Rumor: Leafs have inquired about C Luke Glendening

[ACC1224]

Nothing we haven't already observed, and nothing Wings fans hadn't observed and *****ed about for years. Babcock plays terrible players a lot of minutes.

So you feel Babcock will go behind Managements back and make the trade himself or are they all in love with "terrible players"?

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I was thinking both Moore's and a 3rd.

My thought was Gauthier, Marincin and a 4th. That is probably more value than both Moore's and a 3rd. Deal out D. Moore for a 4th or 5th or something like that separately.

They are not getting a 2nd out of him though. 5th may be a little bit of a lowball, but given the 4C market and his contract, it's a lot more reasonable than asking for a 2nd for an average 4C.

 

[Dog]

No to Glendening or Green. Just use Holl and Aaltonen! No need for any trades really but if was my choice would trade JVR for highest offer in the west. Prospects and picks or both. Ideally would offer JVR and 2nd for Kyrou. Need to upgrade the center prospects.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

No to Glendening or Green. Just use Holl and Aaltonen! No need for any trades really but if was my choice would trade JVR for highest offer in the west. Prospects and picks or both. Ideally would offer JVR and 2nd for Kyrou. Need to upgrade the center prospects.

Yeah Kyrou is not worth anywhere near JvR and a 2nd. Kyrou and a 2nd wouldn't even get you JvR.

Leafs can still use Aaltonen, but on the wing instead of up the middle. Or they can have him replace Bozak if Nylander at center is just not going to happen.

 

[Dog]

Yeah Kyrou is not worth anywhere near JvR and a 2nd. Kyrou and a 2nd wouldn't even get you JvR.

Leafs can still use Aaltonen, but on the wing instead of up the middle. Or they can have him replace Bozak if Nylander at center is just not going to happen.

I would jump all over Kyrou even was JVR straight up. Based on we have lack at center prospects. Also highly doubt Bozak is coming back thus Kyrou can go to Marlies and Aaoltenen on 3rd-4th line.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

No to Glendening or Green. Just use Holl and Aaltonen! No need for any trades really but if was my choice would trade JVR for highest offer in the west. Prospects and picks or both. Ideally would offer JVR and 2nd for Kyrou. Need to upgrade the center prospects.

JVR + 2nd for Kyrou?!

Just stop. A 2nd + Kyrou doesn't get JVR, for Christ's sake.

Tell me again that JVR isn't undervalued on this board with garbage like this

 

[zeke]

You want to make a trade for a real upgrade at 4C, you trade for a guy like Plekanec.

 

[TimPeel]

We don't need Detroit's garbage. For once our development system is the toast of the league, lets continue to promote from within.

 

[Kiwi]

So as usual, without the necessary information or insight on the bigger picture of an 82 game season + playoffs, you’re just bashing babcocks coaching.

Spare me the bull****, I said that I didn't know how the minutes were broken down into my post so I didn't unfairly malign Babcock so go White Knight a post where I'm actually attacking him

I don't care who the 4th line center is 16+ minutes that often is a **** ton even for an elite level 4th liner

 

[Cor]

He's one of the worst NHLers presently playing. What a terrible idea. People say he is deployed defensively, but that's changed dramatically this year -- his ZSR is 50%, and his results are still godawful. Run, run, run. He's Polak at F.

His Zone Start Ratio this year is 35%, which is the lowest among Red Wings forwards. Also, he's in no way "one of the worst NHL'ers" presently.

Like, you can not want Glendening, that's fine, but don't talk out of your ass

 

[Cor]

Who rattled your cage?

Any 4th line center played like that especially on that isn't elite should be looked at with concern

That's not bashing that's just being ******* intelligent rather than a non thinking homer

If you think about it, 16 minutes isn't crazy.

Your typical 4th line should play about 10-12 minutes of the game. Glendening was Detroit's top PK guy, so if there were games where Detroit got 3, 4 , 5 penalties, and Glendening is playing the majority of the PK minutes, there will be games he plays those minutes.

