Fire Hextall

[hatcher]

I have no issue with people doubting him, because we are what we are. But we are also 3/5th of the way thru the rebuild. The guys he drafted, are just rookies and still in the AHL, CHL, SHL, etc... It's hard to judge him on the end results of his drafting when those kids are all still developing. But what we can see, is that a lot of them are doing well in those development leagues and are being chosen to play on the top WJC teams more than any other NHL team.

I just look at it that if Hext is taking the long rebuild, then keep going and trade Simmonds too as he can get back a few future pieces to help us too. But I think they do want to re-sign him.

They all should go if the team wants a real chance at winning. G for the sake of the player wasting his f***in life here. V you know what I feel about him points or not. Brings nothing else. Simmonds gone at the dealine.

 

[Les Averman]

So you think the public should decide what players play, who we draft, who the coach is, who the gm is?

No, that's not what I'm saying at all, but I don't think you understand how a public-facing business works if you don't think that's the case at all.

This is a hockey team that's worth 3/4 of a billion dollars and professional sports are very much a "what have you done for me lately," type of business. The team is on a 9-game losing streak, attendance is dropping, and the media and fanbase are ripping the team. It's quite clear that the coach is in over his head and there are a variety of reasons to believe that he is not capable of coaching successfully at this level.

It's one thing for the public to decide who the coach is, but it's another for them to be able to influence and pressure the front office into making a move. The reality is that the executives will make the decision, but in a pressured atmosphere like professional sports, they are nudged by their fanbase and that happens with all teams.

What I'm saying is that if the front office determines that a change needs to be made, whether it's a result of pressure from the public, opinion or a combination of the two, and the GM is not willing to make that change, then they will take action.

 

[Rebels57]

I am not on the fire Hextall bandwagon yet. It doesn't make much sense to me. He was brought in to sculpt this team, which he is clearly doing. Things take time. I love that when Homer was here it was all about patience and he sucks because he has no patience. Now Hextall is here and he sucks because his players are not developing fast enough and this team is not competitive enough. Most of you know I was a fan of Homer and a defender until the bitter end, and I can easily say that Hextall's "transgressions" are far less impactful and far less frequent than any of Homer's. I really wonder sometimes what you folks think it is that a good GM really does.

Fires a proven to be terrible coach and doesn't play awful veterans just because they are veterans.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Fires a proven to be terrible coach and doesn't play awful veterans just because they are veterans.

Is there anything that substantiates this "play awful veterans just because they are veterans" line that keeps getting repeated. I will admit I have been very sick the last week or so so maybe I missed something, but did Hakstok come out and say something or are people just mad that their favorite players aren't playing? I'm very much on the fire Hakstok bandwagon but not for this reason. From what I can see there are a number of rookies or second year guys playing right now (meaning there were a number of second year guys playing last year too). While you may not agree with the decision, I would be shocked if Hakstok and company said, "no, uh-uh. No way this guy is playing over VETERAN. He's a veteran and that is what matters! But also we will let these other rookies and second year guys play instead of playing a veteran." Is that really what you believe is going on here? Similar to when Homer and company would say, "Hey, we know this guy sucks and that there are better players that we would rather have, but let's draft him anyway!"

 

[FatTugboatFlahr]

I'd still barf all over myself if we fired Hextall.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Ok, I definitely overreacted earlier. But really, Hextall, stop putting a team like this on such a pedestal saying that we're a playoff team. We're not. And I'd you want to keep the young guys up at all, have a coach that will play them. Seriously, if you want life back into this team and the fans, get rid of Hak and Lappy.

 

[Redpath]

Is there anything that substantiates this "play awful veterans just because they are veterans" line that keeps getting repeated. I will admit I have been very sick the last week or so so maybe I missed something, but did Hakstok come out and say something or are people just mad that their favorite players aren't playing? I'm very much on the fire Hakstok bandwagon but not for this reason. From what I can see there are a number of rookies or second year guys playing right now (meaning there were a number of second year guys playing last year too). While you may not agree with the decision, I would be shocked if Hakstok and company said, "no, uh-uh. No way this guy is playing over VETERAN. He's a veteran and that is what matters! But also we will let these other rookies and second year guys play instead of playing a veteran." Is that really what you believe is going on here? Similar to when Homer and company would say, "Hey, we know this guy sucks and that there are better players that we would rather have, but let's draft him anyway!"

