Is Carey Price Overrated? Part II

[vfactor]

I am a Habs fan and I had lot of doubts on Price before last season. However, he really raised his level since. Consistency was always his problem. He seems to figure it out. I would say that Stephan Waite had a huge impact on Price success. One of the nicest acquisition from Habs recently.

 

[JoelWarlord]

Price is already an NHL veteran, gold medal winner, and consensus top 5/10 NHL goalie at an age when Lundqvist and Rinne were just breaking into the NHL.

Not overrated.

 

[Nynja*]

The Islanders would have probably won last night if Halak was in net.

Anyone can defeat Chad Johnson.

And just like Qbs goalies don't play against eachother any way.
Its amazing how overrated Price truly is.

So youre saying if Halak was in nets, he would have easily pitched a SO? Lol cmon, cause thats the only way "the Islanders would have won".

 

[Thenameless]

Let's see here. Price was asked to play for Team Canada (the best team in the world) in the Olympics. He plays well, and they win the Gold Medal in a shutout. In the playoffs earlier this year, he helps an average team to go farther into the playoffs than they should have.

He might have been overrated in previous years because he was so highly touted as a rookie, but I think he's coming around now. I'd say he gets fair credit now for how good he is/how well he performs.

 

[JustAHabFan]

The Islanders would have probably won last night if Halak was in net.

Anyone can defeat Chad Johnson.

And just like Qbs goalies don't play against eachother any way.
Its amazing how overrated Price truly is.

Absolutely not true. The first Habs goal was a screen shot through a lot of players. The second goal was a bang-bang play right in front of the net. The last goal was a beautiful tip in that no goalie could stop.

 

[Genghis Keon]

You have no clue how or why I rank these players. I answered a question that I did not have to answer. Im not sure why this is such a sensitive topic. anyway. Apparently some Montreal fans seem to get offended when you don't agree with their opinion. I'm not sure why? I don't think Price is too far off from being elite.
I guess if I'm a fan of Montreal I would choose Price over Luongo or Rask. IMO he isn't a better player than Rask or Luongo.
Its extremely difficult to make a case Price is better than Quick, Lundqvist, and Rinne.
At no time in Prices career has he ever been considered or ranked the best player at his position. He hasn't even won the Vezina trophy.

I think a lot of goalies are pretty close, at least statistically (it seems to be the nature of the position in the last few years). Here are the stats of all the goalies you mentioned over the last few years (stats courtesy of quanthockey):

Last 5 years:

Price GP-264 W-138 SV%-0.920
Rask GP-173 W-91 SV%-0.925
Luongo GP-217 W-116 SV%-0.921
Quick GP-244 W-129 SV%-0.919
Lundqvist GP-261 W-147 SV%-0.924
Rinne GP-233 W-123 SV%-0.922

Last 4 years:

Price GP-192 W-100 SV%-0.919
Rask GP-144 W-80 SV%-0.926
Luongo GP-157 W-78 SV%-0.919
Quick GP-183 W-94 SV%-0.919
Lundqvist GP-193 W-111 SV%-0.924
Rinne GP-169 W-90 SV%-0.919

Last 3 years:

Price GP-127 W-74 SV%-0.921
Rask GP-121 W-80 SV%-0.926
Luongo GP-157 W-69 SV%-0.919
Quick GP-114 W-59 SV%-0.913
Lundqvist GP-131 W-72 SV%-0.921
Rinne GP-96 W-47 SV%-0.916

Last 2 years:

Price GP-88 W-53 SV%-0.927
Rask GP-85 W-50 SV%-0.924
Luongo GP-82 W-38 SV%-0.921
Quick GP-77 W-41 SV%-0.918
Lundqvist GP-88 W-48 SV%-0.918
Rinne GP-53 W-32 SV%-0.920

 

[FrankMTL]

I think a lot of goalies are pretty close, at least statistically (it seems to be the nature of the position in the last few years). Here are the stats of all the goalies you mentioned over the last few years (stats courtesy of quanthockey):

Last 5 years:

Price GP-264 W-138 SV%-0.920
Rask GP-173 W-91 SV%-0.925
Luongo GP-217 W-116 SV%-0.921
Quick GP-244 W-129 SV%-0.919
Lundqvist GP-261 W-147 SV%-0.924
Rinne GP-233 W-123 SV%-0.922

Last 4 years:

