Flames 'New' Arena II - 'No it's yours, I insist'

[Janks]

Here I go again on my own, going down the only road I've ever known...

Yikes. That'll be an interesting topic

 

[GAMO1992]

here we go again....

 

[Flameshomer]

Thanks Jason Kenney!!

Imo this is potentially the only choice the city has funding wise. Provincial budget totally f***ed municipalities.

The flip side is that the lower corporate rate should have a dramatic impact on murray Edward's bottom line. He should make up the difference himself.

 

[Mightygoose]

Out of town person here commenting.

Since the arena deal was already approved by council - by a 11-4 margin, my understanding is a two-thirds majority will be needed to reconsider the deal.

That would mean it would need 10 yes votes to kill the deal. I. Other words, a swing of 6 from pro arena to against it.

Also understand Wooley was one of the 4 no votes and also supported a motion to have the votes delayed which did not receive support.

Mayor Nenshi and councilor Davison has already said they're not interested in revisting the arena deal. They were both yes votes for the arena

If this pattern follows for tomorrow the chances of this motion being successful should be next to zero.

 

[InfinityIggy]

Out of town person here commenting.

Since the arena deal was already approved by council - by a 11-4 margin, my understanding is a two-thirds majority will be needed to reconsider the deal.

That would mean it would need 10 yes votes to kill the deal. I. Other words, a swing of 6 from pro arena to against it.

Also understand Wooley was one of the 4 no votes and also supported a motion to have the votes delayed which did not receive support.

Mayor Nenshi and councilor Davison has already said they're not interested in revisting the arena deal. They were both yes votes for the arena

If this pattern follows for tomorrow the chances of this motion being successful should be next to zero.

I tend to agree with you, however since then the Kenney government has removed funding for the Green Line, which council was relying on.

I think chances are slim, but not zero.

 

[viper0220]

I don't think the Green Line can happen without federal and provincial financing. If the arena deal is killed, I think the NHL team will leave Calgary.

 

[viper0220]

I tend to agree with you, however since then the Kenney government has removed funding for the Green Line, which council was relying on.

I think chances are slim, but not zero.

Totally agree with you, the funding is different right now. It will be interesting to see what happens.

 

[InfinityIggy]

I don't think the Green Line can happen without federal and provincial financing. If the arena deal is killed, I think the NHL team will leave Calgary.

Yes which is fortunately actually why this should fail. Diverting the arena funding won't even come close to replacing the lost funding for the Green Line, so it would simply result in losing both.

Better to stay the course.

 

[viper0220]

Yes which is fortunately actually why this should fail. Diverting the arena funding won't even come close to replacing the lost funding for the Green Line, so it would simply result in losing both.

Better to stay the course.

Very true. We may lose both.

 

[Orfieus]

I don't think the Green Line can happen without federal and provincial financing. If the arena deal is killed, I think the NHL team will leave Calgary.

It isn't so easy to move an NHL team and since Arizona still has a team I really don't think Calgary is in risk of losing their team

In before "blah... blah... blah Bettman hates Canada" nonsense. Bettman will fight as hard for Calgary as he did in Arizona

 

[Flameshomer]

They wont move the team, not a single chance. Y'all are mental for believing the 3rd largest canadian city would lose an NHL team when the canadian tv contract is so lucrative.

If billionaires and corporations are winning because of the provincial tax cuts, and the tax cuts are what is causing funding reconsideration by the municipalities, then the billionaires and corporations will have to accept lesser deals from the municipalities. That's how the balance works, they cant f*** us on both sides.

 

[Ace Rimmer]

Here I go again on my own, going down the only road I've ever known...

Evan Woolley grandstanding? *shocked pikachu*

Doesn't come close to replacing the provincial gov't funding. The $290 million from the arena is a meager drop in the bucket of a $4.5 billion project.

If it must be one or the other, however... Yeah green line.

 

[Rubi]

Evan Woolley is an idiot. He was 1 of 4 councilors to vote against (11 voted for) ratifying the agreement to build the new arena and it looks like he just isn't willing to let it go. Obviously a Never-Flamer.

