Jack Eichel or Austin Matthews 17/18

[Pens x]

Hands down Matthews. Plus Matthews isn't a little twerp like Eichel.

 

[Hasek]

Hands down Matthews. Plus Matthews isn't a little twerp like Eichel.

What's a twerp?

 

[X66]

Lmao he outscored him by 13 points in 3 less games.

Saying it's debateable that Scheifele was better than Matthews is basically the equivalent of me saying it's debateable that Perreault had a better year than Kadri

He played way more hockey than Matthews though.

 

[Kamiccolo]

No one is mentioning that Matthews is 11 months younger than Eichel either.

Anyways, I think that looking at points only is dumb anyway. Eichel very well can out score Matthews, but it doesn't mean he is better. Matthews has a physical skillset only a few other players have. Not even McDavid has it. Matthews has the Crosby body.

Matthews is the superior player on the other side of the puck, will always score more goals then him.

I'd take a 75 point Matthews over an 82 point Eichel.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

No one is mentioning that Matthews is 11 months younger than Eichel either.

Anyways, I think that looking at points only is dumb anyway. Eichel very well can out score Matthews, but it doesn't mean he is better. Matthews has a physical skillset only a few other players have. Not even McDavid has it. Matthews has the Crosby body.

Matthews is the superior player on the other side of the puck, will always score more goals then him.

I'd take a 75 point Matthews over an 82 point Eichel.

But Eichel is the superior playmaker, will have more assists, making his wingers better. Which is an essential role for a Center.

 

[threeVo]

They should be around the same amount of goals, but Eichel will have 20+ assists more IMO.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

They should be around the same amount of goals, but Eichel will have 20+ assists more IMO.

He had 33 assists in 61 games already last year on a team that did not score many goals. Pretty much playing 82 games this year, he will up those totals pretty easily.

 

[zeke]

But Eichel is the superior playmaker, will have more assists, making his wingers better. Which is an essential role for a Center.

weird that the superior playmaker has never out-assisted matthews at any comparable point in their careers so far.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

But Eichel is the superior playmaker, will have more assists, making his wingers better. Which is an essential role for a Center.

Matthews makes his wingers better by virtue of being an elite playmaker, but also by carrying the defensive load and being such a massive threat to score goals that they need to focus more on him and give more space for his teammates. He won't set up as many goals as Eichel but his impact on his team is astonishing

 

[Kamiccolo]

But Eichel is the superior playmaker, will have more assists, making his wingers better. Which is an essential role for a Center.

We've had this debate before. You ignored the sample size of his career and only used last year and small sample sizes to say so. If you take into account his career, he has an almost even split of goals and assists.

Nevermind the logic makes no sense. Tyler Bozak had more assists than Matthews, I guess you take Bozak over Matthews?

 

[zeke]

Assists per game at the same age/levels

Age 19

Auston: NHL .35
J.Eichel: NHL .39

Age 18

Auston: WJC .57
J.Eichel: WJC .60

Age 17

Auston: US18 1.02 / USNT 1.17 / WJ20 .40 / WJ18 1.00
J.Eichel: US18 .93 / USNT 1.04 / WJ20 .80 / WJ18 .71

Age 16

Auston: US18 .25 / US17 .88 / USNT .50 / WJ18 .29 / WJ17 .67
J.Eichel: US18 .36 / US17 .42 / USNT .40 / WJ18 .14 / WJ17 .00



Eichel is not, nor has ever been, a better playmaker than Matthews.

But Matthews has always been a better goalscorer than Eichel.

 

[Mattilaus]

Assists per game at the same age/levels

Age 19

Auston: NHL .35
J.Eichel: NHL .39

Age 18

Auston: WJC .57
J.Eichel: WJC .60

Age 17

Auston: US18 1.02 / USNT 1.17 / WJ20 .40 / WJ18 1.00
J.Eichel: US18 .93 / USNT 1.04 / WJ20 .80 / WJ18 .71

Age 16

Auston: US18 .25 / US17 .88 / USNT .50 / WJ18 .29 / WJ17 .67
J.Eichel: US18 .36 / US17 .42 / USNT .40 / WJ18 .14 / WJ17 .00



Eichel is not, nor has ever been, a better playmaker than Matthews.

But Matthews has always been a better goalscorer than Eichel.

Maybe I am crazy, but didn't you literally put in your own post examples of Eichel having more assists?

Also:

weird that the superior playmaker has never out-assisted matthews at any comparable point in their careers so far.

As you noted above, Eichel had more assists in his rookie year.....so are you just completely making up **** or?

 

[McVespa99]

I would have said Eichel but I have seen the Unicorn Halloween costume. That knocks him down a long way in my rankings.

 

[Garthinater]

But Eichel is the superior playmaker, will have more assists, making his wingers better. Which is an essential role for a Center.

