McDavid in the 80s

[Mitts]

Lol no. As much as I love 99 & 66, they would be average in today’s game, however McDavid would be a one man wrecking crew in the 80’s. The game has evolved at a rapid pace.

No offence, but that's laughable, the game has not advanced anywhere as much as you imply.

 

[sabrebuild]

Then maybe. I'd guess more around 225-250.

Tough thing with Mario and new gear in my mind, is just how hard it is to quantify how much more dominance he could add.

I mean as a bigger guy, I can totally notice how much lighter and more agile the skates of today are compared to just the early 2000s. And those were so much better than the 90s. Those 80s skates felt they weighed twenty pounds each by the end of a skate.

Mario was already an above average with shoddy equipment that penalized him for his size, just because the technology sucked. Imagine a noted slather ass like Mario having 10% more energy in the third, just due to improved skate technology that no one else has. The edgework he could do with new skates compared to old.

The stick alone would be worth 10-15 goal, without better skates. Add in the skates. 6’5” Mario suddenly skates like Coffey.

 

[authentic]

A lot of that is because of advances in equipment and sports science, not necessarily the raw athlete. Give Lemieux's today's equipment, and today's conditioning coaches, and he would, yet again, dwarf everyone else's numbers.

Lemieux? Sure. Gretzky? Not likely.

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

Lemieux? Sure. Gretzky? Not likely.

With today’s training, conditioning, coaching and equipment. I agree that Lemieux would be good in today’s game, not sure about Gretzky.

 

[authentic]

With today’s training, conditioning, coaching and equipment. I agree that Lemieux would be good in today’s game, not sure about Gretzky.

Gretzky would be good, he wouldn't be close to the best though. Lemieux would probably lead the NHL in points, he aged much better and dominated modern defenses and goalies almost like Gretzky dominated when the league was alumni hockey game caliber.

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

Gretzky would be good, he wouldn't be close to the best though. Lemieux would probably lead the NHL in points, he aged much better and dominated modern defenses and goalies almost like Gretzky dominated when the league was alumni hockey game caliber.

Go check what a 38 year old broken Gretzky did in the DPE.

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

Time machine scenario? He'd easily be the GOAT. Should push ~300pts a season.

 

[authentic]

Go check what a 38 year old broken Gretzky did in the DPE.

I started watching hockey long before then. Gretzky was far from the best player in the league after 95, no matter what stats he put up which were admittedly impressive given his physical speed and tools compared to the rest of the elite players. He was a completely one way player who had next to no defensive responsibility and relied on the powerplay more as many aging players do. It would be a bit odd if the greatest player of all time was suddenly a 4th liner after the age of 35. Lesser players (in an all-time sense) have been better at similar ages and even much older than 38.

I agree more or less with your other post though.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

he'd literally score 650 goals per game, no question. Wayne Gretzky would be lucky to sniff the ECHL today amirite

 

[Amazinmets73]

OK, but still, isn't that just still a case of technology amplifying performance? Again, it's not athletes becoming more talented. It's just the tools at their disposal, legal or not, that have advanced. And by your own statement, once the advanced technology was removed, the performances dropped back towards previous levels.

Fair point, the truth obviously lies somewhere in the middle. No modern cyclist would be competitive were he forced to ride a 22lbs circa 1985 steel rig; I suspect the same holds true for 1985 hockey equipment. Furthermore, equipment improvements differ by sport. They have exponentially more effect in disciplines such as cycling and hockey than track & field or soccer.

 

[CMDEADLY]

Sure dude.

I saw broken old fat Mario play next to young Crosby and not look out of place.

If you don’t think young 6’4” 230 lb Mario Lemieux playing in brand new feather light skates and a modern stick he can get a 85 mph wrister off in a split second, wouldn’t be an unbelievable bump, then you really think that only McDavid is some supreme super athlete and his modern training is crazy superior.

Which is pretty silly since we have all seen Jaromir Jagr be a dominant player against this generations stars, and Jagr was great, but he couldn’t hold prime Mario’s jock.

Trust me, as much as you think McDavid would get breakaways at will, Mario would be scoring a wrister a night from anywhere in the ozone.

5% increase. I can see someone has never played with an old school wood stick or skates.pfft

Jagr was not a dominant player against today stars, he was a good player in this generation, he didn't break a ppg in the NHL since 06, hockey sense doesn't leave you because the skill's diminish.