Price GP-192 W-100 SV%-0.919
Rask GP-144 W-80 SV%-0.926
Luongo GP-157 W-78 SV%-0.919
Quick GP-183 W-94 SV%-0.919
Lundqvist GP-193 W-111 SV%-0.924
Rinne GP-169 W-90 SV%-0.919

Last 3 years:

Price GP-127 W-74 SV%-0.921
Rask GP-121 W-80 SV%-0.926
Luongo GP-157 W-69 SV%-0.919
Quick GP-114 W-59 SV%-0.913
Lundqvist GP-131 W-72 SV%-0.921
Rinne GP-96 W-47 SV%-0.916

Last 2 years:

Price GP-88 W-53 SV%-0.927
Rask GP-85 W-50 SV%-0.924
Luongo GP-82 W-38 SV%-0.921
Quick GP-77 W-41 SV%-0.918
Lundqvist GP-88 W-48 SV%-0.918
Rinne GP-53 W-32 SV%-0.920

Thanks for pulling out those stats! Very interesting.

 

[JustAHabFan]

I don't really care if people around here are saying Price was overrated or underrated. Price was winning/stealing games for my team and that's was the most important thing for me. Without Price, the Habs will not be in the playoff.

 

[Hasa92]

I have replied to this thread before but i do it again.

Before i said that Price seems to be overrated among Canadiens fans but he is at least among top 10 goalies in the world, maybe top 5.

Imo. There is 4 elite goalies in the league that are a notch level ahead of the others.
Those 4 goalies are (in no order) Rask, Lunqvist, Rinne & Quick.

Behind them are another group of goalies where Price is included, he might very well be the best of this group, thus making himself 5th. best in the world but that is all arguable.

Price is good, nobody can argue that and it seems likely that he will become an elite goalie in the league in the future, maybe the best goalie in the league someday? Maybe a Hall of Famer? Maybe... He just isn't there, yet.

The Olympic performance doesn't really count as an argument that he is ahead of the likes of Lunqvist and Rask, why? 1. Because it was a short tournament, 2. Lunqvist has a gold medal too as a nr.1 goalie from 2006 with great numbers and 3. Rask put up the same numbers as Price and in my opinion was clearly the best goalie in the 2014 Olympics AINEC.

Rask played behind Finlands defense that was mostly rookies, Price was playing behind the greatest offense & defense we have on the planet. Canada would have won the gold 9 times out of 10 with the same team expect for having any other Canadian goalie than price in net.

Finland would have gone nowhere without Rask, nowhere, even if all of our skaters that were injured would have played 9 times out of 10 we wouldn't have grabbed a medal without Rask (maybe if Rinne would have been healthy tho).

And Montreal isn't a borderline play-off team in the league, it's one of the best teams in the whole league, Price isn't dragging his team behind like some people are claiming him to do but he is one of the pieces off the puzzle that makes them good.

 

[JustAHabFan]

I have replied to this thread before but i do it again.

Before i said that Price seems to be overrated among Canadiens fans but he is at least among top 10 goalies in the world, maybe top 5.

Imo. There is 4 elite goalies in the league that are a notch level ahead of the others.
Those 4 goalies are (in no order) Rask, Lunqvist, Rinne & Quick.

Behind them are another group of goalies where Price is included, he might very well be the best of this group, thus making himself 5th. best in the world but that is all arguable.

Price is good, nobody can argue that and it seems likely that he will become an elite goalie in the league in the future, maybe the best goalie in the league someday? Maybe a Hall of Famer? Maybe... He just isn't there, yet.

The Olympic performance doesn't really count as an argument that he is ahead of the likes of Lunqvist and Rask, why? 1. Because it was a short tournament, 2. Lunqvist has a gold medal too as a nr.1 goalie from 2006 with great numbers and 3. Rask put up the same numbers as Price and in my opinion was clearly the best goalie in the 2014 Olympics AINEC.

Rask played behind Finlands defense that was mostly rookies, Price was playing behind the greatest offense & defense we have on the planet. Canada would have won the gold 9 times out of 10 with the same team expect for having any other Canadian goalie than price in net.

Finland would have gone nowhere without Rask, nowhere, even if all of our skaters that were injured would have played 9 times out of 10 we wouldn't have grabbed a medal without Rask (maybe if Rinne would have been healthy tho).

And Montreal isn't a borderline play-off team in the league, it's one of the best teams in the whole league, Price isn't dragging his team behind like some people are claiming him to do but he is one of the pieces off the puzzle that makes them good.

