Marc Bergevin: At the End o'da Day

[DAChampion]

Ya, that is a new way, but most teams don't operate like this yet.

I honestly cannot say why Bergevin is still here. It is one of the great mysteries out there. Even non-Habs related media ask this question. Not sure how this guy gets chance after chance when it's clear he's been a massive failure.
If it wasn't clear before, it should be quite obvious by now that Bergevin rode the wave over the success of the earlier years. He wasn't being a good GM, he was very complacent, with no direction or structure. It was already pretty clear back in 15-16 after collapsing that Bergevin was bad with no vision. At this point, it should be pretty freaking obvious.

Molson is cognitively captured.

 

[PaulD]

Correct. Fans will stop watching if they feel shortchanged, duped, lied to.

The GM won't admit to a rebuild. He claimed it was a "reset", but no one knows what that means exactly.

Then some are saying it's a "retool". Is that the same as a reset?

Lack of trust in management and in ownership is stemming from the absence of a clear sense of direction. Are we buyers, like we were reported to be during the UFA frenzy? Are we sellers, like the rumored Pacioretty trade offers that fell through?

What's the business with all that cap room? Habs have always been a team spending to the cap, why are we carrying forward so much of it yet again? Is it an ownership prerogative or mismanagement or both?

The owner promises "no stones left unturned" and all we have to show for his promises, are the addition of Bouchard and Ducharme -- two great hires, no doubt -- the dispatching of some deadwood. However, the audit of the org. is nowhere close to what Geoff promised. Why do we still have the same personnel for Pro and Amateur Scouting? Are they that good? Or, does Geoff think they don't bear any responsibility for the mess we're in?

Geoff sits with Bergevin at the year-end presser, conducting the autopsy of another season gone awry and proposing a vague gameplan that somehow includes better food and beverage. Why is he talking about that stuff at a hockey ops presser? Who is watching the gatekeeper?

So this reset/retool, how does it work exactly? The GM claimed there was a major attitude problem in the dressing room that he tried to address early in the season. And now we're supposed to believe it's been resolved? How, by the trade of one player for Domi? One guy poisoned a dressing room? Good thing one of Galchenyuk's girlfriends didn't send nasty and threatening texts to a teammate's wife.

The owner and GM barely had time to make promises about greater transparency at the year-end presser. First opportunity to be transparent was the Weber injury. They knew weeks before that major surgery was required and that Weber would be out for a significant portion of the season. But no, they sit on the info -- conceivably to not hurt their season ticket drive.

So, same team as last year minus Galchenyuk replaced by an assists producer on a team that finished 28th in goal scoring. What's the game plan? Still don't know.

Now, if they announce a plan, explain it. And act pursuant to it. And then as a fan, I'll buy in even if the on-ice product is crap. It will have the merit of at least sounding serious and respectful of the fan base and we're all going to be on the same page in terms of where the team is going on the short, medium and longer term.

However, how can you take what they're doing, seriously? Geoff is allowing the same guy who brought to this point, to continue leading the way, relying mostly on the same advisors. It makes no sense. Nor does watching the nonsense they're serving up in the upcoming season.

I didnt watch the Canadiens last season. This season is not even a consideration.

That wont change until Bargain Bin and all he brings is gone. Even then the damage done will be hard to watch.

 

[DAChampion]

I didnt watch the Canadiens last season. This season is not even a consideration.

Same.

 

[Censored Toad]

I'll watch because I want to see it burn... not nearly as many games as I used too.

 

[Habs Icing]

Bull****. Nobody gives a crap if we rebuild or not, every single fan I talk to is completely okay with rebuilding. I have yet to meet anybody who told me they will stop watching/following if they do a rebuild.
This idea that montreal can't rebuild is pure fabrication by the organization/media.

Although I agree with most of your post, I think you're wrong on this point. Montreal is a terrible sports town. Great for events like the Jazz Fest and Just For Laughs, that last a short period of time but when it comes to loyalty over the long haul forget it. Just go look at the Als, Impact and lest we forget the Expos.

Quite honestly Montrealers are delusional. They believe they live in the best of cities when in fact Montreal doesn't even rank as one of the best in Canada. In international surveys Montreal constantly falls behind T.O., Vancouver and it's even starting to trail Calgary. Hab fans have latched on to the Canadiens glorious history and that's what's keeping them still interested in the Habs. But Even the Canadiens can't survive three, four years of bottom feeding. The fans will turn away. A spotty record of two playoff years with one non-playoff year they can put up with.

Look at a city like Boston that has a comparable population. They have the big five leagues: MLB, NBA, NFL, MLS, NHL. None of their teams are rumoured to go under. Well when the Molsons were trying to sell the team in the late 90s no one wanted to buy it except for a stray Yank.

