Pretty much every Oiler fan was excited about those offer sheets and had Lowe's back due to him taking us to the finals the year before. If he was a "Tier 1 dbag" for defending his actions (which were within the rules) against the public slandering of his reputation then most of us are dbags. You don't like Lowe or his personality? That's cool, but you picked a poor example.
If season ticket holders honestly think they are forced to buy tickets to save the team, then they have ego issues and a huge sense of entitlement.
Ahhh, time for a look back at not-so-recent history.
1995-96 was a brutal season for the Oilers, and Edmonton overall, in many respects. The price of oil was under $20 a barrel. A far different job market than we know today. The complete opposite of a boom. Houses that are selling for half a million today could be had for $100k. The Canadian dollar was worth about 70 cents US.
After a lockout the previous season fans weren't eager to pay to see a terrible Oilers team - they would finish with 68 points. Kelly Buchberger was the captain?! The season ticket base had fallen to 6,200. They would average under 12,500 fans a night.
The Nordiques had already relocated. The Jets were in the midst of moving and Hartford was a season away from relocating. It looked like the Oilers would go the way of the other WHA teams.
The Oilers were placed into receivership. Cal Nichols (future head of the Edmonton Investors Group) lead a season ticket drive to keep the team in town. He appealed to fans to help save the team because it was a very real possibility the team would move if the dismal attendance continued. No one would invest in keeping the team in Edmonton (or loan money for a purchase of the team) with such dismal attendance figures.
The ticket drive was hugely successful. Yet, the team still almost moved. A sale had been arranged to relocate the team to Houston.
ATB had taken the team over from Peter Pocklington as part of bankruptcy proceedings. They received a $120 Million offer to move the team to Houston from the owner of the Rockets. ATB agreed to sell the team to the EIG for $100 Million. Nichols had arranged for loans of $40 Million so needed $60 Million in cash to keep the team in town. At the time of the Houston offer the EIG had $50 Million in cash.
Getting that last $50 Million in a weak economy was tough. Probably wouldn't have happened if a lot of fans who bought tickets as a means of helping save the team simply stayed at home and watched on tv.
It wasn't a matter of ego or entitlement. It was the reality of the situation.
Hey, I'll admit it, I let myself get carried away with the brilliant Pronger trade and the flukey SCF. I was happier back then and I believed in Lowe mostly because of the flood of the emotions. Looking back and listening to Burke talk ever so rationally and realistically about Lowe and then listening to Lowe's arrogant crybaby retort, I have to say that I was so very wrong about the man and that my filthy homer goggles blinded me from admitting it. Lowe is the same guy, same attitude, same everything. The one that Burke so perfectly and prophetically described.
I wasn't a fan of the offer sheets but whatever, I'm not signing Lowe's paycheques. I thought they were extremely risky but totally within the rules. Lowe was/still is a desperate man and he had to resort to that. When it comes down to doing that to get good players it shows someone is running out of ideas and is desperate.
At this point I don't care any more and I just watch this team in the hopes that one day someone will take the management job more seriously and get rid of the old boys club. I really like the potential of the team in spite of all the self inflicted setbacks but as others have said, it wears on you and you start watching other teams to see real hockey. It's a circus here. It's true, the place has gone nuts.
I hear you. I must admit I always liked Lowe's ambition to make impact trades but his arrogance and track record are very off putting as a fan. Lowe is basically Paul Holmgren lite IMO. The difference is that Holmgren had the market to match his ambitions.
But... I did think he handled the whole Burke thing very well. Burke was slandering him in the media for a long time before Lowe actually responded. A response was totally warranted in the form of the clip you referenced.
Burke had no right to constantly slander Lowe. Lowe had every right to attack Burke. Did Burke tell you to say that? Getting fed up of the Lowe bashing Since June 2000.Except Lowe embarrassed himself in his rebuttal. It sounds like someone was lucky enough to get Lowe on the phone during one of his tantrums. Lowe stupidly and angrily ranted, and his words are even more stupid looking back on it today. Vancouver left in shambles? They almost won a Cup, something that Lowe brags about doing to this day. Burke had JUST won a Cup. Lowe goes on to leave the Oilers in shambles, obliterating several guys reputations in the process (Tambellini, Krueger, etc).