This tell me you know nothing about the Habs. Without Price the Habs would be a borderline playoff team and very likely not making the playoff.

 

[sandysan]

I don't really care if people around here are saying Price was overrated or underrated. Price was winning/stealing games for my team and that's was the most important thing for me. Without Price, the Habs will not be in the playoff.

I've been saying this exact thing sice the first thread. And as they don't give out hardware for " most underrated", the whole premise is moot at best.

Without carey price the habs are toast. without Carey price we are way closer to the bottom than the top. but someone will look at the first goal against ottawa and think that THAT is representative of his play.

We are at christmas and we have led in the first what 4 or 5 times this year.

 

[CaptainBenn]

This tell me you know nothing about the Habs. Without Price the Habs would be a borderline playoff team and very likely not making the playoff.

agree with you, Price is a beast hes the main reason they are doing so good

and hes better than rask (ainec) to me

 

[Habsawce]

Pierre McGuire said Price is, if not the best in the league, top 3. So given that everyone loves and respects Pierre it seems pretty conclusive to me

 

[Sant]

I have replied to this thread before but i do it again.

Before i said that Price seems to be overrated among Canadiens fans but he is at least among top 10 goalies in the world, maybe top 5.

Imo. There is 4 elite goalies in the league that are a notch level ahead of the others.
Those 4 goalies are (in no order) Rask, Lunqvist, Rinne & Quick.

Behind them are another group of goalies where Price is included, he might very well be the best of this group, thus making himself 5th. best in the world but that is all arguable.

Price is good, nobody can argue that and it seems likely that he will become an elite goalie in the league in the future, maybe the best goalie in the league someday? Maybe a Hall of Famer? Maybe... He just isn't there, yet.

The Olympic performance doesn't really count as an argument that he is ahead of the likes of Lunqvist and Rask, why? 1. Because it was a short tournament, 2. Lunqvist has a gold medal too as a nr.1 goalie from 2006 with great numbers and 3. Rask put up the same numbers as Price and in my opinion was clearly the best goalie in the 2014 Olympics AINEC.

Rask played behind Finlands defense that was mostly rookies, Price was playing behind the greatest offense & defense we have on the planet. Canada would have won the gold 9 times out of 10 with the same team expect for having any other Canadian goalie than price in net.

Finland would have gone nowhere without Rask, nowhere, even if all of our skaters that were injured would have played 9 times out of 10 we wouldn't have grabbed a medal without Rask (maybe if Rinne would have been healthy tho).

And Montreal isn't a borderline play-off team in the league, it's one of the best teams in the whole league, Price isn't dragging his team behind like some people are claiming him to do but he is one of the pieces off the puzzle that makes them good.

we could be. we have the players to be very good team, but we have incompetant coach. A coach who implement a horrible system of just strech passes and dump and chase. With the speed and skilled fowards that we have i cant for the life of me understand why we dont play a puck possesion style of hockey. we are in the top 10 in the league of most shots allowed per game and in the bottom 10 in shots for.

if we didnt have price, we would be out of a playoff spot.

 

[radicalcenter]

I have replied to this thread before but i do it again.

Before i said that Price seems to be overrated among Canadiens fans but he is at least among top 10 goalies in the world, maybe top 5.

Imo. There is 4 elite goalies in the league that are a notch level ahead of the others.
Those 4 goalies are (in no order) Rask, Lunqvist, Rinne & Quick.

Behind them are another group of goalies where Price is included, he might very well be the best of this group, thus making himself 5th. best in the world but that is all arguable.

Price is good, nobody can argue that and it seems likely that he will become an elite goalie in the league in the future, maybe the best goalie in the league someday? Maybe a Hall of Famer? Maybe... He just isn't there, yet.

The Olympic performance doesn't really count as an argument that he is ahead of the likes of Lunqvist and Rask, why? 1. Because it was a short tournament, 2. Lunqvist has a gold medal too as a nr.1 goalie from 2006 with great numbers and 3. Rask put up the same numbers as Price and in my opinion was clearly the best goalie in the 2014 Olympics AINEC.

Rask played behind Finlands defense that was mostly rookies, Price was playing behind the greatest offense & defense we have on the planet. Canada would have won the gold 9 times out of 10 with the same team expect for having any other Canadian goalie than price in net.

Finland would have gone nowhere without Rask, nowhere, even if all of our skaters that were injured would have played 9 times out of 10 we wouldn't have grabbed a medal without Rask (maybe if Rinne would have been healthy tho).

