GDT: Free Agent Frenzy!

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

Good for Yak, hope he finds his game. He’s a guy I’d welcome back with open arms just for his attitude.

 

[Iracundia]

Surely you recognize the difference is far greater then just the points the two players provide right...

Not to mention 18 points isn't exactly accurate. Karlsson is a 75-80 point Dman. Barrie is a ~55 point Dman. Karlsson is the greatest Dman of our generation and quit possibly one of the greatest Dmen to ever play the game.



That said, I wouldn't give up that package you listed, but it also wont cost that much either. Especially if Barrie is included. They likely get one of those 3 pieces, and then a few smaller pieces. Or they get something like Barrie + Ottawa 1st but with nothing else added to the deal.

That package wasn't my offer just a combination of the expected pieces I think we would lose in getting him. I think we would lose Barrie + Ott pick + high end prospect (Makar, Timmons/Jost).
The 18 points is 100% accurate. That is the yearly difference between the two.
Stay away Joe, stay away!!!

 

[UncleRisto]

If they're going to trade for Karlsson, don't trade Barrie back. Either keep him or trade him for a forward.

 

[Raucherhusten]

If we get EK65 (which is most likely not going to happen) i can't see us keeping Barrie. He is either a part of the trade or will be traded soon after for a Top6 forward. EK would play up to 30m/game, EJ maybe 25. EK would also run our PP1, Girard PP2. There is simply no room/need for Barrie anymore and we will really need the cap space very soon assuming Barrie would be traded for someone like Skinner who probably will get Kane_ish money when he signs his next contract.

Also i think if there is a chance to get him we should do it even if he's more expensive as we might like. And not only because he's franchise player but also because he would attract others. I can almost see Panarin or Skinner losing their shit because of the possibility going for the cup with 2 of the 10 best players in the game today. Denver isn't the most attractive landing spot for FA's atm - Mac PLUS EK would change that.

 

[lonelybadger]

As much as I would love Karlsson I think it's more likely he goes to Vegas or Tampa.

Sakic should offersheet Stone. If it works boom second line fixed for AVS 1st, 2nd, 3rd. If it doesn't then Melnyk most likely watches stone walk in a year

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

If they're going to trade for Karlsson, don't trade Barrie back. Either keep him or trade him for a forward.

Agreed, ideally we get Karlsson without giving up Barrie and run with both of them on the team this year(It would mean IMO we legitimately have to go for it all this year tbh), and then next summer trade Barrie to the highest bidder.

That package wasn't my offer just a combination of the expected pieces I think we would lose in getting him. I think we would lose Barrie + Ott pick + high end prospect (Makar, Timmons/Jost).
The 18 points is 100% accurate. That is the yearly difference between the two.
Stay away Joe, stay away!!!

How is it accurate. Karlsson in a full season averages 75-80 points, he's exceeded the mark 3 separate times. Barrie's career year is 57 points and he's exceeded 50 points just twice.


We're talking about a ~50-55 point Dman compared to a 75-80 point Dman when both players are playing well. That's a massive, massive gap.


Yeah Joe, stay away from acquiring a generational Dman for significantly less then he's worth. Stay away...

 

[Ncit3]

Agreed, ideally we get Karlsson without giving up Barrie and run with both of them on the team this year(It would mean IMO we legitimately have to go for it all this year tbh), and then next summer trade Barrie to the highest bidder.




How is it accurate. Karlsson in a full season averages 75-80 points, he's exceeded the mark 3 separate times. Barrie's career year is 57 points and he's exceeded 50 points just twice.


We're talking about a ~50-55 point Dman compared to a 75-80 point Dman when both players are playing well. That's a massive, massive gap.


Yeah Joe, stay away from acquiring a generational Dman for significantly less then he's worth. Stay away...

Some people are stat readers. You can't see the difference in the two if you don't watch them. EK has such effortlessness in his game. Like he barely has to try. He sets people up for the easiest goals sometimes. The only reason I would be afraid of EK would be his injury history - which is starting to become a problem. With that said, I'd still take the risk. Signed long term, he'd be an immediate jersey buy. Been one of my favorite players in the league since he joined and would love to have him in the burgundy and blue.

 

[Echo Roku]

People are making the point comparison... but how is the defensive difference between the two? Not really familiar with EK’s defensive game myself

They are dmen after all

 

[Ncit3]

People are making the point comparison... but how is the defensive difference between the two? Not really familiar with EK’s defensive game myself

They are dmen after all

Underrated. People in the past have raved about his offensive game but said he's a defensively liability at times. I've never seen it be any problem at all when he's on the ice. He's great in all zones.

 

[Muffin]

I wouldn't trade more than Ottawa's 1st straight up for Karlsson. If they want the pick back that bad they can pay for it. You know that's a lottery pick with Karlsson gone.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

People are making the point comparison... but how is the defensive difference between the two? Not really familiar with EK’s defensive game myself

They are dmen after all

It's a pretty significant gap.

Barrie is average at best Defensively, and often times he's not even that good. Karlsson has the size and skating advantage so he doesn't struggle with big forwards on the forecheck at all, he has a better stick for getting into the lanes and because of his size does a better job in the front of the net.


Now Karlsson isn't exactly Drew Doughty or Victor Hedman in his own zone either. He is prone to miscues and poor reads from time to time. But they're not frequent by any means.


And here's the thing about Karlsson, he's so damn good offensively and at driving the play offensively that he rarely finds himself trapped in the Defensive zone any way. He's very quick at transitioning the puck out of the zone and so thus doesn't spend much time in his zone.

