Prospect Info: Marlies/Prospects- Early Off Season time

[joe dirte]

I think you mean AHL eligible, he can go to the NHL at any time.

Yeah just a slip. I said AHL in every other post

 

[stickty111]

Here is my top 20 after doing my full prospect report.

1. Liljegren
2. Sandin
3. Robertson
4. Bracco
5. Abramov
6. Korshkov
7. SDA
8. Kokkonen
9. Abruzzese
10. Woll
11. Lindgren
12. Hollowell
13. Kral
14. Duszak
15. Scott
16. Koster
17. Kara
18. Holmberg
19. Rasanen
20. Brooks

 

[stickty111]

Mods new thread. Other one was way over the limit, and got derailed for one wierd reason.

 

[xxOCZMSxx]

I’m a semi-knowledgable person re: prospect following looking for a current top ten (ish) list of prospects...
Go!

 

[SeaOfBlue]

There was just a top 20 list of Leafs prospects in a ridiculous amount of depth from someone who knows quite a bit about prospects. Just go through there, and maybe he can provide a summary of the top 20.

 

[stickty111]

There was just a top 20 list of Leafs prospects in a ridiculous amount of depth from someone who knows quite a bit about prospects. Just go through there, and maybe he can provide a summary of the top 20.

Thanks for the kind words, but I wouldn't say I know a lot. I think you know more then me honestly.
All though if you were to ask a certain someone who derailed the conversation, I know nothing about them.

 

[stickty111]

I’m a semi-knowledgable person re: prospect following looking for a current top ten (ish) list of prospects...
Go!

1. Liljegren
2. Sandin
3. Robertson
4. Bracco
5. Abramov
6. Korshkov
7. SDA
8. Kokkonen
9. Abruzzese
10. Woll
11. Lindgren
12. Hollowell
13. Kral
14. Duszak
15. Scott
16. Koster
17. Kara
18. Holmberg
19. Rasanen
20. Brooks
I just did an analysis on them. If you want a summary I can provide that.
I don't claim I am correct in my list though

 

[Kiwi]

1. Liljegren
2. Sandin
3. Robertson
4. Bracco
5. Abramov
6. Korshkov
7. SDA
8. Kokkonen
9. Abruzzese
10. Woll
11. Lindgren
12. Hollowell
13. Kral
14. Duszak
15. Scott
16. Koster
17. Kara
18. Holmberg
19. Rasanen
20. Brooks
I just did an analysis on them. If you want a summary I can provide that.
I don't claim I am correct in my list though

Good list Stickty, I've got some different options but you and I debating the differences is a large part of the fun

 

[stickty111]

Good list Stickty, I've got some different options but you and I debating the differences is a large part of the fun

Thanks

 

[Isaac Nootin]

1. Liljegren
2. Sandin
3. Robertson
4. Bracco
5. Abramov
6. Korshkov
7. SDA
8. Kokkonen
9. Abruzzese
10. Woll
11. Lindgren
12. Hollowell
13. Kral
14. Duszak
15. Scott
16. Koster
17. Kara
18. Holmberg
19. Rasanen
20. Brooks
I just did an analysis on them. If you want a summary I can provide that.
I don't claim I am correct in my list though

I don't agree with your list, but I appreciate the time and effort you've put into compiling it.

 

[stickty111]

I don't agree with your list, but I appreciate the time and effort you've put into compiling it.

Thanks. I expect some disagreements. Looking back it, I would change some things around.

 

[deletethis]

Liljegren isn't the Leafs' best prospect (behind a couple of forwards and Sandin) but he's the team's most important prospect. Him developing eventually into a 2nd pairing right side defender would do a lot to solve the on-going issues Dubas has cobbling together a decent right side on defense every summer. Maybe he can play the 3rd pairing next season. That would be a big development in the short term with Holl on the 2nd pairing and hopefully a quality 1st pairing right sider acquired in the summer. The Leafs' fortunes for 2020-21 sort of rest on the right side of the defense.

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Bracco at #4? He really can't be considered any NHL at all.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Liljegren isn't the Leafs' best prospect (behind a couple of forwards and Sandin) but he's the team's most important prospect. Him developing eventually into a 2nd pairing right side defender would do a lot to solve the on-going issues Dubas has cobbling together a decent right side on defense every summer. Maybe he can play the 3rd pairing next season. That would be a big development in the short term with Holl on the 2nd pairing and hopefully a quality 1st pairing right sider acquired in the summer. The Leafs' fortunes for 2020-21 sort of rest on the right side of the defense.

Couple of forwards?

 

[deletethis]

Bracco at #4? He really can't be considered any NHL at all.

He'll probably be on waivers in before the next season starts wherever he lands in the off season. He was challenged to grow his game from the perimeter right wing playmaker tendencies this past season and his season went the other direction. That's not the number 4 prospect.

 

[stickty111]

Couple of forwards?

