Confirmed with Link: Jonathan Dahlen to San Jose for Linus Karlsson (87th overall 2018)

[ChilliBilly]

Kina regret the Burrows Dahlen trade now, I guess Dummy Dorion got the best of Benning on that one. Dahlen sounds like a sissy, hopefully this New Karlsson guy suprises

Kind of unfair. We don’t know the whole story. Personally I wish him good luck.

It’s not like Utica hasn’t had lots of disappointments this year.

 

[MikeK]

True, we don't know the whole story, but come on. He absolutely appears to be a player with issues between the ears. Glad we were able to rid ourselves of him. I never have and never will have any interest in prima donnas.

 

[M2Beezy]

Kind of unfair. We don’t know the whole story. Personally I wish him good luck.

It’s not like Utica hasn’t had lots of disappointments this year.

Still sounds whiny and sissy. I was hard on him on twitter too but wasnt part of the hateful messages or whatever he complained about. But whats he expect after abandoning the team that spent TWO full years developing his sorry arse

 

[Hemty]

Kind of unfair. We don’t know the whole story. Personally I wish him good luck.

It’s not like Utica hasn’t had lots of disappointments this year.

And this is my biggest pet peeve, as to, why i don't get all the hate spewed around here towards Dahlen. Gadjovich, Lind, Palmu all have disappointed in Utica, development wise, and the latter bolted, after he didn't get the playing time, to Europe (and is having quite a nice season there).
First when i heard this whole debacle taking place, i thought to myself, that this is sort of like Green treating Goldobin at the NHL level, you know, play the "right way" (whatever way this organization thinks that is ) or you're not playing at all. But then, knowing what what was going on with with the aforementioned Gadjovich, Lind, and why Palmu bolted, i came to the conclusion, that this whole situation speaks more to the developmental side of this organization, as it pertains to pure prospects, rather than anything else.
But as Billy pointed out, we don't know the whole story, so spewing hate and harassing the guy is just out of bounds on so many different levels.

 

[Josepho]

Still sounds whiny and sissy. I was hard on him on twitter too but wasnt part of the hateful messages or whatever he complained about. But whats he expect after abandoning the team that spent TWO full years developing his sorry arse

what did you say to the man

 

[Cupless44]

I wonder how Elias feels that his great friend was shipped out of here. He isnt willing to talk about it which gives some indication.

A lot of highly drafted prospects don't seem to be developing in Utica. I am wondering what was the rush? He was Canuck controlled for a while yet. In yet another season of playing out the string for this team why not bring him up for 2 games on Pettersson's wing before you jettison the guy?

 

[shottasasa]

It’s not clear he abandoned the team. From all that has come out it seems to me he was unhappy with the situation in Utica, believing the way he was being handled was counter-productive for his style of hockey and development. This was related thru his agent to the club and clearly there were some philosophical differences and Benning took the decision to trade him as this was one of the solutions discussed with the agent.

Frankly I don’t think either side of this comes out looking good.

Utica looks to be struggling to develop offensive and creative type players. It becomes a trend when multiple players who had thrived previously to coming to Utica, including in men’s leagues, and are all disappointing. At some point you can’t just point to bad drafting if it continues. It seems they emphasise responsibility over creativity which works for developing some players, mostly bottom 6 types or grinders, but is not so conducive to developing more creative players who are going to be more high event, at least initially. The Canucks desperately need to develop some offensive players through Utica. And in my mind McEwan projects as more of a bottom 6 player who’ll get points through speed and energy than creativity in the NHL.

While Dahlen doesn’t seem like he ever bought in to the development plan they had for him and didn’t have the right mindset. While I understand players are now a lot more involved in knowledgeable and involved in their development, if they don’t buy in to their coaching they’ll not do well wherever they go. I wish Dahlen well in the future. I will say that from development point of view that he couldn’t have landed in a better franchise, I t’s amazing the amount of mid and late round picks San Jose have turned into contributing and even impact NHLers.

 

[Hemty]

It’s not clear he abandoned the team. From all that has come out it seems to me he was unhappy with the situation in Utica, believing the way he was being handled was counter-productive for his style of hockey and development. This was related thru his agent to the club and clearly there were some philosophical differences and Benning took the decision to trade him as this was one of the solutions discussed with the agent.

Frankly I don’t think either side of this comes out looking good.

