Player Discussion Jeff Petry

[Lebowski]

I've always said keeping Petry, Weber, even Price should in large part be dependent on how quickly we think we can turn into a contender. If it's one or two years then by all means keep them, but I have serious doubts we can do it that quickly even though in year one we took a number of big strides towards doing it.

This season to me is a carbon copy of the 12-13 season.

History repeats itself. If the current planning is to compete with this roster going forward, I'm going to guess we'll be right back where we started 5 years from now.

Only thing that could salvage it all and turn this team into a contender in spite of everything else is if we can hit some home runs late in the draft. A guy like Brook looks like he could be a home run. We'll see.

 

[Andrei79]

This season to me is a carbon copy of the 12-13 season.

History repeats itself. If the current planning is to compete with this roster going forward, I'm going to guess we'll be right back where we started 5 years from now.

Only thing that could salvage it all and turn this team into a contender in spite of everything else is if we can hit some home runs late in the draft. A guy like Brook looks like he could be a home run. We'll see.

My main complaint about the moves from 13' on is they never bought into a direction. They should have either sold a part of the team and tried to gain young assets or went 100% into the idea of contending (like LA did), and that would have been fine. Any time you have a Vezina caliber goaltender and Norris winner in their 20s at the same time + Markov, you can expect your team not to fall down too deep in the standings.

That means the idea of rebuilding more likely wouldn't have worked. At that point, selling our assets (including Galchy) would've been fine to get centers and another defenseman.

The team needs to choose a direction again. I hope they don't f*** around by drafting 16-25th overall for 4 years without making any moves to contend.

 

[Habs Halifax]

5 goals over last 6 games, quite impressive Petry!

He's been impressive in the last 2 seasons. Now that Weber is back, he is still producing. It's nice to see!

- Tied 4th in goals for Defensemen with 7
- Tied 9th in points for Defenseman with 25

I guess the article that came out before the season started saying Petry was a top 20 NHL defenseman over the last 3 seasons means more than most realized or are willing to admit.

 

[Habs Halifax]

This season to me is a carbon copy of the 12-13 season.

History repeats itself. If the current planning is to compete with this roster going forward, I'm going to guess we'll be right back where we started 5 years from now.

Only thing that could salvage it all and turn this team into a contender in spite of everything else is if we can hit some home runs late in the draft. A guy like Brook looks like he could be a home run. We'll see.

I agree about the mirrored image from the 12/13 season. Habs need a few more grade A prospects and the best way to get them is to draft them. Better probability of getting them with top 10 picks vs 10+ picks.

Something tells me our holes on LD will take just as long to fill as it took us with the center depth if we continue our current strategy which is "try for the playoffs where anything can happen". Our GM needs to understand that this current core won't win a cup. Keep the key parts and build around them with our current prospects coming in and a few more we don't have yet.

Sell Markov, Pleky, Gionta, vs Sell Petry, Byron, Tatar. Same dilemma

 

[LaP]

Personally i think we should sell. But i'm fine with trying to win even if i think it wont work. What i'm not fine with is keep trying guys like Kulak, Schlemko or Benn and hoping one of them turn out to be a gem. We already struck gold with Byron and Peca played well the last few games. You can't find gems in the bargain bin every seasons. Beside we need a lot more than that on the left side of the defense.

If we try to win now we must try for real. If not then sell guys over 30 not named Price or Weber and draft more prospects. I mean Dale Weise it was fun while it lasted and Byron is fun too but at one point we need to aim higher than that or else we will keep being a good but not good enough team. And by higher i mean even higher than a soon to be 30 years old Muzzin. We need at least one stud on the left side.

 

[Braun]

I don’t get the want/need of trading Petry...

 

[1909]

I don’t get the want/need of trading Petry...

I agree. There is none.

He is a very good #2 d-man. Habs have a bunch of bottom pairing d-men behind Weber and Petry.

 

[Vachon23]

I don’t get the want/need of trading Petry...

So we can have draft pick to maybe if where lucky draft an other Petry...

