Finnish club to join KHL, future of ET

[vorky]

Thanks for translation. Zilliacus´case is interesting, it says that KHL had tried for 3+yrs to aquire finnish KHL club. No suprise, of course.

 

[FiLe]

Zilliacus´case is interesting, it says that KHL had tried for 3+yrs to aquire finnish KHL club. No suprise, of course.

Actually, Zilliacus claims that he arranged buyers for the arena and a KHL contact three years ago (so it was him who made the pitch, not the other way around). However, Harkimo shot it down and now Zilliacus is sore because Harkimo later found his own contacts while following his alleged plan otherwise to the letter.

Harkimo answers by saying that Zilliacus was never a big player in the arena business (with only 1% share) and around 10 different people have approached him with some Russian contact or other.

It's a classic case of one man's word against another, so no comment on who's closer to the truth here.

Zabludowicz was just unhappy that Harkimo bought his share of the arena before selling to Russians without telling him about his plans and says that it's against "proper businessman code".

Pretty much, yeah. Best note though that even if it breaks some unwritten conduct or other, there's nothing illegal about it. Same with Zilliacus' complaints. So in the end, the dogs bark and the caravan moves on.

 

[Jussi]

Actually, Zilliacus claims that he arranged buyers for the arena and a KHL contact three years ago (so it was him who made the pitch, not the other way around). However, Harkimo shot it down and now Zilliacus is sore because Harkimo later found his own contacts while following his alleged plan otherwise to the letter.

Harkimo answers by saying that Zilliacus was never a big player in the arena business (with only 1% share) and around 10 different people have approached him with some Russian contact or other.

It's a classic case of one man's word against another, so no comment on who's closer to the truth here.

Pretty much, yeah. Best note though that even if it breaks some unwritten conduct or other, there's nothing illegal about it. Same with Zilliacus' complaints. So in the end, the dogs bark and the caravan moves on.

Fact is, Harkimo has fewer business friends in Finland after he handled this affair.

 

[Gaps]

Looks like it's time to break out the pop corn:

http://www.sm-liiga.fi/arkisto/uutiset/sm-liigan-tiedote-16.7.2013.html

http://www.iltasanomat.fi/sm-liiga/art-1288582564177.html

In a nutshell for all our foreign friends: the majority of the other SM-liiga teams want Jokerit out of the league now instead of after next season. Also, according to SM-liiga, Jokerit DO NOT have a binding contract with the KHL, and currently they don't have permission from SM-liiga to join another league because they did not ask for it.

I love that they're going against Kale, even if this will probably lead to nothing, at least they're not just standing there and letting Kale do whatever he wants whether it's right or not.

Fact is, Harkimo has fewer business friends in Finland after he handled this affair.

True, but I doubt he cares. He's got much richer friends in Russia now.

 

[vorky]

Gaps

Thx, it was written many times, I just want to sum it up

1) SM-Liiga shareholders agreement says that the club must ask permission of SM-Liiga Board of Directors to leave league. This did not happen in Jokerit´s case

2) Federation, Kummola, gave or promise permision to Jokerit, but did not inform SM-Liiga (or informed only one person.. dont remember his name)

3) SM-Liiga wants Jokerit to leave league this summer, but formally is still member of league. You know, similar situation like with Jokerit in KHL - Jokerit formally is not member of KHL, Jokerit did not apply to KHL yet.. but Jokerit wants to apply next summer.

It is funny that SM-Liiga has just found out that Jokerit has not a binding contract with the KHL. We wrote it a few days earlier at HFB and nobody of us had inside info/documents.

 

[Jussi]

Looks like it's time to break out the pop corn:

http://www.sm-liiga.fi/arkisto/uutiset/sm-liigan-tiedote-16.7.2013.html

http://www.iltasanomat.fi/sm-liiga/art-1288582564177.html

In a nutshell for all our foreign friends: the majority of the other SM-liiga teams want Jokerit out of the league now instead of after next season. Also, according to SM-liiga, Jokerit DO NOT have a binding contract with the KHL, and currently they don't have permission from SM-liiga to join another league because they did not ask for it.

I love that they're going against Kale, even if this will probably lead to nothing, at least they're not just standing there and letting Kale do whatever he wants whether it's right or not.





True, but I doubt he cares. He's got much richer friends in Russia now.

But they aren't the ones he has to negotiate sponsorship deals with.