Utica looks to be struggling to develop offensive and creative type players. It becomes a trend when multiple players who had thrived previously to coming to Utica, including in men’s leagues, and are all disappointing. At some point you can’t just point to bad drafting if it continues. It seems they emphasise responsibility over creativity which works for developing some players, mostly bottom 6 types or grinders, but is not so conducive to developing more creative players who are going to be more high event, at least initially. The Canucks desperately need to develop some offensive players through Utica. And in my mind McEwan projects as more of a bottom 6 player who’ll get points through speed and energy than creativity in the NHL.

While Dahlen doesn’t seem like he ever bought in to the development plan they had for him and didn’t have the right mindset. While I understand players are now a lot more involved in knowledgeable and involved in their development, if they don’t buy in to their coaching they’ll not do well wherever they go. I wish Dahlen well in the future. I will say that from development point of view that he couldn’t have landed in a better franchise, I t’s amazing the amount of mid and late round picks San Jose have turned into contributing and even impact NHLers.

Well, at least they are consistent with preaching the "200-foot-game"

 

[me2]

After reading this board, especially the last 5 years, I have come to believe we have some of the worst fans in the league. I would not put anything past the crazed portion of our fanbase.

Our fans are no better or worse than any other teams fans. Fanbases arguing over who is the who is the better/worst fanbase is likely a troupe of chimpanzees arguing over who looks more like a dolphin.

 

[carrotshirt]

Yep. This narrative that Dahlen was afraid of making mistakes and getting benched is contradicted by the evidence that Cull consistently gave him prime ice time. This combined with him not being able to handle some criticism over twitter and Instagram makes me think we decided that he lacked the intestinal fortitude to make it as an NHL player that you win with. Good trade by Benning and Weisbrod if this is true.

Nobody is interested in watching you pat yourself on the back, John.

 

[me2]

It’s not clear he abandoned the team. From all that has come out it seems to me he was unhappy with the situation in Utica, believing the way he was being handled was counter-productive for his style of hockey and development. This was related thru his agent to the club and clearly there were some philosophical differences and Benning took the decision to trade him as this was one of the solutions discussed with the agent.

His agent confirmed he asked for the trade, Dahlen's side initiated it. Maybe his agent misread the situation, or maybe Dahlen made statements to his agent that effectively amounted to a request. Either way the Canucks management didn't start it.

 

[sting101]

This is all on Dahlen except for the part where Benning targetted him in the first place.

Dahlen wanted and got an extra year overseas when they wanted him here at 20.

He comes in this year and struggles everywhere but as a PP specialist. His ghost like performances and poor skating are all well documented and it didnt get better as the season wore on. Must be disappointing to have an NHL dad and be a really good player as a junior for your country but struggle in the AHL. I can see the frustration and probably some embarrassment for Jonathan.

Playing pro on North American ice requires a higher pace and commitment to winning puck battles. I could see in Penticton how bad he was in his own zone but I sluffed it off as a player just getting going ...apparently not. The only way he gets a shot at the NHL level is to be one of the top players in Utica not sulk in frustration.....this is no secret to getting promoted unless you are a role player which he is not.

I dont buy the narrative of Cull and Utica doing a poor job for Dahlen. Gaudette MacEwen Gaunce Brisebois Sautner have all done well and in reference to Lind and Gadjovich who were 19 as things started this fall they couldnt keep up and have been obviously afforded more time to practice and work out rather than just keep demoralizing them with roles they cant handle. You have to look the part not get things handed to you.

My opinion is he asked for a different opportunity and they accomodated as things were looking grim. I highly doubt the franchise would want to piss off Pettersson or throw away the chance for a great duo.....Dahlen just wasnt any good

 

[Cupless44]

This is all on Dahlen except for the part where Benning targetted him in the first place.

Dahlen wanted and got an extra year overseas when they wanted him here at 20.

He comes in this year and struggles everywhere but as a PP specialist. His ghost like performances and poor skating are all well documented and it didnt get better as the season wore on. Must be disappointing to have an NHL dad and be a really good player as a junior for your country but struggle in the AHL. I can see the frustration and probably some embarrassment for Jonathan.

Playing pro on North American ice requires a higher pace and commitment to winning puck battles. I could see in Penticton how bad he was in his own zone but I sluffed it off as a player just getting going ...apparently not. The only way he gets a shot at the NHL level is to be one of the top players in Utica not sulk in frustration.....this is no secret to getting promoted unless you are a role player which he is not.

I dont buy the narrative of Cull and Utica doing a poor job for Dahlen. Gaudette MacEwen Gaunce Brisebois Sautner have all done well and in reference to Lind and Gadjovich who were 19 as things started this fall they couldnt keep up and have been obviously afforded more time to practice and work out rather than just keep demoralizing them with roles they cant handle. You have to look the part not get things handed to you.