 

[Mobiandi]

The motion failed

 

[Rubi]

I laughed when I saw the vote was 11-4... the same people voted "for the motion" to redirect the money to the Green Line that voted "against" the ratification to build the arena months ago.
Never change Never-Flamers.

If "you people" are so concerned about the fact that there isn't enough money to build the LRT Green Line, redirect the $500 million that you've allocated to expand the BMO conference center. THAT place will be a money loser for sure.

 

[Fig]

Sometimes I wonder if this is pure grand standing and that Wolley is doing this just so city hall can prove later on that they "re-evaluated" the arena deal to deal with public criticism. He's not doing this to actually try to overthrow the deal, he's doing this to grand stand a process so that everyone at city hall can cover the entirety of city hall councilor butts against public backlash if something goes further sideways.

Wolley is intelligent enough that I can see doing something like this. Chu on the other hand isn't.

 

[InfinityIggy]

Sometimes I wonder if this is pure grand standing and that Wolley is doing this just so city hall can prove later on that they "re-evaluated" the arena deal to deal with public criticism. He's not doing this to actually try to overthrow the deal, he's doing this to grand stand a process so that everyone at city hall can cover the entirety of city hall councilor butts against public backlash if something goes further sideways.

Wolley is intelligent enough that I can see doing something like this. Chu on the other hand isn't.

I think it's something he can (and plans to) point to in his upcoming Mayoral bid as 'standing up to wasteful spending blah blah blah'.

 

[Fig]

I think it's something he can (and plans to) point to in his upcoming Mayoral bid as 'standing up to wasteful spending blah blah blah'.

That too. And he can still let the arena deal go through and claim it was out of his control, but he tried to do something anyways.

Kinda like... was it Bronconcrete who refused to allocate more budget to snow removal until he got stuck backing out of his driveway?

 

[Flames Fanatic]

https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/arena-de...s-organization-and-calgary-stampede-1.4716787

Officially done and signed.

 

[Siignal]

I am close to Evan Woolley by a family connection. I am not going to speculate on anything, but I can confirm that he is without a shadow of a doubt, a big Flames fan. I don't think he would want to lose the Flames either. I was planning on asking him about the Arena at Christmas, and could maybe share if it's not sensitive.

 

[Ace Rimmer]

 

[InfinityIggy]

5 years to build it? Hm.

 

[JPeeper]

Evan Woolley grandstanding? *shocked pikachu*

Doesn't come close to replacing the provincial gov't funding. The $290 million from the arena is a meager drop in the bucket of a $4.5 billion project.

If it must be one or the other, however... Yeah green line.

The guy and anyone who had this thinking process, are complete idiots. If you can't fund a $4.5 billion project without the $250 mil from the arena then the project was ALWAYS doomed to fail. It's 1/18th of the total budget, a small amount.

I also saw that the plans have been changed from having 25 stations to 12 stations in with the original $4.5 billion. So before anything has started you have already went full Calgary and are arguably massively over budget if you're already cutting half the stations off.


Regardless, the paperwork for the arena deal is signed and these muppets can finally f*** off trying to take the arena away. In the grand scheme of things this $250 mil for a new arena is nothing IMO for the benefits it will have for the city. You're also getting $250 mil in private investment right away.

 

[Ace Rimmer]

5 years to build it? Hm.

Three, technically.

The rest is tied up in design (important, make it a cowboy hat?) due diligence (basically done) engagement (hey, we're building a thing!) and consultant selection (go do the thing)

 

[InfinityIggy]

I also saw that the plans have been changed from having 25 stations to 12 stations in with the original $4.5 billion. So before anything has started you have already went full Calgary and are arguably massively over budget if you're already cutting half the stations off.

One would think it'd be better to properly service the first 12 stations or so of the line well, and expand later. Rather than poorly service the line across 12 stretched out stations that won't serve the majority of potential ridership well, and make expansion more difficult down the road (disrupt the now existing line length to add new stations).

We are talking about Calgary transit though, every time I am forced to drive by the Victoria Park/MacLeod intersection where the train comes out of the ground one intersection too early, creating a completely avoidable traffic jam.

But I am not a city planner so what do I know.