TV: Game of Thrones | Season 8 (Final) | Part IX -TV talk ONLY -NO Books, Spoilers, NO LEAKS

[Daisy Jane]

She didn't care about it. She wanted to go away with him. I thought that was made pretty obvious.

that's why her turning on him doesn't make sense.
She was mad. i get it
but like. ... to testify against him so he'd die and sleep with Tywin? that never ever maes sense to me.

Jon is honest and noble to a fault, which is why he commands so much respect and loyalty from people around him, but also why he's so vulnerable to scheming.

yuppers. the Starkness. lol.

 

[Eisen]

that's why her turning on him doesn't make sense.
She was mad. i get it
but like. ... to testify against him so he'd die and sleep with Tywin? that never ever maes sense to me.



yuppers. the Starkness. lol.

Without Tyrion, she is just a prostitute. And Tywin pays well, I assume.

 

[Siamese Dream]

Jon doesn't actually fit the plot armor trope.

He literally got brought back to life lol

 

[Blender]

He literally got brought back to life lol

That's not plot armor. He's literally protected by the Lord of Light in the universe, so it's not plot armor. Plot armor is when the rules of the universe bend specifically to save a character essential to the plot.

Plot armor is Arya with the Waif, Davos being the only survivor of an exploding ship, Jaime Lannister being saved at the last second when he charged at a dragon and not drowning (it is possible to swim in armor by the way, but he wasn't even concious), Ramsay Bolton being invincible in his battles even with no armor, Olly and Sam somehow being pretty much ignored during the battle at Castle Black, etc.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Without Tyrion, she is just a prostitute. And Tywin pays well, I assume.

wasn't Tyrion paying for a house and stuff?

 

[Eisen]

wasn't Tyrion paying for a house and stuff?

He offered, but she rejected it. In a way, she was very proud (and very confrontational). She didn't want to be hid, despite the consequences.

 

[Daisy Jane]

He offered, but she rejected it. In a way, she was very proud (and very confrontational). She didn't want to be hid, despite the consequences.

yah.
i think. in a way, the show simply dropped the ball on this.

like. i get that she was mad.
even if ppl want to play the "she was an idiot" card, i could sort of see it but i simply don't get how she went from zero to 60 like that.

i had to stop the re-watch.
Oberon's death is coming up, and i need to prepare for that.

 

[RandV]

yah.
i think. in a way, the show simply dropped the ball on this.

like. i get that she was mad.
even if ppl want to play the "she was an idiot" card, i could sort of see it but i simply don't get how she went from zero to 60 like that.

i had to stop the re-watch.
Oberon's death is coming up, and i need to prepare for that.

Yeah they dropped the ball, and the problem is they overplayed the character. There was a plot to be followed here: At the end of season 1 Tyrion finds a clever camp prostitute before battle who he decides to keep with him and eventually falls for. At the end of season 4, Shae would betray Tyrion first by testifying against and humiliating him in court, then of course that awkward moment getting got in Tywin's bed.

Those are the basic plot points that needed to be followed. In the 3 years in between though they chose to build up the character in a manner that was counter-intuitive to the needed end result.

 

[Siamese Dream]

That's not plot armor. He's literally protected by the Lord of Light in the universe, so it's not plot armor. Plot armor is when the rules of the universe bend specifically to save a character essential to the plot.

Plot armor is Arya with the Waif, Davos being the only survivor of an exploding ship, Jaime Lannister being saved at the last second when he charged at a dragon and not drowning (it is possible to swim in armor by the way, but he wasn't even concious), Ramsay Bolton being invincible in his battles even with no armor, Olly and Sam somehow being pretty much ignored during the battle at Castle Black, etc.

Oh come on, the Jon resurrection was so forced. Davos' line to Melisandre "You must know some... magic" was so cringey. Yes he's seen her birth the shadow baby but how could he possibly know it was possible to do that, and why does he even care? He barely knows Jon and how does he know Jon is that important, of course the viewer knows, but how does Davos know and why does he go through all that trouble for Jon? It's just very forced and convenient.

Going back all the way to the Hardholme episode, during that whole sequence I was genuinely terrified that Jon might be killed and come back as a White Walker and be a bad guy (or maybe even the WW are not evil) but later it becomes apparent he's indestructible Aragorn

 

[Player big P]

That's not plot armor. He's literally protected by the Lord of Light in the universe, so it's not plot armor. Plot armor is when the rules of the universe bend specifically to save a character essential to the plot.

Plot armor is Arya with the Waif, Davos being the only survivor of an exploding ship, Jaime Lannister being saved at the last second when he charged at a dragon and not drowning (it is possible to swim in armor by the way, but he wasn't even concious), Ramsay Bolton being invincible in his battles even with no armor, Olly and Sam somehow being pretty much ignored during the battle at Castle Black, etc.

