I was going to give a big breakdown, but it comes down to two words: Alex Pietrangelo

[nuck]

With the flat cap. Unless Pietra signs for 800K-1mil for a year. There is no way Leafs could sign him without trading both Marner and Willie.
To say TEAMS will just take on Kerfoot, Kap and AJ without any salaries coming back is a bit unrealistic. Even if that is the case, and Leafs somehow finds THREE players who are decent and fill in their spots at 800K each, the Leafs will only get around 7.5mil cap space.
I highly doubt any teams is willing to take Marner and/or Willie without any players with more than league min coming back.
Ducks and Kings seem like an option but that will depend on Kesler(LTIR or coming back) and league allowing buyout(Carter or Brown).
The good thing for Dubas and Leafs is that for the first time in a while, may due to COVID and the flat cap, or just disappointment after the playin, there are a lot of teams looking for retool, Preds, Wilds, Pens, Oilers, Flames, Jets, Panthers, Caps and even BJs (since they can't get pass 2nd round).

For arguements sake, say the Leafs deal Kerfoot and Willie,thats $10.5M. If they sign AP for $9.5M and Jumbo for $1M thats the $10.5 gone, but still have RWs for the top 6. The hypothetical Wings deal was Kerf for picks. If they were able to deal Willie for futures only, how much do they need to save elsewhere to put them under cap? I thought they had around $2M to give raises to Dermott and Mikh and that was it. Legit question, I am not clear on their other obligations.

Is the money expected to come back on a Willie trade the issue to fitting under the cap?

 

[Gabriel426]

For arguements sake, say the Leafs deal Kerfoot and Willie,thats $10.5M. If they sign AP for $9.5M and Jumbo for $1M thats the $10.5 gone, but still have RWs for the top 6. The hypothetical Wings deal was Kerf for picks. If they were able to deal Willie for futures only, how much do they need to save elsewhere to put them under cap? I thought they had around $2M to give raises to Dermott and Mikh and that was it. Legit question, I am not clear on their other obligations.

Is the money expected to come back on a Willie trade the issue to fitting under the cap?

Only if Spezza, Jumbo, Dermott and Soup all signed for 1mil plus teams trading picks for both Willie and Kerfoot would work and Pietra signing for 9.5mil
And thats running with
Hyman-AM-Marner
AJ-JT-Kap
Robertson-Jumbo-Soup
Engvall-Spezza-Barabanov
Petan due to his sal

Reilly-Pietra
Muz-Holl
Dermott-Sandin/Rosen/Letholen(two of the three).

Pietra will help a lot but the defense is still not good due to the unknown in the 3rd pairings plus the forwards is not as good as this year.
They might play better defense but if they still can't score, they won't go anywhere.

BALANCE is the word that literally everyone is using when it comes to teams still in the playoffs.

If Pietra comes at 9.5mil, thats great but it would be best if Leafs actually trade both Marner and Willie in order to make that happen. Not only does it free up space for Pietra, it also will free up space for another Dman and another forward.

Having said all that, I don't it happening due to cap space and lack of trade partners for guys like Willie and Marner.

 

[Hclass47]

Even if you make cap space to sign him you it will end up costing some combination of Anderson, Reilly, Hyman, Marner as 3 of them will need raises while the last providers the most cap space

 

[johnnybbadd]

Leafs are already tied up big time money wise. Getting Pietrangelo can only happen if Marner or Nylander are being traded. A deal involving those players is very complex without substantial money coming back the other way. More teams are searching for cap relief than the other way around. I would have loved Pietro on the Leafs but I don’t see a realistic path for that to happen.

 

[Gabriel426]

Leafs are already tied up big time money wise. Getting Pietrangelo can only happen if Marner or Nylander are being traded. A deal involving those players is very complex without substantial money coming back the other way. More teams are searching for cap relief than the other way around. I would have loved Pietro on the Leafs but I don’t see a realistic path for that to happen.

No doubt about it.
I think buyout and LTIR will play a huge factor in Leafs being able to sign Pietra.
For example if Kesler really calls it a career, would Ducks interest in trading Kesler's cap hit with Manson plus 1st rounder for Marner? Then Leafs trade Willie to Preds for Picks and prospects since they will have cap room. It will free up enough space for Leafs to sign Pietra for 9.5mil as as well as signing a UFA fwd like Toffellei at 4.25mil.

 

[ToneDog]

No doubt about it.
I think buyout and LTIR will play a huge factor in Leafs being able to sign Pietra.
For example if Kesler really calls it a career, would Ducks interest in trading Kesler's cap hit with Manson plus 1st rounder for Marner? Then Leafs trade Willie to Preds for Picks and prospects since they will have cap room. It will free up enough space for Leafs to sign Pietra for 9.5mil as as well as signing a UFA fwd like Toffellei at 4.25mil.