 

[Jonimaus]

Could this mean Jokerit would have no league to play in for 1 year? Or what's the possible outcomes from this?

 

[vorky]

Could this mean Jokerit would have no league to play in for 1 year? Or what's the possible outcomes from this?

2013/14 - Jokerit playing SM-Liiga
2014/15 - Jokerit playing KHL

One year without playing any league is nonsense and wont happen. Like it or not.

 

[Jonimaus]

2013/14 - Jokerit playing SM-Liiga
2014/15 - Jokerit playing KHL

One year without playing any league is nonsense and wont happen. Like it or not.

I'd like someone from Finland to answere that, thanks.

 

[FiLe]

I'd like someone from Finland to answere that, thanks.

Let's put it like this: Before the clubs actually announce a decision to shut Jokerit outside instead of just talking about the possibility, I figure that old saying, "talk is cheap" is very applicable.

This is not really about the rest of the SM-liiga clubs preventing Jokerit from joining the KHL. They can't do that, it's FIHA's domain. They can, however, shut them out of their league. Which we'll believe when it happens.

 

[Jussi]

Let's put it like this: Before the clubs actually announce a decision to shut Jokerit outside instead of just talking about the possibility, I figure that old saying, "talk is cheap" is very applicable.

This is not really about the rest of the SM-liiga clubs preventing Jokerit from joining the KHL. They can't do that, it's FIHA's domain. They can, however, shut them out of their league. Which we'll believe when it happens.

Actually that's still to be determined. Sm-Liiga asked IIHF to approach the matter since "consult" is a rather vague term.

 

[Jonimaus]

If they would be thrown out of SM-liiga, would the KHL pay for their expenses during the off-year?

 

[FiLe]

Actually that's still to be determined. Sm-Liiga asked IIHF to approach the matter since "consult" is a rather vague term.

FIHA ( = Kummola) greenlighted the move. IIHF ( = Kummola) will determine if everything is kosher. Somehow, I don't see those two "different" parties contradicting each other.

Seriously, before we actually see something concrete to happen, one should pay no mind to these news trying to dissent the move, and simply presume everything will go to the original plan. SM-liiga and the clubs not liking this move are throwing temper tantrums because some are afraid it will diminish their own importance, some are simply traditionalists who hate any kind of change, some are jealous, some simply hate Harkimo's guts and some are some combination of all four.

Seriously though, the best practice for people not liking this move would be to stay quiet and see what comes of it. If it turns out to be a dismal failure, they could then come out and have a hearty laugh at it. But if it turns out to be successful, they'll be the ones who become the laughing stock. Despite doing my best to see the positives I have my own reservations about this all, but I still can't help but figure how childish it is to cry about it now that the cat is already out of the bag.

If they would be thrown out of SM-liiga, would the KHL pay for their expenses during the off-year?

Something tells me no party involved has prepared to figure out the answer to this question.

In the end though, money probably isn't much of an issue. The bigger issue is potentially having a teamful of players sit out a season.

 

[P-M Bouchard]

Don't go, Jokerit!

 

[vorky]

FIHA ( = Kummola) greenlighted the move. IIHF ( = Kummola) will determine if everything is kosher. Somehow, I don't see those two "different" parties contradicting each other.

Seriously, before we actually see something concrete to happen, one should pay no mind to these news trying to dissent the move, and simply presume everything will go to the original plan. SM-liiga and the clubs not liking this move are throwing temper tantrums because some are afraid it will diminish their own importance, some are simply traditionalists who hate any kind of change, some are jealous, some simply hate Harkimo's guts and some are some combination of all four.

Seriously though, the best practice for people not liking this move would be to stay quiet and see what comes of it. If it turns out to be a dismal failure, they could then come out and have a hearty laugh at it. But if it turns out to be successful, they'll be the ones who become the laughing stock. Despite doing my best to see the positives I have my own reservations about this all, but I still can't help but figure how childish it is to cry about it now that the cat is already out of the bag.

Something tells me no party involved has prepared to figure out the answer to this question.

In the end though, money probably isn't much of an issue. The bigger issue is potentially having a teamful of players sit out a season.

I could not say it better. I agree with all you said.

 

[Jussi]

FIHA ( = Kummola) greenlighted the move. IIHF ( = Kummola) will determine if everything is kosher. Somehow, I don't see those two "different" parties contradicting each other.