My opinion is he asked for a different opportunity and they accomodated as things were looking grim. I highly doubt the franchise would want to piss off Pettersson or throw away the chance for a great duo.....Dahlen just wasnt any good

Will be interesting to watch with San Jose. 3 points in 3 games with Barracudas. Sharks actually have a good track record with development. Quite a few late round picks have made the Sharks. I know which organization I would bet on.

 

[Phenomenon13]

This is all on Dahlen except for the part where Benning targetted him in the first place.

Dahlen wanted and got an extra year overseas when they wanted him here at 20.

He comes in this year and struggles everywhere but as a PP specialist. His ghost like performances and poor skating are all well documented and it didnt get better as the season wore on. Must be disappointing to have an NHL dad and be a really good player as a junior for your country but struggle in the AHL. I can see the frustration and probably some embarrassment for Jonathan.

Playing pro on North American ice requires a higher pace and commitment to winning puck battles. I could see in Penticton how bad he was in his own zone but I sluffed it off as a player just getting going ...apparently not. The only way he gets a shot at the NHL level is to be one of the top players in Utica not sulk in frustration.....this is no secret to getting promoted unless you are a role player which he is not.

I dont buy the narrative of Cull and Utica doing a poor job for Dahlen. Gaudette MacEwen Gaunce Brisebois Sautner have all done well and in reference to Lind and Gadjovich who were 19 as things started this fall they couldnt keep up and have been obviously afforded more time to practice and work out rather than just keep demoralizing them with roles they cant handle. You have to look the part not get things handed to you.

My opinion is he asked for a different opportunity and they accomodated as things were looking grim. I highly doubt the franchise would want to piss off Pettersson or throw away the chance for a great duo.....Dahlen just wasnt any good

Utica has been awful at development. Five years into it and we have like markstrom? To show for it.

 

[sting101]

Utica has been awful at development. Five years into it and we have like markstrom? To show for it.

Markstrom Demko Biega Virtanen Baertschi Goldobin Gaudette Brisebois Sautner MacEwen Gaunce

 

[TruKnyte]

Markstrom Demko Biega Virtanen Baertschi Goldobin Gaudette Brisebois Sautner MacEwen Gaunce

I don't think that's a very inspiring list tbh

 

[sting101]

I don't think that's a very inspiring list tbh

Not many are.

Most teams best players skip through the minors like Horvat Boeser Pettersson have and probably Quinn Hughes

 

[sting101]

i like what i've read about Karlsson
Linus Karlsson
Vancouver Canucks

image courtesy of NHL.com

Fantasy Summary

Midde-six scoring center

Country	SWE
Position	C
Shoot/Glove	Right
Date of Birth	November 16, 1999
Height	6‘2”
Weight	190 lbs
Drafted	2018 Round 3; Overall: 87

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TFOOT] [/TFOOT]

Observations

February 2019 – Karlsson has been traded from San Jose to Vancouver for Jonathan Dahlén. The 19-year-old has struggled to replicate the offensive dominance that was his calling card in the SuperElit during the 2017-18 campaign. His squad, Karlskrona, features several SHL veteran centres who vie for time ahead of the two-way Karlsson. He’s been finding his way from the middle-six for most of the year. Karlsson boasts high-end intelligence, a great work ethic and a strong release. He’s still growing and filling into his frame, but his maturity – especially on the defensive side of the puck, is impressive. His contract is up at the end of this season, so we may see the 87th overall selection from last June in the AHL to close out 2018-19 or begin 2019-20. Cam Robinson

June 2018 – The Sharks drafted the Swedish center with the 87th pick in the 2018 NHL entry draft. They must have liked what they saw from Karlsson this season as they traded the 114th and the 145th pick to move up and draft him. Karlsson led the SuperElit, the Swedish junior league, in goal scoring. He also finished second in points behind only Jonatan Berggren, a Detroit second rounder some had ranked in the first. Karlsson got into 13 games for the SHL’s Karlskrona HK, he only posted a single assist but just playing in the SHL is a positive for an 18 year old player. Karlsson is an offensive player, he possesses a good shot, good hands and he has the size that won’t hurt his chances of developing into an NHLer. Karlskrona was relegated from the SHL to the Allsvenskan for the coming season so barring any surprises that is where Karlsson will play. It will be intriguing to see if he can continue to shine as he adapts to playing against men. Chris Legg

 

[Phenomenon13]

Markstrom Demko Biega Virtanen Baertschi Goldobin Gaudette Brisebois Sautner MacEwen Gaunce

Yeah that is a really track record especially with context


Most of the development for markstrom baertschi goldobin gaudette was done before they even got to Utica.

