LeBrun: "I think you're talking Johnsson or Kapanen" for a RHD with term

[Homesick]

2nd pairing RHD > 2nd line wingers

 

[Hierso]

If you use Dumba as trade bait i would target a larger fish. I remember that many Vancouver fans threw out Boeser last year in a 1-for-1 trade. Not sure if the offer still stands.

 

[Fatass]

2nd pairing RHD > 2nd line wingers

Second pair D are more valued than 3rd line wingers. IMO neither if the two Leafs suggested here are top six wingers. IMO both are good middle six players.

 

[NextYear67]

No lol

Yes lol

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Yes lol

Just like Nylander was $2 million overpaid last year. These things have a way of correcting themselves.

 

[WTG]

Those would be excellent comparables if they were actually comparable. Except both score at about half the rate of Kapanen at the same age and are probably in a lower skill bracket as well.

They are all the same age and all of them are comparable in scoring.
Virtanen and Gaudette are pretty damn good comparables.

Gaudette pace: 43 pts 15 goals
Virtanen pace: 50 pts 23 goals
Kapanen pace: 46 pts 16 goals

All of them are 23. Gaudette being the youngest.
Leafs are the 2nd highest-scoring team in the NHL. Kapanen can barely outscore the Canucks 3rd line center while playing with Tavares.

Neither Gaudette or Virtanen gets you a top 4 RHD with term and at a good age. Leafs fans are delusional if they think that Kapanen can get net that.

 

[Robtom18]

Leafs Lunch: February 5th, 2020 - Hour 1 (~38:35)

Johnson: "... to acquire a guy [a right shot defensemen] with term... Is that a Kapanen? Is that Johnsson? Is that a Kerfoot? What would the Leafs have to consider to give up to get one of the guys you mentioned, a Dumba or a Manson or somebody of that ilk?"

LeBrun: "I think you're talking Johnsson or Kapanen... I was talking to a team today that is very high on Kapanen."

Thanks to @Big Daddy Cane for providing the actual quotes.

These analyst just throw nuff at a wall and see if it sticks. Just like Friedman and all the others. Last time I said that leafs were for sure getting petro from stl lol. Because a guy talked sideways about a possibility. If we took every single rumor and matched it with those that came true bet you get less than 5% accuracy

 

[Digitalbooya]

If you use Dumba as trade bait i would target a larger fish. I remember that many Vancouver fans threw out Boeser last year in a 1-for-1 trade. Not sure if the offer still stands.

I consider a Boeser swap. I don’t even think twice about declining a deal around Kapanen or Johnsson.

 

[PuckInTheNards]

Kap or Johnsson for Dumba? That makes the Wild worse now and going forward. Absolutely no reason to trade Dumba right now.

 

[Tripod]

Leafs should have traded for Gudas last year like a bunch of us talked about a lot.

 

[Cotton]

Leafs should have traded for Gudas last year like a bunch of us talked about a lot.

Sounds like a Dubas kinda player alright.

 

[ponder]

Kapanen is on pace to score 46 points over 82 on the highest-scoring team in the league.
Gets to play with Marner/Tavares/Matthews/Nylander.


Canucks comparables to Kapanen would be Virtanen and Gaudette. I don't see how those guys land a top 4 RHD under 26 with term. There would have to be an add.

But Kappy DOESN'T get to play with Marner/Tavares/Matthews/Nylander. Marner and Nylander are our top 2 RWs, which means Kappy plays almost exclusively on the 3rd line at ES. PKs a lot too, does get PP time, but never on the 1st unit (which is the 4 star forwards and a D, Barrie recently, Rielly before). Kappy was tried briefly at LW this season, but he’s not an LW, looked out of sorts and quickly moved back to 3rd line RW.

He’d play in the top 6 on plenty of teams though. He’s a truly elite skater, one of the absolute best in the league, with good hands and a good shot. Solid size, decently physical, quite good defensively. 23 years old and improving at a good pace. Puts up 40-50 points despite playing on the 3rd line, I’m sure there are plenty of teams thinking “we don’t have Marner/Nylander blocking the top 2 RW spots, he’d play in our top 6 and get more PP time too, could be a 60+ point guy for us.”

He’s way, WAY more talented than Virtanen or Gaudette.

 

[WTG]

But Kappy DOESN'T get to play with Marner/Tavares/Matthews/Nylander. Marner and Nylander are our top 2 RWs, which means Kappy plays almost exclusively on the 3rd line at ES. PKs a lot too, does get PP time, but never on the 1st unit (which is the 4 star forwards and a D, Barrie recently, Rielly before). Kappy was tried briefly at LW this season, but he’s not an LW, looked out of sorts and quickly moved back to 3rd line RW.