Everyone you spoke to wouldn't mind a rebuild. That's anecdotal not very scientific. I'll bet you my dollars to your donuts, Molson has had a number of surveys conducted where they asked the fans if they would put up with a 3-4 year rebuild in other words being a bottom feeding team. The answer probably scared the crap out of Molson.

We get the teams we deserve. Maybe not the guys that come onto this forum but be honest with yourself. The guys who come to this forum are not representative of the Hab fans. The typical Hab fan will desert this team quicker than a rat will desert a sinking ship.

 

[PaulD]

I'll watch because I want to see it burn... not nearly as many games as I used too.

We are still laughing in this house at the rookie GM in Toronto signing Tavares while Bozo signs Plekanec.

 

[PaulD]

Although I agree with most of your post, I think you're wrong on this point. Montreal is a terrible sports town. Great for events like the Jazz Fest and Just For Laughs, that last a short period of time but when it comes to loyalty over the long haul forget it. Just go look at the Als, Impact and lest we forget the Expos.

Quite honestly Montrealers are delusional. They believe they live in the best of cities when in fact Montreal doesn't even rank as one of the best in Canada. In international surveys Montreal constantly falls behind T.O., Vancouver and it's even starting to trail Calgary. Hab fans have latched on to the Canadiens glorious history and that's what's keeping them still interested in the Habs. But Even the Canadiens can't survive three, four years of bottom feeding. The fans will turn away. A spotty record of two playoff years with one non-playoff year they can put up with.

Look at a city like Boston that has a comparable population. They have the big five leagues: MLB, NBA, NFL, MLS, NHL. None of their teams are rumoured to go under. Well when the Molsons were trying to sell the team in the late 90s no one wanted to buy it except for a stray Yank.

Everyone you spoke to wouldn't mind a rebuild. That's anecdotal not very scientific. I'll bet you my dollars to your donuts, Molson has had a number of surveys conducted where they asked the fans if they would put up with a 3-4 year rebuild in other words being a bottom feeding team. The answer probably scared the crap out of Molson.

We get the teams we deserve. Maybe not the guys that come onto this forum but be honest with yourself. The guys who come to this forum are not representative of the Hab fans. The typical Hab fan will desert this team quicker than a rat will desert a sinking ship.

20.000 a night still going to watch a team that has Bendan Gallagher as their best player, a moron for an ower, and a high school drop as president and GM.

They could be deadlast for the next 5 seasons and still get 20,000 a night. They will all be complaining sure. But they will have their wallets out. Thousand more will be watching the tire fire on their big screens at home.

Fans in the city of Montreal are showing to be no different than fans in the city of Toronto. The come in droves win, lose, or draw.

 

[habsfan909]

Although I agree with most of your post, I think you're wrong on this point. Montreal is a terrible sports town. Great for events like the Jazz Fest and Just For Laughs, that last a short period of time but when it comes to loyalty over the long haul forget it. Just go look at the Als, Impact and lest we forget the Expos.

Quite honestly Montrealers are delusional. They believe they live in the best of cities when in fact Montreal doesn't even rank as one of the best in Canada. In international surveys Montreal constantly falls behind T.O., Vancouver and it's even starting to trail Calgary. Hab fans have latched on to the Canadiens glorious history and that's what's keeping them still interested in the Habs. But Even the Canadiens can't survive three, four years of bottom feeding. The fans will turn away. A spotty record of two playoff years with one non-playoff year they can put up with.

Look at a city like Boston that has a comparable population. They have the big five leagues: MLB, NBA, NFL, MLS, NHL. None of their teams are rumoured to go under. Well when the Molsons were trying to sell the team in the late 90s no one wanted to buy it except for a stray Yank.

Everyone you spoke to wouldn't mind a rebuild. That's anecdotal not very scientific. I'll bet you my dollars to your donuts, Molson has had a number of surveys conducted where they asked the fans if they would put up with a 3-4 year rebuild in other words being a bottom feeding team. The answer probably scared the crap out of Molson.

We get the teams we deserve. Maybe not the guys that come onto this forum but be honest with yourself. The guys who come to this forum are not representative of the Hab fans. The typical Hab fan will desert this team quicker than a rat will desert a sinking ship.

At this point, Molson needs the Habs in the playoffs so he has reason to keep Bergevin.

 

[BLONG7]

That's not what I was alluding to though...

This team is trending up even if a lot of posters can't see it...

We're finally starting to have a decent prospect pipeline...

Agreed...

 

[PaulD]

I hope you’re wrong lol

We are so bad though that adding a let’s say ROR would of marginally made us better.....we’d still be in my humble opinion a bottom 4-5-6 team but at least we’d have one centre position rectified.

The future lies with the kids....we will go as far as Kotkaniemi, Poehling, Brooks, Olafsson, Scherbak, Juulsen and Fleury take us, plus whoever we draft this year.