Kummola is only the Finnish hockey rep in the affair, SM-Liiga asked the IIHF (NOT Kummola, he is only vice secretary and would not deal in legal matters) for an official viewpoint on what "consult" means".

 

[vorky]

One more time and I hope EVERYBODY gets it because it is annoying to write the same thing again and again.

Нет-нет-нет. Не хочу, чтобы меня поняли неправильно. На самом деле я очень рад продвижению КХЛ в Европу. Хоккей Латвии, Белоруссии, Украины от этого только выигрывает. Так же как и словацкий. Признаюсь: я был крайне удивлен успеху клуба из Братиславы. В хорошем смысле. Радостно удивлен. "Слован" оказался прорывным проектом. С точки зрения не только спорта, но и коммерции. На каждую игру десятитысячная арена раскупалась без остатка.

А Прага? Вот уж сюрприз так сюрприз. Три топ-команды в одном городе! Я был уверен, что "Лев" проиграет конкуренцию за болельщика и "Спарте", и "Славии". Ничего подобного! Чехи оказались совсем не консервативны и с удовольствием повалили на чемпионат КХЛ. Теперь я не буду выступать против расширения вашей лиги дальше на европейский запад.

Fasel said in 21th May 2013 for SportExpress

my translation

I am happy for KHL´s success in Europe (talking about Slovan, Lev etc - read russian text, not important here).... I wont be against expansion of your league (KHL) to western Europe anymore.

Fasel said these words late May 2013, Jokerit announced joining KHL late June 2013 as "done deal". Kummola said:

“Jokerit’s move from the Finnish SM-liiga to the KHL is a part of international development of hockey. The Finnish association has no reason to be against it,”

http://www.iihf.com/home-of-hockey/news/news-singleview/recap/8023.html?cHash=5354f82174

Done. IIHF or Finnish Federation will not block this Jokerit´s move to KHL. SM-Liiga has no right to do so. Where the problem is? Someone does not like KHL´s expansion to Finland? Someone does not like Jokerit moving to KHL? I respect the opinion, of course.

 

[Jonimaus]

One more time and I hope EVERYBODY gets it because it is annoying to write the same thing again and again.

It's annoying to read the same thing over and over. So please, for the sake of you and the rest of us, stop.

You seriously think people outside of Finland gives a crap about Jokerits move to KHL. 99% of us (I say 99% because apparantly Darth Yoda is now officially the biggest KHL-Jokerit fan there is) couldn't care less about it. I find this whole process interesting though, as the road seems to be bumpy.

 

[FiLe]

Kummola is only the Finnish hockey rep in the affair, SM-Liiga asked the IIHF (NOT Kummola, he is only vice secretary and would not deal in legal matters) for an official viewpoint on what "consult" means".

Hope you're not really that naive. Officially, there's naturally a conflict of interest if Kummola was directly involved in both processes. But do you really think that SM-liiga's lobbying against it will be enough when Kummola's of the opposite mind, pulling strings and lobbying for it from the inside?

It's dirty, I know, and I don't like it any more than the rest of you - and can't wait for the day that old dinosaur retires. But the sad fact is that this whole thing is a done deal and no kicking and screaming will change the outcome.

 

[Dominus]

Seriously, before we actually see something concrete to happen, one should pay no mind to these news trying to dissent the move, and simply presume everything will go to the original plan. SM-liiga and the clubs not liking this move are throwing temper tantrums because some are afraid it will diminish their own importance, some are simply traditionalists who hate any kind of change, some are jealous, some simply hate Harkimo's guts and some are some combination of all four.

Seriously though, the best practice for people not liking this move would be to stay quiet and see what comes of it. If it turns out to be a dismal failure, they could then come out and have a hearty laugh at it. But if it turns out to be successful, they'll be the ones who become the laughing stock. Despite doing my best to see the positives I have my own reservations about this all, but I still can't help but figure how childish it is to cry about it now that the cat is already out of the bag.

Good post.

IMO this whole thing is just tabloids making stuff up because there's nothing else to report in July and SM-liiga flexing its' muscles (which they don't even have). It would be incredibly stupid from financial stand point to throw Jokerit out of the league. Such act would only serve to satisfy some primal need for revenge. I understand that most decisions we make are based on feelings, but I don't think even SM-liiga is stupid enough to let their petty little feelings get the best of them in this matter.