That proposed trade would get Dubas fired as soon as he proposed it to Shanny. We gave up a first to dump 1 year of Marleau so that trade is pretty much Manson for Marner and that is not happening soon.

 

[Leafs87]

Not a fan of star UFA price tags. Great player and just what we need, If he takes 8-9 sure. If not thanks for considering us

 

[nuck]

Leafs are already tied up big time money wise. Getting Pietrangelo can only happen if Marner or Nylander are being traded. A deal involving those players is very complex without substantial money coming back the other way. More teams are searching for cap relief than the other way around. I would have loved Pietro on the Leafs but I don’t see a realistic path for that to happen.

It can't be a cap team they trade Marner to, it needs to be a building team that has or will make the space for him. So has he already received his second signing bonus? That would mean a trading partner owes him just $700k for next season right? About $7M per over the next 5 years or am I missing something? I think there would be a lineup of teams interested in him for $7M per year. Willie then at $5.125M in real money.

 

[Gabriel426]

That proposed trade would get Dubas fired as soon as he proposed it to Shanny. We gave up a first to dump 1 year of Marleau so that trade is pretty much Manson for Marner and that is not happening soon.

It is Manson plus 1st rounder and LTIR Kesler for Marner.
Secondly, I was making an example.
Personally, Manson is 28 yrs old. The exact same age Muz was traded to the Leafs. Although Manson is RHD, Muz was and still is a better Dman than Manson on and off the ice with his intangibles. I know people here like to propose Willie for Manson...but I think Manson value is and should be in line with Muz. Pretty much AJ/Kerfoot plus a prospect in the CHL and someone like Petan or Bracco.

 

[ToneDog]

It is Manson plus 1st rounder and LTIR Kesler for Marner.
Secondly, I was making an example.
Personally, Manson is 28 yrs old. The exact same age Muz was traded to the Leafs. Although Manson is RHD, Muz was and still is a better Dman than Manson on and off the ice with his intangibles. I know people here like to propose Willie for Manson...but I think Manson value is and should be in line with Muz. Pretty much AJ/Kerfoot plus a prospect in the CHL and someone like Petan or Bracco.

The way I see it, Kesler's LTIR cancels out the 1st so it is Manson for Marner. Manson would be a good pickup but not for Marner IMO.

 

[Gabriel426]

The way I see it, Kesler's LTIR cancels out the 1st so it is Manson for Marner. Manson would be a good pickup but not for Marner IMO.

I see your point now.
Manson is not a good pickup for Marner or Willie, as I stated, Manson is the same age as Muz and the package for him should not be better than the one for Muz.

 

[johnnybbadd]

No doubt about it.
I think buyout and LTIR will play a huge factor in Leafs being able to sign Pietra.
For example if Kesler really calls it a career, would Ducks interest in trading Kesler's cap hit with Manson plus 1st rounder for Marner? Then Leafs trade Willie to Preds for Picks and prospects since they will have cap room. It will free up enough space for Leafs to sign Pietra for 9.5mil as as well as signing a UFA fwd like Toffellei at 4.25mil.

Look at how many moving parts there are for something like that to happen. Another thing to consider is that there will be teams that won’t take salary back. Even if the Leafs pay this years signing bonus the team acquiring him still has to pay him 35 million dollars in real cash over the next 5 years. It’s still a very substantial investment to budget teams and I hope the Leafs aren’t going to just give Marner away either so we are also talking about giving up futures and taking a substantial amount of cash. Not easy at all.

 

[Pucker77]

It can't be a cap team they trade Marner to, it needs to be a building team that has or will make the space for him. So has he already received his second signing bonus? That would mean a trading partner owes him just $700k for next season right? About $7M per over the next 5 years or am I missing something? I think there would be a lineup of teams interested in him for $7M per year. Willie then at $5.125M in real money.


View attachment 362894

The Devils are the team with the most cap space right now with $7 mil, which means no team can take on Marner without getting rid of salary in some way. So real cash or not, the Leafs will have to bring money back in any Marner deal.

Because of that, I highly doubt Pietrangelo is a realistic target. The defense gets better, but the offense becomes a one line team. One of Matthews or Tavares will have to carry a line big time. Plus the team gets older and there continues to be no cap space for future improvements.

 

[Legion34]

Thats sort of my thought. None of the "my goal is to remain a Blue" or the stuff like Doughty said about his pending UFA status. “I always wanted to be an L.A. King and I want to stay an L.A. King”. It was all about whats best for his family, and hers are in Stl and his are GTA so that doesn't automatically suggest a 3rd club has an inside track.

yep imagine 4 years from now matthews was interviewed going into the playoffs. He goes on spittin chiclets and says how much of a dream it is to play in Arizona, and how his close childhood friend left to live out that dream. How his family was bugging him to sign in Arizona.

he did that for a reason. It’s either leverage to sign with blues or letting dubas know..... it’s insane he didn’t catch heat for it

 

[Dale Gribble]

Pietrangelo is a good d man, and he was what the team should be looking for, but the term and AAV would be too much for a guy that much sooner rather than later (like Tavares) will slow down, and that's not something the Leafs need right now. Too many bad contracts as is in Toronto. If the Leafs can, I think they should look to move Tavares and Marner, and get the help they need that way.