Between this tweet and Hextall's logic last night that Morin can't be on the team because of his age, it appears that brass does indeed play awful veterans because they are veterans

 

[Rebels57]

Is there anything that substantiates this "play awful veterans just because they are veterans" line that keeps getting repeated. I will admit I have been very sick the last week or so so maybe I missed something, but did Hakstok come out and say something or are people just mad that their favorite players aren't playing? I'm very much on the fire Hakstok bandwagon but not for this reason. From what I can see there are a number of rookies or second year guys playing right now (meaning there were a number of second year guys playing last year too). While you may not agree with the decision, I would be shocked if Hakstok and company said, "no, uh-uh. No way this guy is playing over VETERAN. He's a veteran and that is what matters! But also we will let these other rookies and second year guys play instead of playing a veteran." Is that really what you believe is going on here? Similar to when Homer and company would say, "Hey, we know this guy sucks and that there are better players that we would rather have, but let's draft him anyway!"

Average Time-on-Ice

Brandon Manning: 19:26
Valterri Filppula: 16:57

Travis Sanheim: 16:09
Nolan Patrick: 12:26
Travis Konecny: 14:16

A few games ago, Manning had more icetime in the 3rd than Sanheim and Morin combined. Predictably the Flyers blew a 3rd period lead and lost.

Last night, Dale Weise had more ice time than Nolan Patrick in a game they trailed from the 1st to the end. See below for why this makes no sense.

Goals For/60

Dale Weise 0.9 (worst on team)
Nolan Patrick 2.1 (5th best among forwards)

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Yet Ghost has played more games and Manning has less than 60 games more than Provy. Sense no f***ing make...

 

[Rebels57]

I'd still barf all over myself if we fired Hextall.

No chance that happens, but it should if he won't cut ties with Hakstol.

Hak will be the first to go though, and hopefully the next coach settles things down and we can get back on course. All we are asking is for the next coach to make simple decisions that allow the team to compete for wins and sniff a wild card spot rather than a top 5 pick. Then next season, we should be taking another step forward. Right now under Hak, next season will be just as bad.

 

[deadhead]

Patrick is a difference case, it's obvious they're sheltering him by limiting his minutes.
If he were 100% he'd be playing 17 minutes a night.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Between this tweet and Hextall's logic last night that Morin can't be on the team because of his age, it appears that brass does indeed play awful veterans because they are veterans

Well hey ok. Like I said I've been sick the last week or so!

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Though I still think it is more than just he's a veteran he's a rookie. There's trust and snap decision issues.

 

[CodyTheHuman]

Here's where I'm at with Hextall:
Drafting - Wonderful.
Trading - Pretty damn good.
NHL talent scouting - not good
Coaching evaluation - no good
Contracts - decent

He has good and bad points, just like everyone. It would be hard to find many GMs better than him in the league right now, not saying they don't exist, but they are rare.
If we fire Hextall who do we end up with? Lombardi? Hard pass.

The issues he has can be fixed and just replacing him with the next shitty GM isn't going to solve many problems. Sure, we'd get a shiny new GM, but how long until everyone turns on him too?
You guys all expect him to come out to the media and crucify the coach, but no GM does that. That's not good for job security or reputation. If you want people to want to work for you they have to think you'll have their back, even when they f*** up.

 

[deadhead]

Actually, we don't know about NHL scouting, Weise has been his only mistake, and he didn't exactly grossly overpay.
Lehtera and Umberger were salary dumps.
Filppula was a sweetener and a one year patch.
Since he didn't give up real assets to get these guys, we don't know what he thought he was getting.

 

[CodyTheHuman]

Actually, we don't know about NHL scouting, Weise has been his only mistake, and he didn't exactly grossly overpay.
Lehtera and Umberger were salary dumps.
Filppula was a sweetener and a one year patch.
Since he didn't give up real assets to get these guys, we don't know what he thought he was getting.

White, Bellemare, Vandevelde, Schultz, Gordon.

Schultz wasn't terrible. White had his days. Bellemare and Vandevelde were pretty much no good, no matter how much I liked Bellemare.

Luckily none of those guys were expensive, but none of them were exactly very helpful.

