News Article: Kris Draper, has been promoted to the Red Wings’ director of Amateur Scouting.

[Henkka]

“Hakan picks” lol they’re all Draper picks wtf

NO they aren't.

Håkan gives the info and Draper will put a stamp. He will listen his smartest scout, for sure, to do a decision.

 

[Frk It]

It was reach for a big organizational need. So that will put some pressure for the "we always draft BPA" -talkers.

What does this mean?

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Yeah, I would have opted for Wallstedt personally, and have said as much. But Cossa was not a reach and was well liked in his own right.

One interesting thing I heard (I believe on The Athletic Hockey podcast) was teams had concerns with Wallstedt down the stretch, not only with his play, but with his playing weight and conditioning.

I wonder if that factored into our decision?

Pronman (blech) alluded to that in The Athletic podcast recently. Wallstedt does not appear to be a beanpole of a goalie at 6'3". The concern was how he closed out the season (dropping from a pretty consistent 0.918 save percentage for most of the season to 0.908 and a less than sterling performance in the playoffs, even though I can't credit him for his team's loss.)

 

[Bench]

One interesting thing I heard (I believe on The Athletic Hockey podcast) was teams had concerns with Wallstedt down the stretch, not only with his play, but with his playing weight and conditioning.

I wonder if that factored into our decision?

Ah, a young Kari Lehtonen.

 

[Frk It]

Pronman (blech) alluded to that in The Athletic podcast recently. Wallstedt does not appear to be a beanpole of a goalie at 6'3". The concern was how he closed out the season (dropping from a pretty consistent 0.918 save percentage for most of the season to 0.908 and a less than sterling performance in the playoffs, even though I can't credit him for his team's loss.)

Yeah, he said his weight was at 215-220, and that he is not the most Uber-athletic guy as is, so there were some possible concerns about him maintaining an ideal weight.

Not sure I had heard that anywhere else, but does seem like that may have contributed to him sliding to 20.

Seems like something not that hard to correct to me, but what do I know.

 

[Ricelund]

NO they aren't.

Håkan gives the info and Draper will put a stamp. He will listen his smartest scout, for sure, to do a decision.

How could you possibly know their process?

Also, does Draper's scouting ability not apply to European players?

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Yeah, he said his weight was at 215-220, and that he is not the most Uber-athletic guy as is, so there were some possible concerns about him maintaining an ideal weight.

Not sure I had heard that anywhere else, but does seem like that may have contributed to him sliding to 20.

Seems like something not that hard to correct to me, but what do I know.

I don't get the Wallstedt athleticism concerns. 215-220 is big for a goalie but the guy is 6'3". And when I watched him I never had any concerns about his mobility. The dude is incredibly fast going side to side, but his technique being so advanced makes it so he doesn't have to rely on his athleticism as much.

 

[Revenge of Gru]

Big reach?

2021 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #15 by FCHockey
2021 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #15 by TSN/Craig Button
2021 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #19 by McKeen's Hockey
2021 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #15 by TSN/McKenzie
2021 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #1 by NHL Central Scouting

Ranked #7 in The Black Book

Huge reach. He's a goalie. We not only burned a 1st for a 4-5 year project but we traded up and burned a 15th OA. We picked Cossa higher than Vasilevski went and we burned picks to do it. If Cossa is anything but a perennial vezina winner this will set the rebuild back years.

 

[Frk It]

Huge reach. He's a goalie. We not only burned a 1st for a 4-5 year project but we traded up and burned a 15th OA. We picked Cossa higher than Vasilevski went and we burned picks to do it. If Cossa is anything but a perennial vezina winner this will set the rebuild back years.

We traded up to take a guy exactly where he was ranked.

That would actually in fact, by definition, not be a reach.

 

[Revenge of Gru]

We traded up to take a guy exactly where he was ranked.

That would actually in fact, by definition, not be a reach.

