Speculation: JC and Hawks scouts at Sharks/Avs game

[Kaners Bald Spot]

So could you live with a 5 year 8M AAV contract for EK? That is right on the fence for me.

 

[Hawkaholic]

So could you live with a 5 year 8M AAV contract for EK? That is right on the fence for me.

I'd be all over that. It gives us a legit chance to win a Cup in the next 2 - 4 years.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

I'd be all over that. It gives us a legit chance to win a Cup in the next 2 - 4 years.

I was originally going to say 9M but i thought that was too high for the risk. I think it would take 5 years for EK and I don't see anyone going longer than that. If I had to guess what he signs for, I'd say 5/45-50

 

[ChiHawks10]

So could you live with a 5 year 8M AAV contract for EK? That is right on the fence for me.

I'd actually think hard about that. I'm not a huge fan, but 5 years carries less risk for an inevitable decline as his legs get worse. I'd prefer 3 or 4 if the Hawks actually targeted him, and 8m would be a good number. Problem is... someone is going to give him the 7/10m, IMO. I don't think there's any way he accepts a deal for less than 6 years. He's looking to get his last big payday at this point, considering he's coming up on 30 real quick.

 

[piteus]

I'd actually think hard about that. I'm not a huge fan, but 5 years carries less risk for an inevitable decline as his legs get worse. I'd prefer 3 or 4 if the Hawks actually targeted him, and 8m would be a good number. Problem is... someone is going to give him the 7/10m, IMO. I don't think there's any way he accepts a deal for less than 6 years. He's looking to get his last big payday at this point, considering he's coming up on 30 real quick.

If we didn't have Seabrook's contract hanging over our heads, I'd be fine with your thinking. Add Duncan Keith (who's still playing well) to the mix ... we can't afford to take a risk on EK65. I'd be fine with EK65 with Seabrook's contract and Keith. However, not all 3.

 

[BK]

So could you live with a 5 year 8M AAV contract for EK? That is right on the fence for me.

Yea

 

[JaegerDice]

Excellent.

The Seabrook comparisons remain nonsensical to me given the gap in quality between the players we're talking about, and the age at which the contracts are being signed.

 

[ColdSteel2]

So could you live with a 5 year 8M AAV contract for EK? That is right on the fence for me.

My issue with this is that I think it significantly increases the chance Mitchell walks. EK, Boqvist, Seabrook and Jokiharju doesn’t leave any room for him. Even if we traded Jokiharju, it’s still an issue.

I do like the idea of it though. If we could move Seabrook, it’d be tempting. It would definitely be nice to give the team a short term boost somehow.

 

[ChiHawks10]

Excellent.

The Seabrook comparisons remain nonsensical to me given the gap in quality between the players we're talking about, and the age at which the contracts are being signed.

Seabrook never had a fully severed achilles, and a nasty ankle injury requiring bone to be permanently removed from his ankle, and his ankle fused together, causing him to have to adjust his skating to compensate for it. But think what you want, JD. Seabrook was also not 100% reliant on his skating to be elite, which is the biggest thing that has set EK apart all these years.

With those injuries, it's not a matter of if he slows down, but when. And I don't want to risk another Seabs 2.0 contract for people to bitch about incessantly when that inevitability comes to fruition.

 

[piteus]

Excellent.

The Seabrook comparisons remain nonsensical to me given the gap in quality between the players we're talking about, and the age at which the contracts are being signed.

Huh? The Seabrook reference is only to point out that we still have another huge DMen contracts on the books. It's not specifically about EK65, but more about the Hawks cap situation.

I'd be ecstatic to give up Seabrook's contract for EK65 for 5 years at $8mn. It's only an extra million with the same about of years. However, you put Keith, Seabrook, and EK65's contracts all together and the risks are just too much. If Keith and EK65 decline, it would be the death knell for the current Hawks as we know it. I'm not willing to make that bet on EK65 with his current injury concerns.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Huh? The Seabrook reference is only to point out that we still have another huge DMen contracts on the books. It's not specifically about EK65, but more about the Hawks cap situation.

I'd be ecstatic to give up Seabrook's contract for EK65 for 5 years at $8mn. It's only an extra million with the same about of years. However, you put Keith, Seabrook, and EK65's contracts all together and the risks are just too much. If Keith and EK65 decline, it would be the death knell for the current Hawks as we know it. I'm not willing to make that bet on EK65 with his current injury concerns.

I'd be ecstatic

Seabrook never had a fully severed achilles, and a nasty ankle injury requiring bone to be permanently removed from his ankle, and his ankle fused together, causing him to have to adjust his skating to compensate for it. But think what you want, JD. Seabrook was also not 100% reliant on his skating to be elite, which is the biggest thing that has set EK apart all these years.

With those injuries, it's not a matter of if he slows down, but when. And I don't want to risk another Seabs 2.0 contract for people to ***** about incessantly when that inevitable comes to fruition.

The above is where the Seabrook comparison comes from. EK65 has had a metric shit ton of leg injuries and it will catch up with him eventually.

 

[JaegerDice]

Huh? The Seabrook reference is only to point out that we still have another huge DMen contracts on the books. It's not specifically about EK65, but more about the Hawks cap situation.

I'd be ecstatic to give up Seabrook's contract for EK65 for 5 years at $8mn. It's only an extra million with the same about of years. However, you put Keith, Seabrook, and EK65's contracts all together and the risks are just too much. If Keith and EK65 decline, it would be the death knell for the current Hawks as we know it. I'm not willing to make that bet on EK65 with his current injury concerns.

That's fair enough.

My view is that the current Hawks as we know them basically have 3-4 years tops anyway. So I'm more keen on players that can have maximum potential impact now, versus who might still be good in 5 or 6 years when Kane and Toews are both essentially 3rd liners and the team is going to be **** anyway.