 

[Leafs87]

I wouldn’t post this on the main board to look like “that leafs fan” but I think Petro really wants to come home. Especially after his interview with Carlo. The leafs can offer him a lower cap but guaranteed money through SB. Now that the leafs have a good team, we could see more player electing to come home. Toronto is a great place to live and the GTA is an amazing place to raise a family. Few places can offer as much. Plus if Petro wants his kids following in his footsteps, the GTA and OHL are second to none.

 

[Its not your fault]

With the flat cap. Unless Pietra signs for 800K-1mil for a year. There is no way Leafs could sign him without trading both Marner and Willie.
To say TEAMS will just take on Kerfoot, Kap and AJ without any salaries coming back is a bit unrealistic. Even if that is the case, and Leafs somehow finds THREE players who are decent and fill in their spots at 800K each, the Leafs will only get around 7.5mil cap space.
I highly doubt any teams is willing to take Marner and/or Willie without any players with more than league min coming back.
Ducks and Kings seem like an option but that will depend on Kesler(LTIR or coming back) and league allowing buyout(Carter or Brown).
The good thing for Dubas and Leafs is that for the first time in a while, may due to COVID and the flat cap, or just disappointment after the playin, there are a lot of teams looking for retool, Preds, Wilds, Pens, Oilers, Flames, Jets, Panthers, Caps and even BJs (since they can't get pass 2nd round).

Hope you didn't spend along time on that.

 

[Its not your fault]

I wouldn’t post this on the main board to look like “that leafs fan” but I think Petro really wants to come home. Especially after his interview with Carlo. The leafs can offer him a lower cap but guaranteed money through SB. Now that the leafs have a good team, we could see more player electing to come home. Toronto is a great place to live and the GTA is an amazing place to raise a family. Few places can offer as much. Plus if Petro wants his kids following in his footsteps, the GTA and OHL are second to none.

Depending on how things play out in the next year. Some might want there family's in our health care system. Sure they can afford 100s dollar health care. Athletes are only going to make money for 10 to 15 years. There's also alot of social unrest that just doesn't come with you living in Canada.

 

[Gabriel426]

I wouldn’t post this on the main board to look like “that leafs fan” but I think Petro really wants to come home. Especially after his interview with Carlo. The leafs can offer him a lower cap but guaranteed money through SB. Now that the leafs have a good team, we could see more player electing to come home. Toronto is a great place to live and the GTA is an amazing place to raise a family. Few places can offer as much. Plus if Petro wants his kids following in his footsteps, the GTA and OHL are second to none.

Can’t wait for the those let’s follow Leafs Private Jet thread and the minute by minute update of where the plane is heading.

 

[Gabriel426]

Hope you didn't spend along time on that.

Just a few mins here and there where watching the news about COVID.

 

[Its not your fault]

Just a few mins here and there where watching the news about COVID.

It was very in depth don't agree with all of it but you did state things to think about and most of what you said will transpire.

 

[Gabriel426]

It was very in depth don't agree with all of it but you did state things to think about and most of what you said will transpire.

Thanks.

 

[7even]

I wouldn’t post this on the main board to look like “that leafs fan” but I think Petro really wants to come home. Especially after his interview with Carlo. The leafs can offer him a lower cap but guaranteed money through SB. Now that the leafs have a good team, we could see more player electing to come home. Toronto is a great place to live and the GTA is an amazing place to raise a family. Few places can offer as much. Plus if Petro wants his kids following in his footsteps, the GTA and OHL are second to none.

The Big 3 Adventures would suggest that that's worth jack shit

 

[TheDoldrums]

I wouldn’t post this on the main board to look like “that leafs fan” but I think Petro really wants to come home. Especially after his interview with Carlo. The leafs can offer him a lower cap but guaranteed money through SB. Now that the leafs have a good team, we could see more player electing to come home. Toronto is a great place to live and the GTA is an amazing place to raise a family. Few places can offer as much. Plus if Petro wants his kids following in his footsteps, the GTA and OHL are second to none.

I don't think it will happen, but I do wonder if Covid makes the appeal of coming home a little stronger. Maybe players start to prioritize family time a little more, or just want to be closer with more uncertainty in the world.

 

[Gabriel426]

The Big 3 Adventures would suggest that that's worth jack shit

Just playing along. If The rumour of SJ offer to JT was really 13mil and JT took 2 mil less to join the Leafs. Then if Pietra pulls a JT, would that mean he will also take 2mil less than the best offer to come home. If that’s the case and the best offer for Pietra is 10mil, that would be Leafs can sign Pietra at 8mil. Lol