I have no faith in Bergevin acquiring us the help, it’s gonna go through the draft. I’m just hoping he doesn’t trade away our young talent which I believe he won’t seeing how the Sergachev trade went down.

Here’s to a losing season my friend

There are contending and near contending teams loaded with young talent on the current roster now, with the same plan for their own prospects coming up. Nobody is waiting for the Habs to catch up. Plus every team in the league has a smarter Gm in place to guide the ship.

Habs are going nowhere. It will be all they can do just to stay above water.

 

[PaulD]

Ya, that is a new way, but most teams don't operate like this yet.

I honestly cannot say why Bergevin is still here. It is one of the great mysteries out there. Even non-Habs related media ask this question. Not sure how this guy gets chance after chance when it's clear he's been a massive failure.
If it wasn't clear before, it should be quite obvious by now that Bergevin rode the wave over the success of the earlier years. He wasn't being a good GM, he was very complacent, with no direction or structure. It was already pretty clear back in 15-16 after collapsing that Bergevin was bad with no vision. At this point, it should be pretty freaking obvious.

On the fan 590 in Toronto last week the first question the host asked a Montreal reporter was "how does Marc Bergevin still have a job"

 

[DAChampion]

20.000 a night still going to watch a team that has Bendan Gallagher as their best player, a moron for an ower, and a high school drop as president and GM.

They could be deadlast for the next 5 seasons and still get 20,000 a night. They will all be complaining sure. But they will have their wallets out. Thousand more will be watching the tire fire on their big screens at home.

Fans in the city of Montreal are showing to be no different than fans in the city of Toronto. The come in droves win, lose, or draw.

A lot of Montrealers have a high opinion of Montreal. They say that the city has a tremendous nightlife, amazing culture, amazing joie de vivre, etc etc etc. It's supposedly one of the best cities in the world to live in. We sometimes see this on this board, when posters write that UFAs should come here because then city is more fun to live in.

Fact is, it reflects poorly on Montreal's cultural vitality if the Habs can keep getting 20,000 fans a game in the next few years.

 

[Bryson]

Although I agree with most of your post, I think you're wrong on this point. Montreal is a terrible sports town. Great for events like the Jazz Fest and Just For Laughs, that last a short period of time but when it comes to loyalty over the long haul forget it. Just go look at the Als, Impact and lest we forget the Expos.

Quite honestly Montrealers are delusional. They believe they live in the best of cities when in fact Montreal doesn't even rank as one of the best in Canada. In international surveys Montreal constantly falls behind T.O., Vancouver and it's even starting to trail Calgary. Hab fans have latched on to the Canadiens glorious history and that's what's keeping them still interested in the Habs. But Even the Canadiens can't survive three, four years of bottom feeding. The fans will turn away. A spotty record of two playoff years with one non-playoff year they can put up with.

Look at a city like Boston that has a comparable population. They have the big five leagues: MLB, NBA, NFL, MLS, NHL. None of their teams are rumoured to go under. Well when the Molsons were trying to sell the team in the late 90s no one wanted to buy it except for a stray Yank.

Everyone you spoke to wouldn't mind a rebuild. That's anecdotal not very scientific. I'll bet you my dollars to your donuts, Molson has had a number of surveys conducted where they asked the fans if they would put up with a 3-4 year rebuild in other words being a bottom feeding team. The answer probably scared the crap out of Molson.

We get the teams we deserve. Maybe not the guys that come onto this forum but be honest with yourself. The guys who come to this forum are not representative of the Hab fans. The typical Hab fan will desert this team quicker than a rat will desert a sinking ship.

Good post.

Short term pain for long term gain. The habs are heading for missing 3 playoffs in the last 4 years so the team could have been rebuilding whether the fans wanted to or not. Like PaulD said the Bell Center will still be sold out for the next several years. Fans would get behind a GM with a plan and vision as long as there is hope for the future and the current on ice product isn't complete trash to watch like it is now. What's the point of playing a boring super defensive system and playing not to lose? They are going to lose anyway.

Another question is, is it really necessary to tank in order to build a contender? Gainey never tanked and think about the team he would have inherited in 2012-13 had he stayed on as GM of the team. I think that the team would have kept on improving. That's what the power of good drafting and development can do for a team.

Nobody wanted to buy the Canadiens back in 2001 because they were bleeding money, being mismanaged and being run to the ground. I wonder just how much damage Molson has done to the current team's brand and image. A team that trades away their star players away left and right isn't worth much and nobody wants to support a team that is operating the Salary Cap as if it were a basement team. Molson wants his cake and eat it too.

I find that comment about Boston supporting 5 Major League teams super interesting while Montreal can barely support one team. How do they do it? Looking at Google Montreal has a population of 1.75M while Boston has only 675K? The Celtics and Bruins share the TD Garden, The Patriots and New England Revolution share the Gilette Stadium while the Red Sox have Fenway Park. Pretty impressive.