 

[Frank Drebin]

I don’t get the want/need of trading Petry...

Magic beans that will just go rotten in our drafting and development teams pantry.

We're better off trading marginal players like Weise for seconds than great players like petry for late firsts and b prospects.

Unless we can get a pacioretty type deal - keep him.

 

[26Mats]

So we can have draft pick to maybe if where lucky draft an other Petry...

More like we get really good assets that are young enough to not be passed their prime by the time we actually have a realistic chance to compete for the cup (3 - 5 years), is the argument.

 

[1909]

So we can have draft pick to maybe if where lucky draft an other Petry...

And have a weaker D for the next 3-4 seasons, still.

 

[Braun]

More like we get really good assets that are young enough to not be passed their prime by the time we actually have a realistic chance to compete for the cup (3 - 5 years), is the argument.

I don’t believe in rebuilds. I do believe in assets and I agree trading our assets for younger better assets is good but not a top 3 D. You trade where you have an excess in skill, We don’t have excess on défense.

 

[Vachon23]

More like we get really good assets that are young enough to not be passed their prime by the time we actually have a realistic chance to compete for the cup (3 - 5 years), is the argument.

Or asset that will maybe play 20 games in there life for MTL ? There's biggest chance that the pick you got will be a floppe then a Petry caliber player

 

[admiralcadillac]

Personally i think we should sell. But i'm fine with trying to win even if i think it wont work. What i'm not fine with is keep trying guys like Kulak, Schlemko or Benn and hoping one of them turn out to be a gem. We already struck gold with Byron and Peca played well the last few games. You can't find gems in the bargain bin every seasons. Beside we need a lot more than that on the left side of the defense.

If we try to win now we must try for real. If not then sell guys over 30 not named Price or Weber and draft more prospects. I mean Dale Weise it was fun while it lasted and Byron is fun too but at one point we need to aim higher than that or else we will keep being a good but not good enough team. And by higher i mean even higher than a soon to be 30 years old Muzzin. We need at least one stud on the left side.

Kulak seems more than fine in the fold, just not a top pair. He's still very young too for a d man.

 

[26Mats]

Or asset that will maybe play 20 games in there life for MTL ? There's biggest chance that the pick you got will be a floppe then a Petry caliber player

I dont trade Petry unless im getting a prospect if the caliber of Suzuki or a good lottery pick. Sure theres a chance either of thise fail, but ill take that chance. Timmins' record in the lottery: Andrei Kostitsyn, Price, McDonagh, Glachenyuk, Sergachev, Kotkaniemi.

 

[26Mats]

I don’t believe in rebuilds. I do believe in assets and I agree trading our assets for younger better assets is good but not a top 3 D. You trade where you have an excess in skill, We don’t have excess on défense.

Yes thats where you and those that want to trade Petry as part of a rebuild disagree. I have yet to see a post where someone wants to trade Petry but its not part of a rebuild. I.e. thinking we have a better chance of winning a cup in the future than now.

 

[1909]

Yes thats where you and those that want to trade Petry as part of a rebuild disagree. I have yet to see a post where someone wants to trade Petry but its not part of a rebuild. I.e. thinking we have a better chance of winning a cup in the future than now.

That future might not be that far. And Petry is needed to reach it. If a team like Vegas can make it to the Finals, lots of teams can make it too, Habs included.

 

[Braun]

Yes thats where you and those that want to trade Petry as part of a rebuild disagree. I have yet to see a post where someone wants to trade Petry but its not part of a rebuild. I.e. thinking we have a better chance of winning a cup in the future than now.

With the parity in the league now rebuilds are pretty useless, especially since you aren't even guaranteed a 1 OA pick if you finish last. You can still build through the draft if you make the playoffs every year. I believe in that.

 

[26Mats]

With the parity in the league now rebuilds are pretty useless, especially since you aren't even guaranteed a 1 OA pick if you finish last. You can still build through the draft if you make the playoffs every year. I believe in that.

