Rumor: Leafs trying to acquire pick #5

[pspot]

Maybe Babcock thinks he can fix Semin?

he's traditionally been a strong adv stats player
if you can get him back to producing (they can offer him opportunity of time) he'd be worth somethign with retention

 

[Grapes1]

Trading the #5 overall for Kessel + #24 overall and able to dump ($44 mil in salary as well to offset Kessel's $56 mil contract) makes no sense?

Canes are getting Kessel for the net $$ contract difference of +$12 mil net (spread over 7 years term) to move back 19 spots in the 2015 draft from #5 to #24.

Leafs paid 2 X top 10 picks (2nd & 9th) + high 2nd (#32) for Kessel alone and you would think Kessel for #5 overall would be a possibility and yet Leafs are still tossing in another 1st (#24) and eating $44 mil in salary take back also.

Are you sure you don't mean this doesn't make any sense from a Leafs perspective?

I can see why Canes would do this, not sure why the Leafs would unless that is the best Kessel offer on the table.

Ya I kind of agree. Pretty much its Kessel for 5th overall. However they need to shed cap and we wouldn't take Semin without taking Skinner (who the leafs probably hope turns it around) and Canes don't want to give up Skinner for nothing, so we give them 24th pick. I know its just a rumor, but that's the way I see this, if it actually did happen. Likely not though.

Really when you think about it, we shouldn't even give them the 24th pick for that deal. Kessel for 5th & Skinner and cap dump Semin.

It would be nice to get another pick in the 5-8 range SOMEHOW without giving up the 24th pick.

 

[Stigma]

Maybe Babcock thinks he can fix Semin?

Actually, that's exactly what Blundell said!

I actually listened to this on the car radio, but was driving in traffic at the time and didn't hear everything clearly. I did hear the "player over 23" piece, and the 24th pick included.

I also heard something about Skinner in the deal.

Hopefully, the MP3 of this finds its way online soon.

 

[Razz]

I like this deal for both sides. Addresses both teams needs quite well. I think Kessel would thrive with Staal and the Leafs could swallow Semin's contract and get a major piece in their rebuild.

Carolina tanking doesn't seem like a good move. Dumping Semin's contract and getting a major upgrade in Kessel would be huge for them. Kessel still is a star in the League. Revenue implications are huge imo.

 

[Menzinger]

Blundell has about as many inside sources to the Leafs as I do. He probably read this on Hockeybuzz or he trade forms on hfboards.

I would rather do this.

Kessel + Nylander for Lindholm + 5th pick + Semin($ dump)

Skinner's concussion history makes him a tough player to accept for return.

There would be no way that Shanahan trades
Nylander on a deal like that. Rebuilding teams don't trade blue chip prospects... It just doesn't happen. Not to mention in terms of asset management it's a terrible deal for the leafs.

 

[pspot]

Actually, that's exactly what Blundell said!

I actually listened to this on the car radio, but was driving in traffic at the time and didn't hear everything clearly. I did hear the "player over 23" piece, and the 24th pick included.

I also heard something about Skinner in the deal.

Hopefully, the MP3 of this finds its way online soon.

Semin, Skinner, 5th for JVR, Gardiner and 24th

that's a pretty huge deal but kind of works

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Blundell has about as many inside sources to the Leafs as I do. He probably read this on Hockeybuzz or he trade forms on hfboards.



There would be no way that Shanahan trades
Nylander on a deal like that. Rebuilding teams don't trade blue chip prospects... It just doesn't happen. Not to mention in terms of asset management it's a terrible deal for the leafs.

Nylander is a prospect. We have no idea how Hunter views him. I have read here, Hunter values OHL guys, and perhaps is more familiar with Marner.

Marner and Hanifin are also prospects. If Hunter values either as being better fits to the Leafs, and we know he has mentioned these 2 in interviews.

Then why wouldn't he make a deal involving Nylander, if indeed getting rid of Kessel is what the Leafs want to do. And the return is Hanifin and Marner.