Not too mention, most of those where in the 2014-15 season, where after Pavel Datsyuk, the Wings centers were; Riley Sheahan, Joakim Andersson, Stephen Weiss, Darren Helm, and Luke Glendening. The only one who remained healthy all year? Luke Glendening.

Datsyuk only played 63 games, Andersson 68, Weiss 52, Helm 75, and Sheahan 79.

There were times even with Zetterberg was moved over, Glendening had to play top 9, and even top 6 5v5 minutes on-top of the heavy PK minutes he was trusted with.

So yes, for parts of that season, he had to play 16 minutes or more, but it isn't because Babcock overplays him, or he's a "pet", it's because they had no other options.

 

[colchar]

the advanced stats are absolutely horrid

 

[nsleaf]

You want to make a trade for a real upgrade at 4C, you trade for a guy like Plekanec.

I would do this!

 

[Kiwi]

If you think about it, 16 minutes isn't crazy.

Your typical 4th line should play about 10-12 minutes of the game. Glendening was Detroit's top PK guy, so if there were games where Detroit got 3, 4 , 5 penalties, and Glendening is playing the majority of the PK minutes, there will be games he plays those minutes.

Not too mention, most of those where in the 2014-15 season, where after Pavel Datsyuk, the Wings centers were; Riley Sheahan, Joakim Andersson, Stephen Weiss, Darren Helm, and Luke Glendening. The only one who remained healthy all year? Luke Glendening.

Datsyuk only played 63 games, Andersson 68, Weiss 52, Helm 75, and Sheahan 79.

There were times even with Zetterberg was moved over, Glendening had to play top 9, and even top 6 5v5 minutes on-top of the heavy PK minutes he was trusted with.

So yes, for parts of that season, he had to play 16 minutes or more, but it isn't because Babcock overplays him, or he's a "pet", it's because they had no other options.

He's a 4th liner Cor, he's okay but he's not exactly in the elite tier

Unless all those guys above were injured at the same time, Zetterberg wasn't a centre at all and there were about 8 PK's I'd still have trouble with Glendening playing 16+ minutes

Basically that's how much we were using Komarov earlier in the year and I think we can agree it's still hard to understand the thinking behind that usage

As I've said Cor I'm not against Glendening but I'd be cautious

 

[Cor]

He's a 4th liner Cor, he's okay but he's not exactly in the elite tier

Unless all those guys above were injured at the same time, Zetterberg wasn't a centre at all and there were about 8 PK's I'd still have trouble with Glendening playing 16+ minutes

Basically that's how much we were using Komarov earlier in the year and I think we can agree it's still hard to understand the thinking behind that usage

As I've said Cor I'm not against Glendening but I'd be cautious

I'm not arguing against him being a 4th line player. I want him for exactly that. He's a solution for our 4C spot, and if Lou can get him for a reasonable return, it saves us from needing to spend a 2nd round pick or more on a rental center like other contenders do.

All I did was just explain why Babcock used Glendening so much, and it was because they were hit hard with injuries.

That is the context to it.

If you'd rather believe Babcock is going to start playing the 4th line like crazy just because he has a 4th C he likes, as Mirtle is trying to spin those numbers as, feel free, however, it's unlikely going to happen.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Spare me the bull****, I said that I didn't know how the minutes were broken down into my post so I didn't unfairly malign Babcock so go White Knight a post where I'm actually attacking him

I don't care who the 4th line center is 16+ minutes that often is a **** ton even for an elite level 4th liner

Not if they’re a reliable defensive 4th line center and your team has the lead the majority of the game, and you have a couple penalties to kill.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

I'm not arguing against him being a 4th line player. I want him for exactly that. He's a solution for our 4C spot, and if Lou can get him for a reasonable return, it saves us from needing to spend a 2nd round pick or more on a rental center like other contenders do.

All I did was just explain why Babcock used Glendening so much, and it was because they were hit hard with injuries.

That is the context to it.

If you'd rather believe Babcock is going to start playing the 4th line like crazy just because he has a 4th C he likes, as Mirtle is trying to spin those numbers as, feel free, however, it's unlikely going to happen.