He’d play in the top 6 on plenty of teams though. He’s a truly elite skater, one of the absolute best in the league, with good hands and a good shot. Solid size, decently physical, quite good defensively. 23 years old and improving at a good pace. Puts up 40-50 points despite playing on the 3rd line, I’m sure there are plenty of teams thinking “we don’t have Marner/Nylander blocking the top 2 RW spots, he’d play in our top 6 and get more PP time too, could be a 60+ point guy for us.”

He’s way, WAY more talented than Virtanen or Gaudette.

Doubt it.
If he was, he wouldn't be putting up similar numbers.

Virtanen is physical, great straight-line speed, good defensively, puts up more goals, 23 and still improving. All of those things you said, I can describe Virtanen as too.

 

[ponder]

Doubt it.
If he was, he wouldn't be putting up similar numbers.

Virtanen is physical, great straight-line speed, good defensively, puts up more goals, 23 and still improving. All of those things you said, I can describe Virtanen as too.

I’ve lived in Vancouver the last 16 years, the Nucks are one of my favourite teams, I watch Virtanen a lot. I really like his strength and physicality, and he’s definitely young and improving, has taken a huge step forward this year. But skill/talent wise, he’s not overly close to Kappy. Virtanen is a good skater but Kappy is much better, he’s elite, one of the best skaters in the league. Kappy has better hands and better hockey IQ too. Their shots are similar.

I think Virtanen and Kappy have similar trade value, as Virtanen has that power forward game, big edge on Kappy in terms of strength and physicality, which is very valuable. But Kappy has an equally big edge in skill. If he gets dealt to a team with less RW depth, where he’s a fixture in the top 6, don’t be surprised if he starts putting up 60+ point seasons.

 

[WTG]

I’ve lived in Vancouver the last 16 years, the Nucks are one of my favourite teams, I watch Virtanen a lot. I really like his strength and physicality, and he’s definitely young and improving, has taken a huge step forward this year. But skill/talent wise, he’s not overly close to Kappy. Virtanen is a good skater but Kappy is much better, he’s elite, one of the best skaters in the league. Kappy has better hands and better hockey IQ too. Their shots are similar.

I think Virtanen and Kappy have similar trade value, as Virtanen has that power forward game, big edge on Kappy in terms of strength and physicality, which is very valuable. But Kappy has an equally big edge in skill. If he gets dealt to a team with less RW depth, where he’s a fixture in the top 6, don’t be surprised if he starts putting up 60+ point seasons.

We can have disagreements, but this is where I agree.

Virtanen and Kapanen have around the same trade value. For different reasons, Kapanen more of a skilled guy, Virtanen more of a power forward that can play up and down the lineup. I do not think that Virtanen gets you a top 4 RHD with term and reasonably aged. When going for a guy like Dumba, you need to be willing to give up a Boeser like player.

Much like Virtanen, I do not think Kapanen is a proven comodity.

 

[ponder]

We can have disagreements, but this is where I agree.

Virtanen and Kapanen have around the same trade value. For different reasons, Kapanen more of a skilled guy, Virtanen more of a power forward that can play up and down the lineup. I do not think that Virtanen gets you a top 4 RHD with term and reasonably aged. When going for a guy like Dumba, you need to be willing to give up a Boeser like player.

Much like Virtanen, I do not think Kapanen is a proven comodity.

I think Dumba has more value than Kappy or Virtanen, but definitely not as much value as Boeser. Dumba’s value is tough to judge - not long ago it would have been quite strong, but he had surgery for a torn pec last year, and has been having a rough year. You’d be trading for him hoping he bounces back, but that’s not a guarantee.

As for Manson, I think Kappy/Virtanen are right there with him value wise. He’s big, physical, and good defensively, but doesn’t bring much offensively. Stylistically he’s quite a good fit for Toronto’s needs. I can certainly see a Manson/Kappy or Manson/Johnsson deal going down.

 

[McClelland]

People are going to be surprised how much value he has.

- Name recognition and pedigree (1st round pick, NHL bloodlines, traded for Kessel)
- 23 with significant untapped potential (was overcooked in the AHL)
- Elite attributes (skating especially, hands/shot combo)
- Great PKer
- 45-50 point guy from the bottom six
- Cheap contract with term
- RFA (still) at the end of his current contract
- Right handed shot (can play both sides, but is better at RW)

There's a huge amount of control and potential with this player.


I give it less than half a season after he's traded before people start proclaiming Kapanen is a top line player.

He played most with AM and Kadri as C last season, 44 points isnt from bottom 6! has played around with JT,Marner,AM and Nylander mostly this season!

Hes a fast 3 liner who can keep up with top 6 pretty decent, his pk is pretty good due his speed!