He's a goalie. Any goalie at 15th is a massive reach. This franchise is not in position to squander 15th overall picks on low percentage, long term projects. This was a dumb move and a massive reach. Goalies are voodoo. Vasilevski could play great for another 10 years or he could lose his mojo and fall back to earth next year. Gambling the kind of assets we gambled on Cossa at this point in the rebuild was inexcusable. You will most likely understand that when he's a bust.

 

[better Red than Dead]

He's a goalie. Any goalie at 15th is a massive reach. This franchise is not in position to squander 15th overall picks on low percentage, long term projects. This was a dumb move and a massive reach. Goalies are voodoo. Vasilevski could play great for another 10 years or he could lose his mojo and fall back to earth next year. Gambling the kind of assets we gambled on Cossa at this point in the rebuild was inexcusable. You will most likely understand that when he's a bust.

Spencer Knight sends his love

 

[better Red than Dead]

NO they aren't.

Håkan gives the info and Draper will put a stamp. He will listen his smartest scout, for sure, to do a decision.

Draper utilizes personal interviews to really round out his draft picks. So even if Hakan likes a guy, if he interviews poorly or doesn’t have interpersonal skills, he probably gets passed up. So in the end it’s Draper’s final picks. I don’t know how other teams value interviews, but the Wings really put a premium in it. That is why Cossa was ranked higher than Wallstadt, Cossa nailed his meeting with the Wings. Also, that’s how the Wings decided to take Seider at 6, he nailed his interview.

 

[Revenge of Gru]

Spencer Knight sends his love

Oh good we're betting against decades of history on a fluke with 4 NHL games.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

NO they aren't.

Håkan gives the info and Draper will put a stamp. He will listen his smartest scout, for sure, to do a decision.

Henkka, do you honestly think there is no cross-over scouting within this organization? Do you honestly think Hakan is the only Wings scout attending the international U18 tournaments during the year?

 

[MBH]

Goalies are voodoo.

This is the kind of comment that come years of upvotes on reddit.

 

[ArmChairGM89]

NO they aren't.

Håkan gives the info and Draper will put a stamp. He will listen his smartest scout, for sure, to do a decision.

Sir Hakan is giving Draper all the info he can on euro players. Possibly Even a list of euro players in an order that he prefers them. Draper is taking that information and compiling it into an overall world scouting “list” and reordering Hakan information the way he sees it though probably taking Hakans word into great account and then fitting those players into a list of hundreds of others in the order HE sees fit. Then Draper makes THE PICK. With some information Hakan likely has no idea about. They are all Draper picks.

 

[wingsnut19]

It is only a reach if you are wrong. If Cossa turns out better than Wallstedt we didn't reach at all, we were simply right. The point of the draft is to pick the best possible players, not to maximize pick value vis-a-vis some consensus list of half-Pejorative Slured public scouts.

A consensus would consider it a reach, at the time. Calling it a reach is not saying that the pick was a bad one, just that it differs from popular opinion. Obviously the organization doesn't see it as a reach or they wouldn't have made the pick. If he turns out to be better than Wallstedt, then we can say that the decision was justified and that our team did a better job scouting the player.

I want to be clear, I have no preference between the two players. I've watched a total of maybe 10 minutes gameplay from the two of them combined.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

A consensus would consider it a reach, at the time. Calling it a reach is not saying that the pick was a bad one, just that it differs from popular opinion. Obviously the organization doesn't see it as a reach or they wouldn't have made the pick. If he turns out to be better than Wallstedt, then we can say that the decision was justified and that our team did a better job scouting the player.

I want to be clear, I have no preference between the two players. I've watched a total of maybe 10 minutes gameplay from the two of them combined.

By that metric reaching just isn't very relevant if you can be both a reach and the correct pick. Again, the point is to pick the best possible player regardless of popular opinion. You could follow the public scouts like a Buffalo running off of a cliff and never reach on any pick, but walk away with a god awful draft class with zero NHL players because the public pollsters were objectively wrong in their opinions. You wouldn't be reaching, but you would suck at your job.