Don't most Laine fans say goals are more valuable than assists?

 

[The Winter Soldier]

weird that the superior playmaker has never out-assisted matthews at any comparable point in their careers so far.

Why do you like comparing teams and seasons that both played separately from? Or do you actually believe this argument since Bracco would be a better playmaker than both. See the error in this narrative. Eichel was in the U of Michigan that year. Had a great year too.

We've had this debate before. You ignored the sample size of his career and only used last year and small sample sizes to say so. If you take into account his career, he has an almost even split of goals and assists.

Nevermind the logic makes no sense. Tyler Bozak had more assists than Matthews, I guess you take Bozak over Matthews?

Well 33 assists in 61 games is better than 29 in 82. If you want to revisit next year when the sample size is bigger than 82 NHL games, I would be happy to. I still say Eichel will have more assists than Matthews.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Same caliber of player

 

[DaJackal]

Wait, no poll?

Both are great but I'd put my money on Matthews.

 

[hellstick]

Eichel doesn't get 90. I think 80 is a good possibility, but 70-75 is more like it.

Matthews won't score 40 this season. He still scores more than Eichel, and probably gets around 65 points to finish.

Great seasons for both. I might value the higher goal scoring totals of Matthews, however.

 

[Lacaar]

I'm a big Austin Mathew's fan and I'd take him.

Love watching him play. Love watching Toronto play.

As an Edmonton native that has a lot of fun cheering against Toronto I they are one of the funnest teams to watch.

 

[Kamiccolo]

Why do you like comparing teams and seasons that both played separately from? Or do you actually believe this argument since Bracco would be a better playmaker than both. See the error in this narrative. Eichel was in the U of Michigan that year. Had a great year too.



Well 33 assists in 61 games is better than 29 in 82. If you want to revisit next year when the sample size is bigger than 82 NHL games, I would be happy to. I still say Eichel will have more assists than Matthews.

You still haven't addressed my question. RE: the bolded, using your logic, Bozak was a better center than Matthews last year. Agree or disagree?

 

[sabrebuild]

weird that the superior playmaker has never out-assisted matthews at any comparable point in their careers so far.

Except, as rookies in the NHL, or was that an illusion?

 

[sabrebuild]

You still haven't addressed my question. RE: the bolded, using your logic, Bozak was a better center than Matthews last year. Agree or disagree?

Wasn't the question who is a better playmaker?

 

[Kamiccolo]

Wasn't the question who is a better playmaker?

Here is what he said

"But Eichel is the superior playmaker, will have more assists, making his wingers better. Which is an essential role for a Center."

He is arguing that because Eichel "Makes his wingers better", and he proves this by using assists, that he is more valuable as a center vs a goal scoring C.

I am saying this makes no sense and you can see this by applying the logic like I did with Bozak, but feel free to come up with your own.

I can try to do another example just showing how dumb it is to look at one stat only.

"Gardiner is wayyy better than Risto. Risto was -9 and Gardiner was +24!"

You could argue that isn't a fair way to evaluate them as their teams having different goals for/against, etc. However this is the same logic being used when saying his linemates at 5v5 shot super low %.

He is using assists without context to say he is better, and it makes no sense.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

You still haven't addressed my question. RE: the bolded, using your logic, Bozak was a better center than Matthews last year. Agree or disagree?

Why don't you address the question instead of bringing up non related points, otherwise know as 'strawman' points to address if Matthews is indeed a superior to Eichel as a playmaker.

Remember you posted this blanket generalization.

Matthews is the superior player on the other side of the puck, will always score more goals then him.

You know what the reply was. I believe Eichel is the superior playmaker and will continue to be so into their entire careers. 33 assists in 61 is better than 29 in 82. If you want to revisit this next year since you objected to the sample size. We can next year.

Wasn't the question who is a better playmaker?

It was, wasn't it? Wonder what the answer will be? But I bet it won't be either Eichel or Matthews. But like the song and dance above.

 

[sabrebuild]

Here is what he said

"But Eichel is the superior playmaker, will have more assists, making his wingers better. Which is an essential role for a Center."

He is arguing that because Eichel "Makes his wingers better", and he proves this by using assists, that he is more valuable as a center vs a goal scoring C.

I am saying this makes no sense and you can see this by applying the logic like I did with Bozak, but feel free to come up with your own.

I can try to do another example just showing how dumb it is to look at one stat only.

"Gardiner is wayyy better than Risto. Risto was -9 and Gardiner was +24!"

You could argue that isn't a fair way to evaluate them as their teams having different goals for/against, etc. However this is the same logic being used when saying his linemates at 5v5 shot super low %.

He is using assists without context to say he is better, and it makes no sense.

I could be wrong but my comment was related to a poster named zeke going off about assist totals, as you can see by the last ten posts.

That point was silly and factually incorrect.