My idea invilves a mix of attaining good palyers when theyre available cheap (skinner, perron, and duclair this past summer) all while trading vets that are overvalued in the market for rwally good futures ( ex pacioretty for tatar, suzuki, and a 2nd). And building theough players trade for like suzuki, and our own draft picks.

But to your statement: can you name one team that has won the cup recently without having previously sucked for many, many years? I think its possible, but you have to be very good with trades and acquisitions, cant only do it through the draft.

 

[Braun]

My idea invilves a mix of attaining good palyers when theyre available cheap (skinner, perron, and duclair this past summer) all while trading vets that are overvalued in the market for rwally good futures ( ex pacioretty for tatar, suzuki, and a 2nd). And building theough players trade for like suzuki, and our own draft picks.

But to your statement: can you name one team that has won the cup recently without having previously sucked for many, many years? I think its possible, but you have to be very good with trades and acquisitions, cant only do it through the draft.

Washington
Boston
Detroit

I agree chicago, pitts and LA rebuilt through draft. I just don't think in this NHL era it is the way to go. I agree with you, good trades and asset management is the way to go.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I don’t get the want/need of trading Petry...

For picks, me neither. For an equivalently proven LHD: sure.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I mean Dale Weise it was fun while it lasted and Byron is fun too but at one point we need to aim higher than that or else we will keep being a good but not good enough team. And by higher i mean even higher than a soon to be 30 years old Muzzin. We need at least one stud on the left side.

Seriously, did you just put Weise and Byron in the same category?!

Did Weise score 20+ twice and on pace for a third straight season?

 

[26Mats]

Washington
Boston
Detroit

I agree chicago, pitts and LA rebuilt through draft. I just don't think in this NHL era it is the way to go. I agree with you, good trades and asset management is the way to go.

Boston and detroit are the exceptions. Washington doesnt win a cup without ovechkin and Backstrom, and missed the playoffs 5 out of 6 years from 2002 to 2007 when they got ovie and backstrom. And although theyve been good at draftung, they took alzner number 5 overall, so it shows you need multiple top 5 picks to get the franchise player, very rare to tank once and get it.

As for Detroit they were ahead of the league for scouting europeans (darsyuk, zetterberg, franzen, etc...) once the rest of the league caught up...well we see where Detroit is now...

As for Boston, their mvp was Chara. Chiarelli signed him as a ufa for 7.5 million when the cap was 39 million. Now the cap will be over 80 million, but people balk when i say we should go after top rfa's or ufas by giving the 15 plus million....

But im not for tanking by the way. I just pointed out that the reason people want to trade petry is to sacrifice the present for a better future.

 

[Braun]

Boston and detroit are the exceptions. Washington doesnt win a cup without ovechkin and Backstrom, and missed the playoffs 5 out of 6 years from 2002 to 2007 when they got ovie and backstrom. And although theyve been good at draftung, they took alzner number 5 overall, so it shows you need multiple top 5 picks to get the franchise player, very rare to tank once and get it.

As for Detroit they were ahead of the league for scouting europeans (darsyuk, zetterberg, franzen, etc...) once the rest of the league caught up...well we see where Detroit is now...

As for Boston, their mvp was Chara. Chiarelli signed him as a ufa for 7.5 million when the cap was 39 million. Now the cap will be over 80 million, but people balk when i say we should go after top rfa's or ufas by giving the 15 plus million....

But im not for tanking by the way. I just pointed out that the reason people want to trade petry is to sacrifice the present for a better future.

I purposely didn't include all the teams who lost in the finals but to me, once you get to the finals anything can happen. I.E. Vegas, TB etc...

 

[scrubadam]

With the parity in the league now rebuilds are pretty useless, especially since you aren't even guaranteed a 1 OA pick if you finish last. You can still build through the draft if you make the playoffs every year. I believe in that.

And the habs in the last 7 drafts had top 10 pick in 3 of them, thats like 40%.

People shouldn't worry about getting top picks, with parity the habs will most likely draft top 10 another 4 times over the next decade.