Again, I don't care about reaching, I care about making the right pick.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

How would any of us know the Wings' scouting process? Are there insiders among us?

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I’m gonna do some reading up on the new guys, but this looks very encouraging considering how good Nashville and St. Louis has drafted as of late.

We drafted Jesse Wallin aways back, So we should know his qualities.

 

[Killerjas]

You can hate Kris Draper for his NA picks, but that is not fair. I am more sceptical of the NA scouts, in particular their USHL scouting. Mazur, Stange, Aucoin, Draper (Fair enough thats Canadian high school) are all questionable.

I give them props for Bradley which is a great find,

 

[Frk It]

You can hate Kris Draper for his NA picks, but that is not fair. I am more sceptical of the NA scouts, in particular their USHL scouting. Mazur, Stange, Aucoin, Draper (Fair enough thats Canadian high school) are all questionable.

I give them props for Bradley which is a great find,

That could prove to be true/fair.

That said, I thought Buium looked really strong at the Summer Showcase. And I actually though Mazur looked solid there too. But we will have to see what they do against NCAA players.

I wonder if the guys who scouted Mastrosimone/Phillips are still the same scouts we have scouting USHL now?

 

[Killerjas]

That could prove to be true/fair.

That said, I thought Buium looked really strong at the Summer Showcase. And I actually though Mazur looked solid there too. But we will have to see what they do against NCAA players.

I wonder if the guys who scouted Mastrosimone/Phillips are still the same scouts we have scouting USHL now?

Buium was a bit of reach, but what I read is decent:
"There's a solid raw package to work around that revolves around his skill level. His weight shifts with the puck are deceptive and can drive offensive play effectively, albeit infrequently. He's a work in progress, he's a reasonable bet in the 2nd/3rd round or so, but I feel as though a team will make the bet much earlier than that. Good raw fundamentals for a guy his size and a curious to bet on. Big. Uses his body well. Good hockey IQ. Defensive game hit and miss. Raw speed generation in a straight line is not the greatest. Is patient with the puck. Safe, dependable bottom pair defender. Rangy. Solid deception and skill combination. Offensive game, even with low pace is good.

Mazur I am not a big fan of. Overager with only 1 decent USHL season. He falls in the Sam Stange category. Also an overager, also someone I am not a fan of.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

Buium was a bit of reach, but what I read is decent:
"There's a solid raw package to work around that revolves around his skill level. His weight shifts with the puck are deceptive and can drive offensive play effectively, albeit infrequently. He's a work in progress, he's a reasonable bet in the 2nd/3rd round or so, but I feel as though a team will make the bet much earlier than that. Good raw fundamentals for a guy his size and a curious to bet on. Big. Uses his body well. Good hockey IQ. Defensive game hit and miss. Raw speed generation in a straight line is not the greatest. Is patient with the puck. Safe, dependable bottom pair defender. Rangy. Solid deception and skill combination. Offensive game, even with low pace is good.

Mazur I am not a big fan of. Overager with only 1 decent USHL season. He falls in the Sam Stange category. Also an overager, also someone I am not a fan of.

So you haven't actually watched them play?

 

[Revenge of Gru]

By that metric reaching just isn't very relevant if you can be both a reach and the correct pick. Again, the point is to pick the best possible player regardless of popular opinion. You could follow the public scouts like a Buffalo running off of a cliff and never reach on any pick, but walk away with a god awful draft class with zero NHL players because the public pollsters were objectively wrong in their opinions. You wouldn't be reaching, but you would suck at your job.

Again, I don't care about reaching, I care about making the right pick.

I would argue that a goalie at 15 when you don't even have a core to build around is always a bad decision. This pick will never be the right one regardless of how good he turns out to be because it is poor risk management relative to the foundation of your team. It is very likely to be an utter waste of a pretty high pick given the history of goalies picked high in the draft.