Having said that Lemieux would certainly translate to the modern NHL with relative ease. He's a 6'4 truck with a wicked shot. He'd be a very rich man's Getzlaf in today's game. Gretzky doesn't have a comparable in today's game because no one plays like he did. Free wheeling and slick passing has lost it's luster in today's NHL.

I know you all love Gretz and you all will defend him til you grow old. However, he was a product of his time period.

Goalies were averaging 3 ga, a game up until 1993, where we saw a significant decrease in output in scoring.

Lemieux scored 160 in 1993, followed by Lafontaine at 148, Adam Oates at 142, Yzerman at 137, Salanne and Turgeon at 132, Mogliney and Gilmore at 127, Robitalle at 125, and Recchi at 123.

Only Belfour, and Potvin had less than 3 gaa that season.

Now let's look at the 1994 season, a huge change as the goaltending and defense took a huge step forward in their abilities along with all the new franchises having a few seasons under their belt to really solidify their play.

In first we have Gretzky at 130, a 30 point drop from first place last year, Fedorov at 120, Adam Oates at 112, Gilmour at 111, Bure, Recchi and Roenick at 107, Shanahan at 102, Andreychuk and Jagr at 99.

Our goaltending was way better, Dominik Hasek had a 1.95 gaa as well as almost every goalie in the league being below 3.0.

This is where things get pretty different, the league doesn't see another 130+ scorer with Gretzky in the league until Lemieux returns from his cancer, to put up a staggering 160 points with Jagr as his winger with 149

However even he could not defy the game and where it was headed having a 120 point season the very next year. With Salanne being the only other player to break 100 points at 109.

The trend continued the next year Jagr led the league at 102, no one else broke 100. Jagr broke 100 and Sakic in the next few seasons, however no one got really close to going into the 120+ area.

I think I've laid it out pretty well here that the people thinking that Mcdavid wouldn't put up 180+ are kidding themselves. Along with most of the kids that play in the NHL today. The game is faster tighter, and there isn't room for those statistical powerhouses.

What we are seeing now is a few a rare few players that can break that 100 point barrier. I'd be shocked if anyone broke 130 ever again.

 

[koyvoo]

Gretzky, if you exclude his teammates (beneficiaries of his production) and Lemieux (another true generational player), placing ahead of his competition by close to 100 pts at his best.

When you’re close to 100 pts better than you’re competition, era has nothing to do with it. You’re just a true freak of nature.

 

[CMDEADLY]

Gretzky, if you exclude his teammates (beneficiaries of his production) and Lemieux (another true generational player), placing ahead of his competition by close to 100 pts at his best.

When you’re close to 100 pts better than you’re competition, era has nothing to do with it. You’re just a true freak of nature.

He absolutely was a product of the time period though, I don't see how he wasn't. He's the best assist man of all time. He'd still put up 50 assist if he strapped up his skates today. However, that doesn't mean that did not absolutely pad his stats that he played with a lot of great goal scorers. He had 11 seasons of 100+ assist. That's how good he was, however you gotta remember he wasn't the only guy on those teams.

 

[koyvoo]

He absolutely was a product of the time period though, I don't see how he wasn't. He's the best assist man of all time. He'd still put up 50 assist if he strapped up his skates today. However, that doesn't mean that did not absolutely pad his stats that he played with a lot of great goal scorers. He had 11 seasons of 100+ assist. That's how good he was, however you gotta remember he wasn't the only guy on those teams.

The overall totals were a product of the era. Him being that much better than everyone was not.

At 20 years old he won the scoring title over Mike Bossy by 65 pts and he led his next teammate by 107 pts.

The next year at 21 years old he won the scoring title over Stastny by 72 pts while out scoring his closest teammate by 90 pts

The next year at 22 years old he won the scoring title over Paul Coffey by 79 pts while the next non Oiler in scoring was Goulet who trailed Wayne by 83 pts

The next season at 23 years old he won the scoring title over Kurri by 73 pts while the next non oiler, Hawerchuk was 78 pts behind him.

The next season at 24 years he won the scoring title over Lemieux by 74 pts. The next player (non oilers or non Lemieux) was Bossy who was 92 pts behind Wayne.