Baertschi and gaudette played 15 and 14 games respectively.

 

[sting101]

Yeah that is a really track record especially with context


Most of the development for markstrom baertschi goldobin gaudette was done before they even got to Utica.

Baertschi and gaudette played 15 and 14 games respectively.

well i hate to say it but Bennings oldest drafted players are 22.

Markstrom Gaunce Friesen Corrado Grenier Subban Cassels Jensen Shinkaruk Sautner MacEwen Demko Virtanen 22 and older...who would you say was developed poorly in Utica?

i think the bigger problem is the lack of picks and the trading away of others...McCann Forsling Shinkaruk etc. 2nd for Vey Baertschi Sutter 3rds for Pedan Dorsett 4th for Pouliot Typically teams with 2nd to 5th rounders have to develop them in the AHL we have lacked these players in the first place that have the upside that might turn out with fine tuning.

 

[ZEBROA]

This is nothing to be upset over. Uticas development system did not match Dahlen and vice versa. Barracudas might match a lot more, who knows. There are thousand of things to be upset about before this, which is not upsetting at all. I would be a little nervous about the development system thou. It takes a lot before people speak up. Especially a Norrlänning. I trust the Norrlänning before anyone else in this matter.

 

[shottasasa]

well i hate to say it but Bennings oldest drafted players are 22.

Markstrom Gaunce Friesen Corrado Grenier Subban Cassels Jensen Shinkaruk Sautner MacEwen Demko Virtanen 22 and older...who would you say was developed poorly in Utica?

i think the bigger problem is the lack of picks and the trading away of others...McCann Forsling Shinkaruk etc. 2nd for Vey Baertschi Sutter 3rds for Pedan Dorsett 4th for Pouliot Typically teams with 2nd to 5th rounders have to develop them in the AHL we have lacked these players in the first place that have the upside that might turn out with fine tuning.

Cull and his assistants were only hired prior to last season so that’s what I’m looking at. And I don’t consider Gaudette as a success for Utica. He barely played there. I’m not saying that Cull needs to be let go, it’s only his second year and he’s done some good things with a couple players like McEwan and deserves a bit of time, but if this trend continues next year I might be ready to get on that train.

I have similar thoughts in Green. I like some of what he’s done, but I want to see some progression on his system next year.

 

[DomY]

I wonder how Elias feels that his great friend was shipped out of here. He isnt willing to talk about it which gives some indication.

Have you ever worked somewhere, and then your friend leaves, and then you just get on with your life and still are friends with them outside of the office? I am assuming it's something similar.

To me, Pettersson is probably the hungriest young player to win I have ever seen. He already knows he doesn't have to work to be noticed, play for his next contract, or show how he can be a leader on the team. He already is all that.

I'm sure he understands the business and just wants to win. Similarly, have you ever hired your friend to work with you, and then have it kind of not work out so well? It's not uncommon for that to happen either.

 

[DomY]

Cull and his assistants were only hired prior to last season so that’s what I’m looking at. And I don’t consider Gaudette as a success for Utica. He barely played there. I’m not saying that Cull needs to be let go, it’s only his second year and he’s done some good things with a couple players like McEwan and deserves a bit of time, but if this trend continues next year I might be ready to get on that train.

I have similar thoughts in Green. I like some of what he’s done, but I want to see some progression on his system next year.

I'm honestly surprised that the Canucks don't have a roving skills coach or something. Someone who spends some time with the big club, then travels up and down to Utica primarily focused on developing the prospects on the team, sort of like how Ian Clark works with all the goaltenders in the system.

It's probably a bit more awkward because you have prospects spread across the world and playing for other organizations, but still. That way you can have Cull and crew focused on winning games, and this skills coach focused on development of the pro game.

 

[F A N]

I'm honestly surprised that the Canucks don't have a roving skills coach or something. Someone who spends some time with the big club, then travels up and down to Utica primarily focused on developing the prospects on the team, sort of like how Ian Clark works with all the goaltenders in the system.

It's probably a bit more awkward because you have prospects spread across the world and playing for other organizations, but still. That way you can have Cull and crew focused on winning games, and this skills coach focused on development of the pro game.

It's not about that. Cull's responsibility is not just to win games. It's to develop prospects into NHL players A prospect's development isn't just about the skills coach.

Utica has had two coaches: Green and Cull. Their ability to develop players is a legitimate question.