Is it ever said that Davos is the only survivor from that ship? I can't remember, but it makes more sense to me that he's the only survivor from that ship that the audience knows or cares about, so there's really no need to show anyone else being alive who the audience would definitely not recognize or have any feelings towards.

 

[Blender]

Oh come on, the Jon resurrection was so forced. Davos' line to Melisandre "You must know some... magic" was so cringey. Yes he's seen her birth the shadow baby but how could he possibly know it was possible to do that, and why does he even care? He barely knows Jon and how does he know Jon is that important, of course the viewer knows, but how does Davos know and why does he go through all that trouble for Jon? It's just very forced and convenient.

Going back all the way to the Hardholme episode, during that whole sequence I was genuinely terrified that Jon might be killed and come back as a White Walker and be a bad guy (or maybe even the WW are not evil) but later it becomes apparent he's indestructible Aragorn

I agree the Davos part was sloppily written, but that isn't what plot armor is. You said Jon has plot armor, he doesn't, and is in fact the only character in the show that has an in universe reason for surviving typically deadly situations, other than Dany and fire.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

that's why her turning on him doesn't make sense.
She was mad. i get it
but like. ... to testify against him so he'd die and sleep with Tywin? that never ever maes sense to me.

The books make the situation much more vague, and I don't know why they did away with it.

I enjoyed her character in the books much more overall, actually.

 

[Daisy Jane]

The books make the situation much more vague, and I don't know why they did away with it.

I enjoyed her character in the books much more overall, actually.

my friend told me that too. (on both counts)

I know that the books are very divorced from the show now, but i can't wait until next year, so i can start reading.

 

[Blender]

Some scenes of Cersei or Tywin coercing her into going along with them may have gone a long way, but they went for the surprise at the trial instead.

 

[TheAngryHank]

Correct. Jon had his Stark moment too, he was just more fortunate than Robb.

By not betraying the Frey.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

Just watched the prologue for season 7 episode 1, where Arya poisons the Freys. Such an awesome scene but would of been so much better if we didnt see her kill Walder the prior season. The rat cook revenge was great and all but it really takes away from the scene knowing it was Arya wearing Walder's face. I think they should of scrapped the rat cook part, just had Arya complete the avenge the Red Wedding and mention the rat cook part in passing to Sansa or Jon

 

[Ainec]

I would love to see Jon or Dany die in the first episode and not mid-way

but that would be bad writing

plot armor into prophesied armor

feels bad

 

[Neutrinos]

Just watched the prologue for season 7 episode 1, where Arya poisons the Freys. Such an awesome scene but would of been so much better if we didnt see her kill Walder the prior season. The rat cook revenge was great and all but it really takes away from the scene knowing it was Arya wearing Walder's face. I think they should of scrapped the rat cook part, just had Arya complete the avenge the Red Wedding and mention the rat cook part in passing to Sansa or Jon

You know what really bothers me about Arya's powers is that somehow by taking Walder's face, she also grows a foot and a half taller

 

[glovesave_35]

You know what really bothers me about Arya's powers is that somehow by taking Walder's face, she also grows a foot and a half taller

And Jaqen H'Ghar was more than just a black face when she went to the temple on the little island. You didn't even mention the voice. The whole Faceless Men bit is just "accept it or don't" fantasy show stuff to me.

 

[Neutrinos]

And Jaqen H'Ghar was more than just a black face when she went to the temple on the little island. You didn't even mention the voice. The whole Faceless Men bit is just "accept it or don't" fantasy show stuff to me.

I omitted my issue with the voice since people are able to do impressions of others. People, however, aren't capable of growing 15 inches on a whim

 

[Player big P]

I would love to see Jon or Dany die in the first episode and not mid-way

but that would be bad writing

plot armor into prophesied armor

feels bad

I've been hoping for a while now that Dany would just like, fall off a horse and break her neck or some other such undignified, unimpressive death. We'd be well rid of that one.

 

[Blender]

And Jaqen H'Ghar was more than just a black face when she went to the temple on the little island. You didn't even mention the voice. The whole Faceless Men bit is just "accept it or don't" fantasy show stuff to me.

I just file it in the same category as dragons. It's some kind of magic, and is what it is. As long as it doesn't violate its own rules, I'm ok with it.

 

[peate]

Took a few months off and now I'm starting Season 6. Going slow. The Waif is so asking for it. Ramsey showing his gentler side...not. Danny has vanished.

 

[Habsfunk]

I omitted my issue with the voice since people are able to do impressions of others. People, however, aren't capable of growing 15 inches on a whim

People also aren't capable of peeling off their faces to reveal a completely different one underneath. Granted, it's more plausible than growing 15 inches taller, but it's still part of the realm of fantasy.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

You know what really bothers me about Arya's powers is that somehow by taking Walder's face, she also grows a foot and a half taller

Yeah. When we first saw Jaqen H'ghar all he changed was his face but his voice and physique stayed the same. Now its like they can become anyone. Arya can put on Ned or Littlefingers face and its like they never died