You look at him a few months ago angrily defending his decision to hire MacT as GM and you see he's still the same guy. An absolute idiot who doesn't respect his fans, is still living in the glory days and is sitting pretty while guys like Quinn, Renney, Tambellini, Krueger and now Eakins try to fix this mess of an organization. Yet somehow Lowe gets to stay...
I don't quite understand why you like Lowe's ambition. Lowe's ambition reminds me of a little kid who's just trying to help out, but unwittingly making everything much worse in the process.
I just want some actual professionals who can perform their job well. When will the embarrassment wear off?
Feels good posting this.
Except Lowe embarrassed himself in his rebuttal. It sounds like someone was lucky enough to get Lowe on the phone during one of his tantrums. Lowe stupidly and angrily ranted, and his words are even more stupid looking back on it today. Vancouver left in shambles? They almost won a Cup, something that Lowe brags about doing to this day. Burke had JUST won a Cup. Lowe goes on to leave the Oilers in shambles, obliterating several guys reputations in the process (Tambellini, Krueger, etc).
You look at him a few months ago angrily defending his decision to hire MacT as GM and you see he's still the same guy. An absolute idiot who doesn't respect his fans, is still living in the glory days and is sitting pretty while guys like Quinn, Renney, Tambellini, Krueger and now Eakins try to fix this mess of an organization. Yet somehow Lowe gets to stay...
I don't quite understand why you like Lowe's ambition. Lowe's ambition reminds me of a little kid who's just trying to help out, but unwittingly making everything much worse in the process.
I just want some actual professionals who can perform their job well. When will the embarrassment wear off?
Feels good posting this.
Except Lowe embarrassed himself in his rebuttal. It sounds like someone was lucky enough to get Lowe on the phone during one of his tantrums. Lowe stupidly and angrily ranted, and his words are even more stupid looking back on it today. Vancouver left in shambles? They almost won a Cup, something that Lowe brags about doing to this day. Burke had JUST won a Cup. Lowe goes on to leave the Oilers in shambles, obliterating several guys reputations in the process (Tambellini, Krueger, etc).
You look at him a few months ago angrily defending his decision to hire MacT as GM and you see he's still the same guy. An absolute idiot who doesn't respect his fans, is still living in the glory days and is sitting pretty while guys like Quinn, Renney, Tambellini, Krueger and now Eakins try to fix this mess of an organization. Yet somehow Lowe gets to stay...
I don't quite understand why you like Lowe's ambition. Lowe's ambition reminds me of a little kid who's just trying to help out, but unwittingly making everything much worse in the process.
I just want some actual professionals who can perform their job well. When will the embarrassment wear off?
Feels good posting this.
Funny looking back on the whole Burke-Lowe thing..
His two comments at the end of that video are just hilarious.
1. "Here's a fact, he left Dave Nonis nothing in Vancouver. Nothing! He destroyed that team." Hmm, fast forward 2 years after the interview and Lowe does the same to Tambellini.
2. Calls out Burke for the Ryan draft pick.. yea, good call there Lowe.
The guy is embarrassing to our organization and the fans. I can't believe he is still here. He's got to be one of the most arrogant people in the league.
I dont understand the bolded.. He gave those guys an opportunity that nobody else was willing to. How is that obliterating their reputations?
Did he force them to sign contracts at gunpoint?
This is a breath of fresh air from the revisionist history of the first four pages.Yes he is a hothead who speaks before thinking and the inteview was not well thought out. My point is "dirt with dirt" was warranted there and he waited a long time before responding to Burke's trademark bully behaviour. I have always disliked bullies and have a much shorter response time than Lowe, in that instance, so I think it was admiral that he tried to let time take care of the problem. Problem was Burke wouldn't let up and the rest is history.
This is a breath of fresh air from the revisionist history of the first four pages.
The fact is, Lowe was only really in charge of this team between when Sather left and when Katz bought the team. The results over that time may not have been the prettiest, but as you say, at least he tried to make moves to keep the team competitive. And he did very nearly deliver a SC in 2006 based almost entirely on his shrewd moves (ie. no tanking to win).