 

[Murzu]

Ott 1st + Timmins + Wilson + 2020 2nd for 11M x 8yrs Karlsson

Barrie for Marner

2019 1st + Ghetto for Skinner (signed or soon signed to 6+M x 6yrs contract)

E A Sports - It's in the game

 

[lonelybadger]

I don't think Ryan is worth 7.25 but he's better than at least 2 of the guys on the second line.

 

[Grigowski]

As much as I would love Karlsson I think it's more likely he goes to Vegas or Tampa.

After all he went through this year I wouldn´t choose Vegas for living. Tampa is great, but can they fit him under their cap without losing one of their star-forwards? If Yzerman can pull this off Tampa´s D will look scary! BUT, does Karlsson wanna live near Hoffmann and his girl or play against him at least 5 times a year (playoffs not included)? Or does EK just want a new start out west?

 

[lonelybadger]

After all he went through this year I wouldn´t choose Vegas for living. Tampa is great, but can they fit him under their cap without losing one of their star-forwards? If Yzerman can pull this off Tampa´s D will look scary! BUT, does Karlsson wanna live near Hoffmann and his girl or play against him at least 5 times a year (playoffs not included)? Or does EK just want a new start out west?

Tampa I can see getting him but it's a lot of GM work for Yzerman to pull of the subsequent trades and in reality he probably loses kucherov due to salary cap concerns unless he can unload Killorn + Callahan while keeping Sergachev in any trade.

I wouldn't mind the AVS getting in on a 3 way with Tampa if it meant Palat coming to the AVS.

 

[Piestany88]

People are making the point comparison... but how is the defensive difference between the two? Not really familiar with EK’s defensive game myself

They are dmen after all

EK has improved his defence over the years but last year he was awful defensively. He just wasn't the same player as pre injury.
Having said that it takes time for an injury like that to fully heal . In his case though , one has to wonder if he'll ever be the same.

Completely agree with what Pierce posted in years prior though . Last year just wasn't a great year in Ottawa anyway and with the broken dressing room stuff coming out , no doubt it affected his play

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I don't think Ryan is worth 7.25 but he's better than at least 2 of the guys on the second line.

Completely agree.


Health is a major concern for Ryan, and he's not worth 7.25M, but the on ice product isn't terrible by any means. He had 33 points in 62 games last year. A ~45 point pace over an 82 game season. The year before he wasn't as good with just 25 in 62 games, but before that he was a regular 55 point player.


Ryan has negative value, but he's a bit of a wild card. Give him a fresh start in a better organization, and I think he could play 70 games again and hit the 45 point mark.


My plan with Ryan would be to keep him around for 2 years as the 2nd line RW(Until Kaut is ready to take over). See if he cant bounce back and become a decent Top 9 forward again... Then in 2 years from now retain $2M salary on him and see if you cant get an asset for him from a team desperate for scoring help. A Bobby Ryan at 5.25M for 2 years coming off a couple of 45-50 point bounce back seasons stands a good chance at actually having value in the league.


Then you'd have turned a cap dump into positive value for the team, AND used him to help leverage a much more manageable deal on a franchise Dman to your team.

 

[RoyIsALegend]

Pierce, you are ignoring the injuries and complete unreliability attached to Bobby Ryan.

Also, he must be protected in an eventual expansion draft. That sucks.

 

[Freudian]

Avs would have to trade Barrie if they got EK. You can't have two similar players like EK and Barrie with a combined cap hit of $19M in the long run. Next year would obviously be fine since the combined cap hit is $12M but Barrie would be gone the summer of 2019 the latest.

That's why Barrie is a much better inclusion in a EK trade than Makar/Timmins are. If Ottawa wanted, they could flip Barrie for a haul.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Avs would have to trade Barrie if they got EK. You can't have two similar players like EK and Barrie with a combined cap hit of $19M in the long run. Next year would obviously be fine since the combined cap hit is $12M but Barrie would be gone the summer of 2019 the latest.

That's why Barrie is a much better inclusion in a EK trade than Makar/Timmins are. If Ottawa wanted, they could flip Barrie for a haul.

I’d rather keep Barrie out of an EK trade and then try and use him as trade bait for a 2C or top 6 forward. Try and kill 2 birds with 2 stones.

 

[Ivan13]

Pierce, you are ignoring the injuries and complete unreliability attached to Bobby Ryan.

Also, he must be protected in an eventual expansion draft. That sucks.

It seems I was wrong about that. Apparently, there is some language in his deal that suggests that the team doesn't need to protect him in the case of an expansion draft. Ottawa apparently didn't protect him in the last one.

 

[lonelybadger]

Pierce, you are ignoring the injuries and complete unreliability attached to Bobby Ryan.

Also, he must be protected in an eventual expansion draft. That sucks.

Bobby Ryan does not need to be protected in an expansion draft, his NMC clause is for AHL only. Ottawa exposed him.

My bad Ivan13 beat me too it.

If including Ryan means the 1st round pick changes from Sens to Avs or allows for some Hughes protection I am all for it.

Also this is why I still want De Haan.
Sign him, trade Nemeth and move Cole to the Right Side.

 

[Piestany88]

Probably in the wrong thread but since we are discussing it here . Avs are on this list

 

[henchman21]

Ott 1st + EJ for EK

 

[RoyIsALegend]

Gotta wonder if we are actually in it or just the obvious connection due to the 1st. I think everybody would love EK, but seeing them trade him elsewhere, crippling their team and us still having that 1st is almost better.