 

[Mess]

Ya I kind of agree. Pretty much its Kessel for 5th overall. However they need to shed cap and we wouldn't take Semin without taking Skinner (who the leafs probably hope turns it around) and Canes don't want to give up Skinner for nothing, so we give them 24th pick. I know its just a rumor, but that's the way I see this, if it actually did happen. Likely not though.

Really when you think about it, we shouldn't even give them the 24th pick for that deal. Kessel for 5th & Skinner and cap dump Semin.

It would be nice to get another pick in the 5-8 range SOMEHOW.

This Canes speculation would be the eqivalent of Montreal attempting to acquire the Leafs pick #4 overall and offering Max Pacioretty + 26th overall + willing to take cap dump contracts Horton + Lupul ($26.5 + $15.75 = $42.25 mil balance) back.

 

[ACC1224]

Blundell has about as many inside sources to the Leafs as I do. He probably read this on Hockeybuzz or he trade forms on hfboards.



There would be no way that Shanahan trades
Nylander on a deal like that. Rebuilding teams don't trade blue chip prospects... It just doesn't happen. Not to mention in terms of asset management it's a terrible deal for the leafs.

I agree. Trading Nylander makes zero sense, adding Kessel to it makes it... what's less than zero?

 

[mydnyte]

It makes no sense for them, no. Semin has a terrible contract but it's also not very long. It isn't a cap killer that is over 5 years, like Mike Richards or David Clarkson for example.

Carolina is in the midst of a rebuild and are rumoured to likely trade Eric Staal and perhaps even Jordan Staal in the short-term.

I don't really know why the price the Leafs paid for a top and blue chip young player has anything to do with the his value now or what the Canes should be willing to pay. Carolina does not need a player like Kessel either. They need goaltender and a lot of capable defenders.

So while they would love to trade Semin and get rid of him, I don't think they are going to package him with their top 5 pick to be able to get a great player in Kessel. You can ask their fans how great this would be though and I'd love to see how they respond.

The Leafs probably do this because they are actually rebuilding and getting another top 5 pick to rebuild their core would go a long way and getting Semin as a stop gap or a project would be just fine for us. His contract isn't long that it wouldn't disrupt the cap in the long run either.

As my last comment on this rumour, it makes little sense at their current state of their team and little sense in the future. It does not fix their current team either.

they cannot rebuild, as the Staal will not waive their NTC's ...like the way SJS are stuck with Thornton, and Marleau

you cannot rebuild with top 2 Centermen locked up long term, not to mention having a goalie who has a cap hit of $6.3m, and Semin at $7m

compare Semin at 31 years of age at $7mill
vs
Kessel at 27 years, at $8mill

Semin was one of the worst contracts in the league the day he signed it.

 

[pspot]

Semin, Skinner, 5th for JVR, Gardiner and 24th

that's a pretty huge deal but kind of works

Kessel instead of JVR is within .675 cap totals

 

[ToneBone03]

No way in hell I give up Nylander. Isn't the point of a rebuild to accumulate young talent? Why the hell are we trading away an 18-year-old who played professional hockey this past season & we drafted less than a year ago?

Also, JVR + 24th for Semin + 5th isn't even funny. Trading one of the best contracts in the league for what is quite possibly the worst? It doesn't matter if we're rebuilding & we have the cap space to take it on, that is terrible value. People are seriously undervaluing JVR in this instance, even if it does give us the opportunity to take Marner. I'd think about JVR straight up for 5th...possibly add a 2nd or 3rd to sweeten the pot a little.

 

[Menzinger]

Nylander is a prospect. We have no idea how Hunter views him.

Marner and Hanifin are also prospects. If Hunter values either as being better fits to the Leafs, aand we know he has mentioned these 2.

Then why wouldn't he make a deal, if indeed getting rid of Kessel is what the Leafs want to do.