As far as Stan Bowman goes, he's gone in like 4 years anyway, regardless of whether the team wins another cup or not before then, for the same reason. Because there's going to be a tipping point at which this team is just irrecoverably bad until the contracts are played out, or close enough to being done that you can move them for little value, and he's going to get fired, and then probably hired somewhere else to start another team's build or cup push or whatever. So I can definitely see why he would put all his chips in now and go for the guy that has highest potential immediate impact.

 

[MurrayBannerman]

Yea, I'm very much in who cares about years 6-8 mindset.

 

[u2wojo]

UFA to be Nemeth for the right price and term might be a good fit. PK's, some size/physicality more stay at home so a nice compliment on the left side to Gus....Gus plays more if we are behind, and a guy like Nemeth plays more when we are ahead.

 

[ChiHawks10]

That's fair enough.

My view is that the current Hawks as we know them basically have 3-4 years tops anyway. So I'm more keen on players that can have maximum potential impact now, versus who might still be good in 5 or 6 years when Kane and Toews are both essentially 3rd liners and the team is going to be **** anyway.

As far as Stan Bowman goes, he's gone in like 4 years anyway, regardless of whether the team wins another cup or not before then, for the same reason. Because there's going to be a tipping point at which this team is just irrecoverably bad until the contracts are played out, or close enough to being done that you can move them for little value, and he's going to get fired, and then probably hired somewhere else to start another team's build or cup push or whatever. So I can definitely see why he would put all his chips in now and go for the guy that has highest potential immediate impact.

Being handcuffed by a Seabs 2.0 contract the last 3-4 years of EK's deal is something that I can guarantee you, and everyone else on here, would be bitching about, once it comes to be.

 

[JaegerDice]

Being handcuffed by a Seabs 2.0 contract the last 3-4 years of EK's deal is something that I can guarantee you, and everyone else on here, would be *****ing about, once it comes to be.

I'd just argue we'll be bitching about being handcuffed to 10.5mil 3rd liners too. Cause that's how fans work, and that's how the cycle goes in the salary cap era.

There are no more career-long heroes in hockey, short of the guys that walk away and leave money on the table when they're still being paid fair value.

 

[ColdSteel2]

I'd just argue we'll be *****ing about being handcuffed to 10.5mil 3rd liners too. Cause that's how fans work, and that's how the cycle goes in the salary cap era.

There are no more career-long heroes in hockey, short of the guys that walk away and leave money on the table when they're still being paid fair value.

Maybe Toews and Kane will leave money on the table. Only 4 seasons left on their current deals.

 

[Kevin Musto]

UFA to be Nemeth for the right price and term might be a good fit. PK's, some size/physicality more stay at home so a nice compliment on the left side to Gus....Gus plays more if we are behind, and a guy like Nemeth plays more when we are ahead.

Of course that's who they're looking at. I'm stupid for not realizing it. Good sleuthing. Nemeth is definitely the guy they want. UFA, only 27, a big and physical stay at home defender. He's literally perfect.

Keith-Jokiharju
Nemeth-Murphy
Gus-Seabs
Dahlstrom

ALL ABOARD THE NEMETH TRAIN!!!!!!!!

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Of course that's who they're looking at. I'm stupid for not realizing it. Good sleuthing. Nemeth is definitely the guy they want. UFA, only 27, a big and physical stay at home defender. He's literally perfect.

Keith-Jokiharju
Nemeth-Murphy
Gus-Seabs
Dahlstrom

ALL ABOARD THE NEMETH TRAIN!!!!!!!!

Rip generational Byram

 

[piteus]

I get the urgency issues, but I think there are better investments than EK65 for 5 years due to our financial factors. We have less margin for error, hence ... I don't want to make a bet on the Hawks next 4-5 years on EK65. There are better risk/reward UFAs.

I don't believe EK65 fits our current situation. That said, I would love a young UFA DMen ... just not EK65 at that price with so many question marks while trying to get rid of Seabrook's contract.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Rip generational Byram

Byram isn't officially a Hawk. Once he is, the pairings will look like this:

Byram-Byram
Byram-Byram
Byram-Byram
Byram

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Byram isn't officially a Hawk. Once he is, the pairings will look like this:

Byram-Byram
Byram-Byram
Byram-Byram
Byram

Like 2015 when it was Keith-Keith on the 3rd pair

 

[Toews2Bickell]

I get the urgency issues, but I think there are better investments than EK65 for 5 years due to our financial factors. We have less margin for error, hence ... I don't want to make a bet on the Hawks next 4-5 years on EK65. There are better risk/reward UFAs.

I don't believe EK65 fits our current situation. That said, I would love a young UFA DMen ... just not EK65 at that price with so many question marks while trying to get rid of Seabrook's contract.

I’m more concerned about term than price. Its a lot easier to dump a bad contract with 2-3 years than 4-5. If the Hawks window with Toews/Kane is 2-3 then it sort of lines up anyway.

 

[ColdSteel2]

I’m more concerned about term than price. Its a lot easier to dump a bad contract with 2-3 years than 4-5. If the Hawks window with Toews/Kane is 2-3 then it sort of lines up anyway.

If he’d take 40M over 5 years, he’d probably take 35M over 3 years.

 

[piteus]

I’m more concerned about term than price. Its a lot easier to dump a bad contract with 2-3 years than 4-5. If the Hawks window with Toews/Kane is 2-3 then it sort of lines up anyway.

If Karlsson said 3 years for $24mn ... of course, you have to think long and hard about it, even with Seabrook's contract. Unless Karlsson has a major injury, trading a 30 year old with only $16mn left on his contract with his resume wouldn't be that hard. I agree with your point.

However, I can't imagine EK65 would sign a 3 year deal ... and certainly not without a NMC.