This one should be interesting.

 

[stickty111]

End of year prospect Awards
Top Prospect-Timothy Liljegren
You could make the case for Sandin, and I wouldn’t totally disagree with it, but Liljegren has the same top pair upside, and has grown really well.

Prospect of the year-Nicholas Robertson
This is the only one which I can say nobody but him deserved it. Many prospects had great seasons, but what Robertson did this season is simply amazing, and turned himself into an elite prospect.

Highest Upside-Rasmus Sandin
There were contenders in Roberson and maybe Liljegren, but Sandin’s development has taken a major boom since being drafted. The steps he has taken have been remarkable, and he isn’t even scratching the surface of what he could become. His upside is a true #1 defenseman who can drive play, and give you major minutes in every situation.

Best Offensive skills(non Shot)-SDA
I made a different section for skills and shot because I feel like it would be unfair to some prospects. I don’t think it’s fair to knock a 5 shot grade prospect if his skills are only 3 or something, and vice versa. I had thoughts about this one between SDA and Bracco. They are both passing wizards and truly elite playmakers. I went with SDA though because I feel like SDA’s skills show up on even strength more than it does for Bracco. Maybe it’s the wrong way to look at things, but I do value high even strength production highly. Despite Bracco’s high point totals in the AHL, it is a fair argument his passes show up more on the PP.

Best Shot-Nicholas Robertson
This one goes without saying

Best Skater-Mac Hollowell
I didn’t have much debate on this one either. His skating is fantastic in every way. Speed, agility, edgework, escapability, Hollowell has all of it.

Defense-Mikko Kokkonen
I had thoughts of Lilljegren, but Kokkonen has been regarded as an advanced defensive player for his age, and is NHL ready in terms of defensive play. His awareness of what to do in each situation is terrific.

Compete-Nicholas Robertson
Again don’t need to explain this

Hockey IQ/Smarts-Nick Abruzzese
The good thing about the Leafs system is that there are many high IQ players. From Kokkonen, to Holmberg, to Sandin, Lilljegren among others, but I am giving to Abruzzese. He has a lot of skill, but his points come from because he is extremely smart. Scouts really like his smarts, and the way he studies the game well.

Most Underrated Prospect-Jesper Lindgren
I am going to continue on this train. He has had steady development throughout his career, and was one of the better defensemen for the Marlies this season, and if he can stay healthy, he should receive an NHL call up sooner rather than later.

Prospect who took the biggest step-Nicholas Robertson
Honestly, you could give this to Abramov or Abruzzese, but unprecedented goal scoring and growth after his draft year, I can’t give it to anyone else

Prospect who could take the biggest step-Mikko Kokkonen
This one might surprise some, but his game is so well rounded and translatable that I wouldn’t be surprised he establishes himself as a great defenseman in Liiga, and his 2nd half was really good this season.

 

[ACC1224]

His recent seasln I think has soured folks on him.

Hes at an age where he should look overwhelmingly ready to make an NHL roster and it just hasnt clicked.

Imo the fact he didnt even get a callup seems telling management are looking to move on from him sooner rather than later

I think it's pretty much a given now that he'll be moved before next season starts.

Safe to say at this point that Robertson is the top forward prospect with Sandin being the top defensive prospect.
Seems to be a grab bag of forwards after Robertson, Lilligrin after Sandin.

Make or break it year for Lilligrin? Seems he's been around for a while.

 

[ChazzMichaelMichaels]

End of year prospect Awards

Prospect of the year:
I'll give it to Nick Robertson just cause of the level of development he took

Best Offensive skills:
Either Robertson or Sandin gets this from me

Most underrated:
I think this is either Abramov or Kokkonen. Pretty high on both, I think I'd give it to Abramov at this point just cause he had a more positive season this year.

Hockey IQ/Smarts:
Kinda surprised this isn't just straight Sandin from everyone. I'd say the large majority of posters here and fans in general would say Sandin is our top prospect and hockey IQ and smarts to me is his main asset that makes him what he is. His entire game revolves around these attributes and are what makes him so good.

 

[deletethis]

Kokkonen's lack of acceleration is going to be a big road block. The Leafs have drafted lower ceiling big D guys with better acceleration. I believe the Leafs took a flyer on the player because it is impressive to survive a season in the top Finnish league as a full time defenseman at 17. Of the top first 4 picks in the 2019 draft, Kokkonen is easily the weakest selection.

I have questions about SDA. It seems simplistic but go ahead name an NHL non-fighter forward who didn't crack 20 goals at the CHL level after 4 tries. I can't name one. I know he flashes skills as a playmaker and he seems to have an advanced sense of body position battling with his bigger opponents (I remember Matt Stajan had this). It becomes too easy to defend a forward in the pros if he is always looking to pass because he can't finish at least sometimes.

The prospect we're only just starting to talk about is Filip Kral. I see a higher growth potential in this prospect. Perhaps he could become Tomas Kaberle-lite or a less frantic/panicky Martin Marincin type.