His worst moves came post 2006. Overpaying Pisani and Horcoff. Putting too much faith in guys like Moreau. Trading away all the centers.
This thread is ill-conceived because it blames the wrong person. Nothing in Lowe's on or office resume can convince me that it was his idea to tank for picks. That was Katz's baby ... a plan hatched in tandem with his scheme to roll out a new arena just about the time all his draft picks are hitting their stride. I gotta give him credit too ... looks like he's right on schedule.
Tamby is the fall guy and Lowe is the face of history. Katz is/was just using them both to further his end of a bigger bottom line.
People blaming Lowe now ... in 2013 with Tamby fired, MacT at the helm and Katz still calling the shots ... well, that's just sad. And it reeks of a personal agenda against a guy who has done a lot for this city.
No he didn't force anyone to sign contracts, but how many of those guys were terminated earlier than they expected? We know Quinn intended to coach for a couple years before Renney took over. Nobody has really got a chance to succeed, they're here for one season and then they're fired. Tambellini was the only guy that really had a chance to stick around, but he was just there as a placeholder anyway.
Renney, Quinn, Krueger were all saying the same thing, it's a long process to build the team up. Lowe is reactionary, he's not a man that thinks things out very far. Just hiring and firing left and right when he should really just step down and allow someone more capable to take his role.
My question is why hate him so much? Its not warranted. Not even close.So why do you think so many people have an agenda against him? We're not talking one guy who has some vendetta against Lowe from something between them years ago. We don't know him personally at all; we only know him from his public profile on the Oilers and hate him according to what we see there.
Ahhh, time for a look back at not-so-recent history.
1995-96 was a brutal season for the Oilers, and Edmonton overall, in many respects. The price of oil was under $20 a barrel. A far different job market than we know today. The complete opposite of a boom. Houses that are selling for half a million today could be had for $100k. The Canadian dollar was worth about 70 cents US.
After a lockout the previous season fans weren't eager to pay to see a terrible Oilers team - they would finish with 68 points. Kelly Buchberger was the captain?! The season ticket base had fallen to 6,200. They would average under 12,500 fans a night.
The Nordiques had already relocated. The Jets were in the midst of moving and Hartford was a season away from relocating. It looked like the Oilers would go the way of the other WHA teams.
The Oilers were placed into receivership. Cal Nichols (future head of the Edmonton Investors Group) lead a season ticket drive to keep the team in town. He appealed to fans to help save the team because it was a very real possibility the team would move if the dismal attendance continued. No one would invest in keeping the team in Edmonton (or loan money for a purchase of the team) with such dismal attendance figures.
The ticket drive was hugely successful. Yet, the team still almost moved. A sale had been arranged to relocate the team to Houston.
ATB had taken the team over from Peter Pocklington as part of bankruptcy proceedings. They received a $120 Million offer to move the team to Houston from the owner of the Rockets. ATB agreed to sell the team to the EIG for $100 Million. Nichols had arranged for loans of $40 Million so needed $60 Million in cash to keep the team in town. At the time of the Houston offer the EIG had $50 Million in cash.
Getting that last $50 Million in a weak economy was tough. Probably wouldn't have happened if a lot of fans who bought tickets as a means of helping save the team simply stayed at home and watched on tv.
It wasn't a matter of ego or entitlement. It was the reality of the situation.
I have no idea why each person renews their season tickets every year and neither do you. What I did state though was fact. There was a revolt against Pocklington's ownership in the early nineties and attendance dropped down to 6500 people. That led to him threatening to move the team for financial reasons. It was around that time the league brought in the sustainability fund to help support small market teams. The catch was you needed a minimum of 12,000 season tickets sold as well as all rink board advertising and luxury boxes to qualify for it. Support for the Oilers was so poor at that time that it took a private citizen to step up (Cal Nichols) and put together a group called the Copper Jackets who went on a massive season ticket drive to fill the arena. Edmontonions were asked to separate the owner from the team because the only way to keep this team here was to support it. If you punish the owner you lose the team. Cut off your nose to spite your face.Do you honestly think that's why season ticket holders continue to renew each year? Fear that if they don't, the team will move? Like they're doing some grand duty to keep the team here?