And Montreal isn't a borderline play-off team in the league, it's one of the best teams in the whole league, Price isn't dragging his team behind like some people are claiming him to do but he is one of the pieces off the puzzle that makes them good.

You obviously don't watch any habs games.

We've been outplayed in the first period of almost every single game we played so far this year. But we somehow more often than not end up winning the game. Why? Because Price keeps us in the game and the few games he did not, we got blown out.

Then in the second and the third period, the rest of the team slowly start to wake up , they score a goal or two and most of the time they know it's enough to at least go to OT or even win the game.

Habs without Price would be somewhere between the 14th or 20th position, and it's easy to see for anybody who watches the game.

 

[AllanMTL46]

I have replied to this thread before but i do it again.

Before i said that Price seems to be overrated among Canadiens fans but he is at least among top 10 goalies in the world, maybe top 5.

Imo. There is 4 elite goalies in the league that are a notch level ahead of the others.
Those 4 goalies are (in no order) Rask, Lunqvist, Rinne & Quick.

Behind them are another group of goalies where Price is included, he might very well be the best of this group, thus making himself 5th. best in the world but that is all arguable.

Price is good, nobody can argue that and it seems likely that he will become an elite goalie in the league in the future, maybe the best goalie in the league someday? Maybe a Hall of Famer? Maybe... He just isn't there, yet.

The Olympic performance doesn't really count as an argument that he is ahead of the likes of Lunqvist and Rask, why? 1. Because it was a short tournament, 2. Lunqvist has a gold medal too as a nr.1 goalie from 2006 with great numbers and 3. Rask put up the same numbers as Price and in my opinion was clearly the best goalie in the 2014 Olympics AINEC.

Rask played behind Finlands defense that was mostly rookies, Price was playing behind the greatest offense & defense we have on the planet. Canada would have won the gold 9 times out of 10 with the same team expect for having any other Canadian goalie than price in net.

Finland would have gone nowhere without Rask, nowhere, even if all of our skaters that were injured would have played 9 times out of 10 we wouldn't have grabbed a medal without Rask (maybe if Rinne would have been healthy tho).

And Montreal isn't a borderline play-off team in the league, it's one of the best teams in the whole league, Price isn't dragging his team behind like some people are claiming him to do but he is one of the pieces off the puzzle that makes them good.

How is Rask any better than Price? He's won with a great team. Price IS the Canadiens. I look at your top 4 and I don't get why Price can't be amongst those guys?

Ask the 30 GMs to take any goalie they want to build their team around, and I bet 25 of them take Price, and I'm serious.

These haters ... It's ridiculous, guy is an elite goalie, that's it.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Because its coming from a Non-Habs fan without an agenda who shall be objective I will pay closer attention to Price this year.
I respect an outsiders opinion.

Do you respect statistics?

Already posted his stats since 2011. Here's a look at him over the past two years.

Since last year taking 55 games played as a minimum, Price is:

#1 in save percentage
#1 in GPS
Tied for 2nd in wins
Gold medal winning goalie in Olympics

I don't see how this guy isn't top five at the very least. And you could make a good case for him being the best goalie in the world now.

 

[Frank Drebin]

You have no clue how or why I rank these players. I answered a question that I did not have to answer. Im not sure why this is such a sensitive topic. anyway. Apparently some Montreal fans seem to get offended when you don't agree with their opinion. I'm not sure why? I don't think Price is too far off from being elite.
I guess if I'm a fan of Montreal I would choose Price over Luongo or Rask. IMO he isn't a better player than Rask or Luongo.
Its extremely difficult to make a case Price is better than Quick, Lundqvist, and Rinne.
At no time in Prices career has he ever been considered or ranked the best player at his position. He hasn't even won the Vezina trophy.

I'd like to see you explain why Rinne and Quick are better than Price without changing your logic between the two. i

 

[Frank Drebin]

Because its coming from a Non-Habs fan without an agenda who shall be objective I will pay closer attention to Price this year.
I respect an outsiders opinion.

Good idea!

 

[Brooklanders*]

So youre saying if Halak was in nets, he would have easily pitched a SO? Lol cmon, cause thats the only way "the Islanders would have won".

That is not at all true or what I'm saying.
This doesn't even prove the point.
Halak didn't even play last night so how did Price beat him?

 

[Brooklanders*]

I have replied to this thread before but i do it again.

Before i said that Price seems to be overrated among Canadiens fans but he is at least among top 10 goalies in the world, maybe top 5.

