 years, Kucherov got 9,5m for 8 years one year from free agency. I think Dubas does a lot of good things for the league and Toronto but its not good when you time after time set a new precedent for player contracts. He is doing that and it obviously isnt in Toronto's interest and it might hurt them pretty badly...

His liberal attitude with player management etc is all good and fine but there is a reason why GM's say all the bad stuff they can about their players in arbitration. Playing hardball and being extremely tough in contract negotiations work and Dubas is failing at it with his "it have to work for the player, his family and his agent" comments that he spits out time after time.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

That wasn't a source, that was someone's opinion. A source would be something directly from management or Marner....which there isn't one.

Source was asked for, sourced was provided, and now source is not good enough. Got to just at this.

 

[Estlin]

think pasta signs that same deal now or wants more?

.

Pastrnak grew up in very modest surroundings and is grateful to be where he is today. He's grounded.

 

[93gilmour93]

You are making a case of Dubas dropping the ball even more. If he didn't notice Marner trending to a PPG player after a slow start the year before? A good GM would so, especially playing with Tavares for an entire year. Dubas really missed the boat even more than just not signing him for 9-9.5 the summer before.

Nope. He was right to not sign him based on his numbers at the time but looking back now it's to bad he didn't sign it but that's the way she goes sometimes

 

[Metroid]

.

Pastrnak grew up in very modest surroundings and is grateful to be where he is today. He's grounded.

also helps probably not having a crazy ass hockey dad.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Nope. He was right to not sign him based on his numbers at the time but looking back now it's to bad he didn't sign it but that's the way she goes sometimes

How did that go?

 

[93gilmour93]

How did that go?

It will cost the leafs more money. Oh well.

 

[Legion34]

.

Pastrnak grew up in very modest surroundings and is grateful to be where he is today. He's grounded.

He also held out to the last day and got an 8.89 percent hit. Which was the highest for his comparables at the time ......

Nylander signed for less of a percent with I think identical ppg on elc.

 

[Nervousbreakdown]

This is not in the OP. But here is what Dreger said on TSN Radio. The dad and another, Dad and mom?

“I believe that the Marner camp is still looking at July 1st or beyond July 1st and he’s earned the right to do that,” Dreger continued. “He one hundred percent has earned the right to do that and I’d be shocked if Mitch Marner and Darren Ferris, or Mitch Marner, Darren Ferris and his dad or another member aren’t on an airplane on June 26th, starting the visiting process of the clubs that might be willing to offer sheet.”

Dreger added that he expects an aggressive offer from Dubas in late June, somewhere north of $10.5 or $11 million per season. Whether or not that, coupled with the winning potential within the Leafs dressing room, will be enough to keep Marner around is yet to be seen.

Don't be surprised if Mitch Marner does some window shopping this offseason

Can you imagine if Nylanders agent said this? Nylander only said that he wanted to stay a leaf and he was crucified for being greedy.

Seems likely someone will offer 4yrs and $10,568,589/season which is only 1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd. More than worth it for Marner IMO. Not sure the Leafs match (I think they would).

If the Leafs can get 4*1sts then they should just take it TBH.

Yep, can't overpay a 9m player by 2.5 mil.

The most recent Toronto signings point to players demanding top dollar (Matthews, Tavares, Marleau).
The most recent Tampa Bay signings point to players leaving money on the table (Stamkos, Kucherov, Hedman).

Call it what you will - but the rest of us see a pattern. Mitch signing for more than Kucherov and/or Point will only cement it even more. Taxes do matter - like it or not.

Even if marner wants to compare himself to Toronto signings Dubas should be explaining that goal scoring centers > assist machine wingers.

If they match an offer-sheet, they can't trade him for a year.

The Leafs should just look to trade Marner before it gets to that point. Dubas ruined the cap structure by overpaying players and signing players the Leafs didn't need. Expecting Marner to take less than he's worth because your GM was an idiot with cap management seems incredibly unfair towards Marner.

Dubas isn't the guy who signed Marleau to a 3rd year or Zaitzev to a 7 year deal. That guy is in Long Island giving away bad contracts now.

Without Tavares you have a extra 10+ million. Everything would have been fine.

Marner also wouldn't have scored 94 points so it would be double savings!

 

[The Winter Soldier]

It will cost the leafs more money. Oh well.

It would cost a lot less last summer if Dubas signed Marner for 9M per. Any competent GM would know he was going to have a career year this year. He found this out the hard way with Nylander Dec 1 signing, and Kyle admitted as much. Which I do have to commend him for knowing he made a mistake on that negotiation. And he will find out the hard way again after this summer and who knows fall with Marner.

 

[IslandersFan17]

Lou signed Marleau for 3 years without having the foresight to see that it would be a problem. Good luck with Lou on the Island...he did some good things here, he also had some monumental **** ups.

Here's some straws... just reach a little further, reach that hand out and just grasp at those straws. You'll get them.

 

[93gilmour93]

It would cost a lot less last summer if Dubas signed Marner for 9M per. Any competent GM would know he was going to have a career year this year. He found this out the hard way with Nylander Dec 1 signing, and Kyle admitted as much. Which I do have to commend him for knowing he made a mistake on that negotiation. And he will find out the hard way again after this summer and who knows fall with Marner.

Your right it would have cost the leafs 9 instead of let's say 10.5 when he signs his new deal. That's the way she goes sometimes

 

[Keduzin]

Paying over 22 million a year for two centers is just plain stupidity, and we are not even talking about top3 centers in the game. Dubais is the one to blame/thank for the situation the Leafs are in. Not Nylander or Marner or their agents or parents.