Come on man, just let Kiwi have his fun

 

[Kiwi]

Not if they’re a reliable defensive 4th line center and your team has the lead the majority of the game, and you have a couple penalties to kill.

He's not elite defensively he ok and the bulk of those minutes should go to the top 6 guys wheather your ahead or not and as a PK player he should get 1 minute a kill ideally

I wouldn't condone Boyle playing that much and I'd consider him elite

I'm not arguing against him being a 4th line player. I want him for exactly that. He's a solution for our 4C spot, and if Lou can get him for a reasonable return, it saves us from needing to spend a 2nd round pick or more on a rental center like other contenders do.

All I did was just explain why Babcock used Glendening so much, and it was because they were hit hard with injuries.

That is the context to it.

If you'd rather believe Babcock is going to start playing the 4th line like crazy just because he has a 4th C he likes, as Mirtle is trying to spin those numbers as, feel free, however, it's unlikely going to happen.

Babcock has shown during this season that he has a penchant for overplaying guys that he likes (Komarov and Polak) and if you get Glendening your at risk of that again, our top players don't play a lot compared to the league now so what's going to happen when he gets a 4th line center he really likes?

I'm not denying Mirtle has an ax to grind but this is definitely a buyer beware situation and your using the same argument people used in the Polak resigning and we know how that's turning out

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

He's not elite defensively he ok and the bulk of those minutes should go to the top 6 guys wheather your ahead or not and as a PK player he should get 1 minute a kill ideally

I wouldn't condone Boyle playing that much and I'd consider him elite.

Don’t really care what you would do to be quite honest, given your blind hate of babcocks personnel decisions. Blind? Yes, as you just questioned his usage of Glendening while admittedly not having any information about what that context was. Not only that, you’re arguing how good he is as a defensive centre in his current state, but hey I’m sure you were following him real closely in 2004-2005 too to back this up.

 

[BlueForever75]

I wouldn't help out Montreal at all. Plekanec would be a good add but not for the price Montreal would be asking us to pay. Remember we don't help one another since Gord Stellick left the Leafs as GM!!!

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Babcock has shown during this season

He has shown that the he can guide the team to get better year after year while giving our young promising AHLers opportunities to come in at a time and situation where they will be successful (see: Detroit) as opposed to throw them into the wolves to flounder and lose confidence (see: Edmonton, Luke Schenn, Kadris first couple seasons).

 

[ACC1224]

I'm certainly no expert like some others but to me all Babcock has shown is his ability to get a Team to overachieve.
30th > Playoffs > comfortably in Playoffs

I don't know how anyone could expect better results at this point.

 

[Kiwi]

Don’t really care what you would do to be quite honest, given your blind hate of babcocks personnel decisions. Blind? Yes, as you just questioned his usage of Glendening while admittedly not having any information about what that context was. Not only that, you’re arguing how good he is as a defensive centre in his current state, but hey I’m sure you were following him real closely in 2004-2005 too to back this up.

I said before careful with who you acquire for this coach which isn't unreasonable when you look at personnel and player usage this year and throughout his career

But sure we can go your route and turn off our brains and hail our all knowing coaching overlord where everything is part of the plan, like Komarov on the second line playing 24 minutes and Polak suiting up most nights even though he sucks

 

[htpwn]

I feel like Glendening's contract is getting glossed over in this thread: He's signed at $1.8 million until 2021. That is a ridiculous amount of term and to those who think, well, we'll just dump him in two years... if there is any decline in his game at all, we may not be able to. Look no further than Lou's inability to move Eric Fehr this year, who coincidentially, is at the same age Glendening will be in the last year of his deal. That's the problem with players like those two and the reason you don't give term to 4th liners: They don't have to fall far before they are no longer useful NHL players. Not to mention... we have a major cap crunch coming in 2020. Having $4.3 million tied up in a 4C (Glendening) and 4LW (Martin) is atrocious cap management in a year when both Marner and Matthews are coming off their ELCs.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Learn from the Martin contract