I wonder if a downtown stadium would have saved the expos? Speaking strictly from personal opinion.. I don't care too much for the MLS or CFL. I was a diehard Toronto Raptors fans back in the Vince Carter and Tracy McGrady days mainly because they were the only Canadian NBA team. I would definitely have gone to some games if MTL had their own team. So really the NHL is really the only MTL team I care about to follow religiously.

 

[Habs Icing]

I find that comment about Boston supporting 5 Major League teams super interesting while Montreal can barely support one team. How do they do it? Looking at Google Montreal has a population of 1.75M while Boston has only 675K? The Celtics and Bruins share the TD Garden, The Patriots and New England Revolution share the Gilette Stadium while the Red Sox have Fenway Park. Pretty impressive.

You gotta be careful with that. The states define cities differently than we do. If you search for the greater Montreal/Boston pop you'll get a better picture.

Greater Boston pop is 4.7 million. Greater Montreal 4.1.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Ya, that is a new way, but most teams don't operate like this yet.

I honestly cannot say why Bergevin is still here. It is one of the great mysteries out there. Even non-Habs related media ask this question. Not sure how this guy gets chance after chance when it's clear he's been a massive failure.
If it wasn't clear before, it should be quite obvious by now that Bergevin rode the wave over the success of the earlier years. He wasn't being a good GM, he was very complacent, with no direction or structure. It was already pretty clear back in 15-16 after collapsing that Bergevin was bad with no vision. At this point, it should be pretty freaking obvious.

I don't find this a difficult question to answer at all to be honest. Geoff signed him to a 5 year extension well before he had done anything to earn it, and now he's pinching pennies. I don't believe Molson believes in MB anymore either. Terrible way to operate imo, because he's causing irrevocable damage while filling out the last couple years before he gets canned. I knew Molson wouldn't fire him with that contract in place. I think we could be stuck with him again next year too.

 

[Bryson]

You gotta be careful with that. The states define cities differently than we do. If you search for the greater Montreal/Boston pop you'll get a better picture.

Greater Boston pop is 4.7 million. Greater Montreal 4.1.

Makes sense. I thought as much. So the populations are similar but Boston is still able to support 5 Major League teams. Pretty impressive.

 

[lo striver]

You gotta be careful with that. The states define cities differently than we do. If you search for the greater Montreal/Boston pop you'll get a better picture.

Greater Boston pop is 4.7 million. Greater Montreal 4.1.

well, in all fairness, Boston teams draw support from most of New England . that's like 10-15 mil.

 

[Habs Icing]

well, in all fairness, Boston teams draw support from most of New England . that's like 10-15 mil.

The same could be said about Montreal drawing from the rest of Quebec (up to Quebec City), eastern Ontario and upstate New York, Vermont and Maine. I'll grant you it wouldn't be 10-15 mil but close enough not to excuse the inability to support 5 major league teams.

 

[DAChampion]

Boston has a far greater population, the way that they define statistical area is probably closer to how Montreal defines metropolitan area.

Boston also has more money. Compare McGill to Harvard or UdeM to MIT.

 

[Istvan]

If the planets misalign a young Habs squad, with influence from Ducharme and Richardson, might accidentally play some decent hockey despite MB's proven, gross incompetence..............or not!

 

[WG]

At this point, Molson needs the Habs in the playoffs so he has reason to keep Bergevin.

Wait, what? Is there a word missing ("NO reason to keep Bergevin")? The more Marc Bergevin has put his personal stamp on the team, he has given ownership three home playoff games in the past three years and his attitude infused roster seems poised to miss the POs again.

Bergevin's continued employment has to be equal parts Molson's financial commitment to him coupled with the fact it would make Molson look like a dumbass to shit-can a GM he unnecessarily extended, with so many years left to go.

 

[DAChampion]

it would make Molson look like a dumbass to ****-can a GM he unnecessarily extended, with so many years left to go.

All will be forgiven if a new GM is hired and succeeds in getting the Habs to win.

 

[NobleSix]

On the fan 590 in Toronto last week the first question the host asked a Montreal reporter was "how does Marc Bergevin still have a job"

That illusive question is definitely right up there with "what is the meaning of life". Its just something that cannot be definitively answered.

 

[BLONG7]

Boston has a far greater population, the way that they define statistical area is probably closer to how Montreal defines metropolitan area.

Boston also has more money. Compare McGill to Harvard or UdeM to MIT.

The fans of those teams, deserve a big kudos!! Supporting their teams to the end......very impressive. Sox, Pats, Celtics, Bruins...

 

[DAChampion]

The fans of those teams, deserve a big kudos!! Supporting their teams to the end......very impressive. Sox, Pats, Celtics, Bruins...

That's more commendable than supporting a mismanaged team, and in any case, those teams had lean years prior to their recent successes.