 

[FiLe]

IMO this whole thing is just tabloids making stuff up because there's nothing else to report in July and SM-liiga flexing its' muscles (which they don't even have). It would be incredibly stupid from financial stand point to throw Jokerit out of the league. Such act would only serve to satisfy some primal need for revenge. I understand that most decisions we make are based on feelings, but I don't think even SM-liiga is stupid enough to let their petty little feelings get the best of them in this matter.

Indeed.

Food for thought: Imagine what the response would have been if Jokerit had announced they will join KHL for the upcoming season already, instead of the following one?

"You can't leave now that we've locked down the schedule", would probably have been the prime wail coming from a ton of mouths. But no, instead of using the extra warning time to sort out the league for 2014-15, they'll be wasting their energy for petty threats.

Come to think of it, maybe Hjallis should've just silently sorted all out and only release the news next May. "'Tis Roman, he mah new pal. We ofh to join KHL nao. 'kthxbye." Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

[Dominus]

Food for thought: Imagine what the response would have been if Jokerit had announced they will join KHL for the upcoming season already, instead of the following one?

"You can't leave now that we've locked down the schedule", would probably have been the prime wail coming from a ton of mouths. But no, instead of using the extra warning time to sort out the league for 2014-15, they'll be wasting their energy for petty threats.

Come to think of it, maybe Hjallis should've just silently sorted all out and only release the news next May. "'Tis Roman, he mah new pal. We ofh to join KHL nao. 'kthxbye." Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Yeah, I think this was going to be a **** storm anyway. It's only natural that, just like fans, even SM-liiga bosses have been somewhat emotional about this at first and of course media is milking everything out of that emotion. Maybe I'm naive but I believe that once they hold their meeting they come to their senses and stop thinking about their precious "credibility". Only way to get credibility is to stop wasting resources on planning revenge and start building the future.

It is interesting to follow the negotiations though. Basically Hjallis wants SM-liiga to pay him for the league license and SM-liiga wants Hjallis to pay them for violating the stakeholder agreement. Who will give in or is it going to court?

Whatever happens this whole thing, along with Karalahti signing, is good marketing for the upcoming SM-liiga season. Hockey's been on the headlines for over three weeks now in the middle of the summer and the headlines will continue.

This is for Hjallis... and for Sport, welcome to SM-liiga in '14-15.

 

[Jussi]

Yeah, I think this was going to be a **** storm anyway. It's only natural that, just like fans, even SM-liiga bosses have been somewhat emotional about this at first and of course media is milking everything out of that emotion. Maybe I'm naive but I believe that once they hold their meeting they come to their senses and stop thinking about their precious "credibility". Only way to get credibility is to stop wasting resources on planning revenge and start building the future.

It is interesting to follow the negotiations though. Basically Hjallis wants SM-liiga to pay him for the league license and SM-liiga wants Hjallis to pay them for violating the stakeholder agreement. Who will give in or is it going to court?

Whatever happens this whole thing, along with Karalahti signing, is good marketing for the upcoming SM-liiga season. Hockey's been on the headlines for over three weeks now in the middle of the summer and the headlines will continue.

This is for Hjallis... and for Sport, welcome to SM-liiga in '14-15.

Everything that's come up of this whole affair speaks that Hjallis & Kummola handled everything in the worst way possible, violating common practice and SM-Liiga rules/by-laws. It's looking heavily like Hjallis is going to end up paying.

 

[Dominus]

Everything that's come up of this whole affair speaks that Hjallis & Kummola handled everything in the worst way possible, violating common practice and SM-Liiga rules/by-laws. It's looking heavily like Hjallis is going to end up paying.

Well, I'm sure Hjallis and Kummola made some mistakes but at least something got done. With these other SM-liiga buffoons it's all just talk. If Jokerit/Hjallis ends up paying somebody something, I'm sure he considered that possibility before going into this.

 

[LoveHateLeafs]

Is there any chance that Jokerit's junior team would play in the MHL?

Also, if Jokerit>>>KHL does go through, it doesn't have to mean the end of the Helsinki-area teams' rivalries. If people want Jokerit-HIFK/Blues matches so much, why not just schedule games between the teams during the periodic breaks that happen throughout the European hockey season? There's already a precedent for this in the Beanpot hockey tournament between the Boston-area NCAA hockey teams, which don't all play in the same division. But that doesn't stop it from being a really big deal down there.