Kessl isn't a cap dump... The leafs aren't going to trade one of the top ranked prospects in the NHL just to rid themselves of it. The Nylander pick was one of Shanahan's first major moves after taking over at the leafs, he's not Going to be a fan of trading him after less than a year.

Not to mention we're ignoring the fact that Nylander's stock has risen considerably since being drafted after having a superb season in the AHL/SHL. I can't think of a single realistic trade that involves him actually happening for the next few seasons. Rebuilding teams simply don't trade bluechip prospects.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

People keep missing the target, if Leafs want both Hanifin and Marner this draft. And Francis insists on Rielly or Nylander as deal breakers or deal makers of this happening. It does make sense if Hunter wants Hanifin or Marner a guy many love here I have read of late.

I do know, Rielly, Marner, and Hanifin would be great building blocks.

Francis is not dumb, he will want a young player back for #5.

 

[SprDaVE]

they cannot rebuild, as the Staal will not waive their NTC's ...like the way SJS are stuck with Thornton, and Marleau

you cannot rebuild with top 2 Centermen locked up long term, not to mention having a goalie who has a cap hit of $6.3m, and Semin at $7m

compare Semin at 31 years of age at $7mill
vs
Kessel at 27 years, at $8mill

Semin was one of the worst contracts in the league the day he signed it.

Eric Staal is only signed for one more season. I'm 100% confident that he'd waive his NTC to go to a contender this upcoming season as a rental. Cam Ward also only has 1 more season to go.

Carolina has ~40M in cap space in the off-season of 2016. That's a crap ton of flexibility. They really have zero pressing need to get rid of Semin.

I'm not saying Semin isn't dead weight. All I'm saying is that they aren't desperate to get rid of him with their #5 pick for some one like Kessel. If they are going to do something like that to try and compete ASAP, they will likely go after a younger top end asset and likely a top end defender. That's it, that's all.

 

[Leafidelity]

Im almost entirely positive Nylander isn't even being talked about.

 

[ACC1224]

Im almost entirely positive Nylander isn't even being talked about.

Of course not, someone is just looking for attention.

 

[080]

I could see Semin + 5th OA for JVR. JVR is an established NHL player who's proven that with the right players he's a 30-goal, 60-point guy. 5th OA has the potential to be that and Semin is a massive cap detriment at the moment.

We get a high pick (Barzal, Marner, Hanifin, or Strome) to kick off our rebuild; Carolina gets some help with it's financial situation and a quality young-ish player back.

 

[Commander Clueless]

You wouldn't deal Nylander to draft Marner?

Why wouldn't they just keep developing Nylander?

 

[LeafsNation149]

Why wouldn't they just keep developing Nylander?

if it was Nylander for Marner

Marner >> Nylander

 

[Smif]

The media is trying to get us worked up earlier and earlier every year.

We're the easiest targets...

 

[Budsfan]

This morning on the Dean Blundell show, Dean mentioned that he has heard a rumour that if Strome goes #3 to Arizona, that the leafs are trying to get the #5 pick off of Carolina. The deal would be #5 + Alex Semin for #24 and any roster player over the age of 23.

Which if I was Carolina I would take JVR,

That's too obscure to be a trade proposal, I doubt a team would make a deal like that and especially the Leafs, until Babcock has seen what he has.

I think a trade was proposed Kessel, Kadri and #24 pick for #5 and Semin (Semin to off set Kessel's cap hit) but even that deal doesn't seem likeley.

 

[WTFMAN99]

if it was Nylander for Marner

Marner >> Nylander

Kessel>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Semin

Whatever perceived drop off their is from Marner to Nylander is not made up by Kessel or even JVR for Semin.

 

[Commander Clueless]

if it was Nylander for Marner

Marner >> Nylander

Nylander was drafted 8th overall last year and has had a fantastic year development wise. Why would we consider moving him under any realistic circumstances, other than he wants out?

And if what you said is true, then why would Carolina consider that trade?


Makes no sense to me.

 

[pspot]

why are we talking about nylander?
it said over 23