That type of dominance over your peers have nothing to do with era, even if the grand scoring totals do.

Even now, it wouldn’t be like McDavid winning the Art Ross by 7-8 pts. Even era adjusted, that type of dominance would see a player today winning the scoring race by 40 pts over their peers.

 

[CMDEADLY]

The overall totals were a product of the era. Him being that much better than everyone was not.

At 20 years old he won the scoring title over Mike Bossy by 65 pts and he led his next teammate by 107 pts.

The next year at 21 years old he won the scoring title over Stastny by 72 pts while out scoring his closest teammate by 90 pts

The next year at 22 years old he won the scoring title over Paul Coffey by 79 pts while the next non Oiler in scoring was Goulet who trailed Wayne by 83 pts

The next season at 23 years old he won the scoring title over Kurri by 73 pts while the next non oiler, Hawerchuk was 78 pts behind him.

The next season at 24 years he won the scoring title over Lemieux by 74 pts. The next player (non oilers or non Lemieux) was Bossy who was 92 pts behind Wayne.

That type of dominance over your peers have nothing to do with era, even if the grand scoring totals do.

Even now, it wouldn’t be like McDavid winning the Art Ross by 7-8 pts. Even era adjusted, that type of dominance would see a player today winning the scoring race by 40 pts over their peers.

I get what you are saying, however being the best assist man of all time would do that just like Ovi is the best goal scorer. No one is denying how good Gretzky was, everyone here is just saying Mcdavid would not have trouble matching it in an Era that was built on skill being absolutely no problem for him.

 

[CMDEADLY]

The pool of talent is much wider than it was in the 80's also.

 

[Gabranth]

Assuming that he has access to modern training and whatever easily better than Gretzky.



Watching this, McDavid is head and shoulder above anything here.

 

[Soundwave]

I dunno about "easily better than Gretzky", but I think 200 points would happen. Are we also assuming he's on the 80s Oilers (in lieu of Gretzky)? Because that would also probably push any players point totals upwards.

 

[Future GOAT]

Assuming that he has access to modern training and whatever easily better than Gretzky.



Watching this, McDavid is head and shoulder above anything here.

I can't even figure out which pixel Gretzky is in some of these, but, when you watch that vid, then compare that to this
right after, it's kind of hard to not believe that there is a massive increase in overall skill of the players today and that a lot of the current NHL elite regardless of equipment would torch the 80s NHL like Gretzky did.

 

[FinnWin]

Playing in the 80s --> born in the 60s. Trying to guess his point totals in this fantasy scenario doesn't really make sense but his name would most likely not have been Connor. Perhaps Gregory. Or Douglas.

 

[PatrikBerglund]

Watch some games from the early/mid 80s.

Compared to today, 2018:

- The skating (technique) was terrible
- The speed was horroible
- The pace of the game was pewee
- The stickhandling was on par with womens hockey today
- the forward's backchecking, defence, positioning etc. was terrible
- The defencemen's ability to skate backwards, pokecheck, be positional etc. was a horribly bad
- The goalies....look at the kind of goals that was scored and I don'tceven have to say how incredibly bad 99% of the goalies were, compared to today.


Are you seriously telling me that McDavid wouldn't completely destroy the NHL if he was sent back to 1980!?

The only thing making him not get 400+ points us if he got injured or if he lost motivation and startrd to do blow, after thinking it was too easy.

 

[alko]

He will be lucky, if he would get 100 points. Because all the others player would never understand his ideas, never be so quick like him and he will be alone in front.

 

[HugginThePost]

Lol no. As much as I love 99 & 66, they would be average in today’s game, however McDavid would be a one man wrecking crew in the 80’s. The game has evolved at a rapid pace.

Ugh.......that's pretty cringe-worthy.

 

[HugginThePost]

I get what you are saying, however being the best assist man of all time would do that just like Ovi is the best goal scorer. No one is denying how good Gretzky was, everyone here is just saying Mcdavid would not have trouble matching it in an Era that was built on skill being absolutely no problem for him.

No no......not everyone is saying this.

In fact it seems to only be a few delusional folk saying this.

 

[ovythegiraffe]

Any current nhl player would murder it if time traveled to 1980s with today's gear. Professional training with shooting, fitness and skating starts at peewee hockey now and no 1980s goalie could stop the lazers people do with today's sticks