2018-2019 ev strenght

28.62%	EV	KAPANEN,KASPERI - MARLEAU,PATRICK - MATTHEWS,AUSTON
25.49%	EV	KADRI,NAZEM - KAPANEN,KASPERI - MARLEAU,PATRICK
19.78%	EV	JOHNSSON,ANDREAS - KAPANEN,KASPERI - MATTHEWS,AUSTON
5.52%	EV	HYMAN,ZACH - KAPANEN,KASPERI - TAVARES,JOHN
3.12%	EV	KAPANEN,KASPERI - MATTHEWS,AUSTON - NYLANDER,WILLIA

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[jaric1862]

I think the leafs have pushed off a trade for a Dman now with the the Campbell+Clifford trade. Kapanen/Johnsson for a Dman is definitely an offseason move

 

[sittler rules!!!]

It seems like LeBrun has been speculating a lot on trades lately. He used to never do that.

ratings!!!

 

[Nizdizzle]

I think the leafs have pushed off a trade for a Dman now with the the Campbell+Clifford trade. Kapanen/Johnsson for a Dman is definitely an offseason move

Why do you believe the Campbell trade affects the likeliness of a D-man trade?

 

[jaric1862]

Why do you believe the Campbell trade affects the likeliness of a D-man trade?

More that they traded away Moore (a guy who plays in the top 9 in a pinch) and that there isn't much of a fit out there for Kapanen. The leafs depth up front won't be too great if they trade Kapanen (also if there is an injury)

 

[qqaz]

I have to disagree. I think every team has a Kapenen already. Are his points a function of him, or who he’s playing with? He doesn’t drive offence. He’s really not anything special.
IMO he is worth a bottom pair Dman.

Every team has a Kapanen? If by that you mean a 2nd line forward, then sure. But you need about 3 of those, and not every team does. You don't think a Team like Anaheim/Detroit/Buffalo could use a 20(ish) goal 50(ish) point scorer? I'll admit, not every team will need him, or value him super highly. But lots of teams might.

Andrew Shaw got a 2nd and 3rd last season. Marcus Johansson got a 2nd and 4th last season with similar career numbers. Ryan Hartman got a 1st rounder. Kyle Clifford and a backup goalie just got two 3rds plus (one could become a 2nd). Kapanen is worth less than Kyle Clifford?

Clifford: GP-53 G-6 A-8 P-14 TOI-11:42
Kapanen: GP-53 G-10 A-20 P-30 TOI-15:58

I don't think anyone can argue that Kapanen is worth less than a 2nd+3rd. I'd argue it's more than that.

Jake Muzzin went for a 1st and a prospect last season. Brnadon Montour went for a 1st and a prospect. Adam fox went for a 2nd and 3rd (hes fourth on the Rangers in time on ice this season).PK Subban went for two 2nds (struggling and overpaid, but the ceiling was a #1D).

It's not an exact science. But it is possible that the right deal comes along. Kapanen plus a little extra could land a top 4 D man.

 

[Halla]

He played most with AM and Kadri as C last season, 44 points isnt from bottom 6! has played around with JT,Marner,AM and Nylander mostly this season!

Hes a fast 3 liner who can keep up with top 6 pretty decent, his pk is pretty good due his speed!

2018-2019 ev strenght

28.62%	EV	KAPANEN,KASPERI - MARLEAU,PATRICK - MATTHEWS,AUSTON
25.49%	EV	KADRI,NAZEM - KAPANEN,KASPERI - MARLEAU,PATRICK
19.78%	EV	JOHNSSON,ANDREAS - KAPANEN,KASPERI - MATTHEWS,AUSTON
5.52%	EV	HYMAN,ZACH - KAPANEN,KASPERI - TAVARES,JOHN
3.12%	EV	KAPANEN,KASPERI - MATTHEWS,AUSTON - NYLANDER,WILLIA

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

he doesnt get PP time genius. How many 3rd liners in this league get 20+g/40+pts (Kappy is actally on pace for 47pts this year)

2nd line production

 

[Halla]

We can have disagreements, but this is where I agree.

Virtanen and Kapanen have around the same trade value. For different reasons, Kapanen more of a skilled guy, Virtanen more of a power forward that can play up and down the lineup. I do not think that Virtanen gets you a top 4 RHD with term and reasonably aged. When going for a guy like Dumba, you need to be willing to give up a Boeser like player.

Much like Virtanen, I do not think Kapanen is a proven comodity.

Kap has proven that he can get 20g and 40+pts. Virtnanen hasnt proven either of those. Kapanen has proven that he can be a 1st liner in the AHL...Virtanen couldnt even muster 20pts

nice on virtanen having a decent season but these guys arent the same

 

[janesy12]

More that they traded away Moore (a guy who plays in the top 9 in a pinch) and that there isn't much of a fit out there for Kapanen. The leafs depth up front won't be too great if they trade Kapanen (also if there is an injury)

You mean 13pts in 52 GP Trevor Moore?
Moore is a useful player, but come on, he wouldn't be a Kapanen replacement if we were to move Kap.