I question Sandin's hockey smarts a slight bit. Last season he did have a Jake Gardiner style tendency of creating trouble for himself when given too much time in his own zone. It's probably a combo of unwavering confidence and rookie mistakes. In the category of Most Confident Prospect, Sandin wins. He's also the Leafs' most competitive prospect as well.

 

[LeafChief]

@SeaOfBlue - I really enjoyed your write up on Greenway in the previous thread. Good to hear there is still a chance with him.

Has he played with much of an edge in his college career? I haven't watched much of him since his freshman season.

 

[stickty111]

Prospect of the year:
I'll give it to Nick Robertson just cause of the level of development he took

Best Offensive skills:
Either Robertson or Sandin gets this from me

Most underrated:
I think this is either Abramov or Kokkonen. Pretty high on both, I think I'd give it to Abramov at this point just cause he had a more positive season this year.

Hockey IQ/Smarts:
Kinda surprised this isn't just straight Sandin from everyone. I'd say the large majority of posters here and fans in general would say Sandin is our top prospect and hockey IQ and smarts to me is his main asset that makes him what he is. His entire game revolves around these attributes and are what makes him so good.

I think in a couple years time Sandin could have great IQ. I think I gave him a 4 or 4.5 as a FV. He makes mistakee around decision making in the defensive zone, but that will clean up in time. It's why I didn't give it to him.
Abruzzese's smarts are fantastic though.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

@SeaOfBlue - I really enjoyed your write up on Greenway in the previous thread. Good to hear there is still a chance with him.

Has he played with much of an edge in his college career? I haven't watched much of him since his freshman season.

Thanks!

I could not say about his physicality, but typically a guy does not suddenly become less physical unless he suffers an injury (Greenway has not had any notable injuries yet) or he was overly aggressive and needed to dial it back a bit. Considering he has 61 PIM's, I would imagine he does. He does not seem like the type of guy who would take a ton of hooking or tripping penalties because his skating ability is great, so he is likely getting more aggressive penalties like slashing or roughing (and since he has an odd number of PIM's, he has at least one fight). But in terms of the Maine highlight clips, physicality does not really show all that often (it's mostly just goals or amazing saves). He is definitely a massive guy who can move though, and he certainly is not soft based on what I have seen. However at times, and this is when he gets beat for a goal against, it looks like he can get caught between covering two guys, or is trying to aim for stick over body and the guy gets on the inside of him. However, with the rules in the NCAA and most other junior leagues, they can often be a lot more strict when it comes to a big guy bodying up guys in tight areas, so he would probably like to be a lot more aggressive than he is permitted.

All of our prospects still have a chance. Unlike other teams, we only have a few prospects who look like total write-offs at this point (Chebykin, Bobylev and maybe O'Connell). With his pending rights expiry though, Greenway will certainly be one I am watching next year.

 

[7even]

All of our prospects still have a chance. Unlike other teams, we only have a few prospects who look like total write-offs at this point (Chebykin, Bobylev and maybe O'Connell). With his pending rights expiry though, Greenway will certainly be one I am watching next year.

I'd add Kizimov, Stotts, and Rasanen as guys who are looking pretty marginal. I'm sure I'll catch some flak on Stotts but there really just isn't any one thing he excels at.

I'm just dreadfully disappointed in the path Rasanen chose after his draft year. I can't help but feel he may have been cultivated into a decent player if he stayed in NA.

 

[Fogelhund]

Thanks!

I could not say about his physicality, but typically a guy does not suddenly become less physical unless he suffers an injury (Greenway has not had any notable injuries yet) or he was overly aggressive and needed to dial it back a bit. Considering he has 61 PIM's, I would imagine he does. He does not seem like the type of guy who would take a ton of hooking or tripping penalties because his skating ability is great, so he is likely getting more aggressive penalties like slashing or roughing (and since he has an odd number of PIM's, he has at least one fight). But in terms of the Maine highlight clips, physicality does not really show all that often (it's mostly just goals or amazing saves). He is definitely a massive guy who can move though, and he certainly is not soft based on what I have seen. However at times, and this is when he gets beat for a goal against, it looks like he can get caught between covering two guys, or is trying to aim for stick over body and the guy gets on the inside of him. However, with the rules in the NCAA and most other junior leagues, they can often be a lot more strict when it comes to a big guy bodying up guys in tight areas, so he would probably like to be a lot more aggressive than he is permitted.

All of our prospects still have a chance. Unlike other teams, we only have a few prospects who look like total write-offs at this point (Chebykin, Bobylev and maybe O'Connell). With his pending rights expiry though, Greenway will certainly be one I am watching next year.

No fights. One five minute major for kneeing... Slashing, interference, Goalie Interference, Tripping, Interference, Elbowing, Charging, Hitting after the whistle, roughing, Interference, Holding....