No they're doing it because they either enjoy going to the games, they sell the tickets and make money, or they use the tickets for corporate purposes.
Have you gone to any games in the past few years? Did you go to solely to ensure the team stays in Edmonton?
Great post. I didn't see this before I posted mine. It infuriates me how people who don't understand RECENT history of this team can criticize Oiler fans for still supporting the team.Ahhh, time for a look back at not-so-recent history.
1995-96 was a brutal season for the Oilers, and Edmonton overall, in many respects. The price of oil was under $20 a barrel. A far different job market than we know today. The complete opposite of a boom. Houses that are selling for half a million today could be had for $100k. The Canadian dollar was worth about 70 cents US.
After a lockout the previous season fans weren't eager to pay to see a terrible Oilers team - they would finish with 68 points. Kelly Buchberger was the captain?! The season ticket base had fallen to 6,200. They would average under 12,500 fans a night.
The Nordiques had already relocated. The Jets were in the midst of moving and Hartford was a season away from relocating. It looked like the Oilers would go the way of the other WHA teams.
The Oilers were placed into receivership. Cal Nichols (future head of the Edmonton Investors Group) lead a season ticket drive to keep the team in town. He appealed to fans to help save the team because it was a very real possibility the team would move if the dismal attendance continued. No one would invest in keeping the team in Edmonton (or loan money for a purchase of the team) with such dismal attendance figures.
The ticket drive was hugely successful. Yet, the team still almost moved. A sale had been arranged to relocate the team to Houston.
ATB had taken the team over from Peter Pocklington as part of bankruptcy proceedings. They received a $120 Million offer to move the team to Houston from the owner of the Rockets. ATB agreed to sell the team to the EIG for $100 Million. Nichols had arranged for loans of $40 Million so needed $60 Million in cash to keep the team in town. At the time of the Houston offer the EIG had $50 Million in cash.
Getting that last $50 Million in a weak economy was tough. Probably wouldn't have happened if a lot of fans who bought tickets as a means of helping save the team simply stayed at home and watched on tv.
It wasn't a matter of ego or entitlement. It was the reality of the situation.
So Lowe gets a free pass? No accountability for past and present failings? President-For-Life designation stands?
That's not what is being said. Point is to be fair in criticism.
My question is why hate him so much? Its not warranted. Not even close.
I think people forget that Lowe was only a GM for eight years. His tenure finished in 2008. New ownership took over and installed their stooge who could be counted on to follow the playbook. How anything that happened after 2008 could be mostly blamed on Lowe is just some logic that I don't follow - particularly when anyone can see that the team went from one that scrabbled hard for every point and hung around in the standings most seasons under Lowe and the EIG .... to a team that nearly set NHL records for sucking under Katz and Tamby. Yet Lowe is the bad guy here? Sounds to me like he's a convenient scapegoat for a lot of pent up fanbase rage created by stuff that mostly happened after 2008. And that would be stuff that mostly falls on Tamby and Katz.
As for his list of failings that is pointed to so often, its actually not that long.
- Comrie. Fair enough he ****ed that up. But I think people need to remember that this was a GM who was only two years removed from his playing career. He was inexperienced and he botched the deal. It happens. Fences were mended.
- Burke. I think Issak16 said it well. Lowe shot off his mouth, but it was something that had to be done at the time. Didn't need to badmouth the player though.
-Smyth. Lowe stood on his convictions with Smyth (probably having learned something from how Horc's deal came back to bite him) and ended up not being able to attend the ceremony for Messier for fear of being booed out of the building. Anyone here think he made the wrong call?
- Horcoff. This is the one I hold against Lowe the most. Unforgivably bad deal. He panicked and totally misread the player and the market.
So yeah, the guy has made mistakes. And yeah he shoots off his mouth sometimes when he should be more professional. But to have fans come on this Oiler site and call him a disease? To actually be a fan of the Oilers and go out of your way to mock the man for having won five SC in Edmonton (must not have been watching when he played the entire 88 playoffs with a broken wrist and broken ribs)?
I dunno ... just seems like a lot of misplaced anger to me.