Imo. There is 4 elite goalies in the league that are a notch level ahead of the others.
Those 4 goalies are (in no order) Rask, Lunqvist, Rinne & Quick.

Behind them are another group of goalies where Price is included, he might very well be the best of this group, thus making himself 5th. best in the world but that is all arguable.

Price is good, nobody can argue that and it seems likely that he will become an elite goalie in the league in the future, maybe the best goalie in the league someday? Maybe a Hall of Famer? Maybe... He just isn't there, yet.

The Olympic performance doesn't really count as an argument that he is ahead of the likes of Lunqvist and Rask, why? 1. Because it was a short tournament, 2. Lunqvist has a gold medal too as a nr.1 goalie from 2006 with great numbers and 3. Rask put up the same numbers as Price and in my opinion was clearly the best goalie in the 2014 Olympics AINEC.

Rask played behind Finlands defense that was mostly rookies, Price was playing behind the greatest offense & defense we have on the planet. Canada would have won the gold 9 times out of 10 with the same team expect for having any other Canadian goalie than price in net.

Finland would have gone nowhere without Rask, nowhere, even if all of our skaters that were injured would have played 9 times out of 10 we wouldn't have grabbed a medal without Rask (maybe if Rinne would have been healthy tho).

And Montreal isn't a borderline play-off team in the league, it's one of the best teams in the whole league, Price isn't dragging his team behind like some people are claiming him to do but he is one of the pieces off the puzzle that makes them good.

This is pretty much how I feel.

 

[Nynja*]

How is Rask any better than Price? He's won with a great team.

Not to nitpick, but, that year the Bruins won the cup, Rask played a total of zero playoff games. So his ring is for being the backup goaltender.

 

[Nynja*]

That is not at all true or what I'm saying.
This doesn't even prove the point.
Halak didn't even play last night so how did Price beat him?

Price let in one goal yesterday. You said, and I quote, "The Islanders would have probably won last night if Halak was in net.", which means you're directly implying Halak would have shut the habs out, because the only way to win when your team scores one goal, is to let zero in (barring going past regulation time). Its not difficult mathematics: 1 > 0

 

[Brooklanders*]

Good idea!

Exactly. It's common knowledge that fans of good/great players tend to overate those guys. From what I have seen this is more abundant when they play for the team they support.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I have replied to this thread before but i do it again.

Before i said that Price seems to be overrated among Canadiens fans but he is at least among top 10 goalies in the world, maybe top 5.

Imo. There is 4 elite goalies in the league that are a notch level ahead of the others.
Those 4 goalies are (in no order) Rask, Lunqvist, Rinne & Quick.

Behind them are another group of goalies where Price is included, he might very well be the best of this group, thus making himself 5th. best in the world but that is all arguable.

Price is good, nobody can argue that and it seems likely that he will become an elite goalie in the league in the future, maybe the best goalie in the league someday? Maybe a Hall of Famer? Maybe... He just isn't there, yet.

The Olympic performance doesn't really count as an argument that he is ahead of the likes of Lunqvist and Rask, why? 1. Because it was a short tournament, 2. Lunqvist has a gold medal too as a nr.1 goalie from 2006 with great numbers and 3. Rask put up the same numbers as Price and in my opinion was clearly the best goalie in the 2014 Olympics AINEC.

Rask played behind Finlands defense that was mostly rookies, Price was playing behind the greatest offense & defense we have on the planet. Canada would have won the gold 9 times out of 10 with the same team expect for having any other Canadian goalie than price in net.

Finland would have gone nowhere without Rask, nowhere, even if all of our skaters that were injured would have played 9 times out of 10 we wouldn't have grabbed a medal without Rask (maybe if Rinne would have been healthy tho).

And Montreal isn't a borderline play-off team in the league, it's one of the best teams in the whole league, Price isn't dragging his team behind like some people are claiming him to do but he is one of the pieces off the puzzle that makes them good.

So Rask is great because in a "short tournament" he put up great numbers behind a not so great team?

Why don't you do the same thing for their NHL numbers then? Why wouldn't you factor in that Rask has spent most of his career behind one of the best defenses in the league while Price has played behind mostly bad clubs?

Hilarious that you raise this for Finland vs Canada but not for Boston vs Montreal...

As for Montreal being a bordeline playoff team - they absolutely would've been without Price behind them. Consistently outshot both last year and this year. Rask has never been behind that kind of D until now and it's no coincidence that he's now struggling.