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Patrick is a difference case, it's obvious they're sheltering him by limiting his minutes.
If he were 100% he'd be playing 17 minutes a night.

That's a load of horse crap and you know it. Hextall has already said that they're bringing song the guys slowly because they don't want to 'overwhelm' them. Christ sakes, for most of last year, Patrick was the top rated player for his draft. You run this horse. You don't bring him along 'slowly" for fear of 'overwhelming' him. He's been performing at a high level all of his hockey career. You push him. If they fear playing him so much, then they should have sent him back to junior.

 

[ItMe]

Firing Hextall isn't the right move. He has done really good job. Its understandable to be frustrated at his responses but it should have been expected that he would defend the coach.

Hexy certainly shouldn't be blaming the age of players for this slump though. After all, it was Hextall who wanted to rebuild and stay competitive (hasn't worked out).

However, since the 10 game win streak last season, the team has gone 28-50. That is unacceptable and very telling of the coach and his system as well as the core vets (Simmonds, Giroux, etc...). How many coaches do we need to go through before the players get part of the blame? In my opinion, this franchise is 2-3 years past due for an actual rebuild and if Hextall refuses to fire to Hak then he needs to start trading away the core now. Being this bad would be understandable if we were rebuilding the right way.

 

[deadhead]

White, Bellemare, Vandevelde, Schultz, Gordon.

Schultz wasn't terrible. White had his days. Bellemare and Vandevelde were pretty much no good, no matter how much I liked Bellemare.

Luckily none of those guys were expensive, but none of them were exactly very helpful.

But that's the point, he basically gave up nothing to obtain them, Schultz was the most expensive. So it's hard to judge, without cap room he can't pay, and Hextall has made it clear he won't trade assets. So we don't know how well they can scout. They got one year out of White, a few years of 4th line service out of PEB and VdV, 3rd line service and 7th D-man out of Schultz.

This is what you get when you sign low cost FAs and street FAs.

 

[deadhead]

That's a load of horse crap and you know it. Hextall has already said that they're bringing song the guys slowly because they don't want to 'overwhelm' them. Christ sakes, for most of last year, Patrick was the top rated player for his draft. You run this horse. You don't bring him along 'slowly" for fear of 'overwhelming' him. He's been performing at a high level all of his hockey career. You push him. If they fear playing him so much, then they should have sent him back to junior.

Provorov wasn't brought along slowly, and Patrick wouldn't be if he was 100%.
They're in a different category than Sanheim.

Patrick entered the season off surgery, then had a severe concussion. Would you push him into 17 minutes a game right now? Or would you protect a future cornerstone by gradually easing him in, letting him get back into game shape and comfortable with the NHL before pushing him physically and mentally?

 

[Curufinwe]

Patrick is averaging 12:25 because of the injury and because he's struggling to be an effective possession player. That number will go up as he adjusts to the NHL.

 

[NYCFlyer]

That's a load of horse crap and you know it. Hextall has already said that they're bringing song the guys slowly because they don't want to 'overwhelm' them. Christ sakes, for most of last year, Patrick was the top rated player for his draft. You run this horse. You don't bring him along 'slowly" for fear of 'overwhelming' him. He's been performing at a high level all of his hockey career. You push him. If they fear playing him so much, then they should have sent him back to junior.

Didn't Patrick have two surgeries within a year? I dont know if you have ever had to deal with recovery but it definitely takes a while to get to full strength and stamina. Additionally other parts of your body often get tweaked when compensating. I would argue that based on our experience what happened to Giroux and Ghost last year they should have had their minutes reduced initially and slowly build up. Maybe instead of 40+ games of mediocre they could have been at full strength sooner. Having seen Patrick up close and live numerous times this year, he is definitely not 100% in strength or stamina.

 

[Adam Warlock]

Im bringing this back.

Cant deny the positive job Hextall has done drafting...but that is the only positive thing he has done. His vision and culture are not right for this team or this league. He has shown no signs that he is ever going to be willing to make the moves necessary to build a winner and there is no reason we need to wait more years for that to happen.

Hakstol is killing this team....only way he goes is if Hex goes.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

If Hak is still here after this season, Hexy needs to go to make Hak go.

 

[Adam Warlock]

The media asked to speak to him after the game and he declined. Hes a coward.