Easy Stanley Cup win for Tampa?

[North Country]

You keep saying this but it's not even close to true. Tampa has had the biggest defense in the league for years, the only additions on forward for size are Goodrow and Maroon.....so you're saying 2 forwards tilted their team from smallest to biggest?

There's a logical fallacy here.

They didn't get "big players", they got guys who skate better and play harder.

Fallacy? No, just reality.

Tampa
2017-18: 193lbs and the lightest team in the league by far being 2lbs under the next closest team
2019-20: 203.4lbs and the 7th heaviest in the league
Many of the same players from two years ago so this will show even the slowest of hockey fans that new players (targeted) are MUCH bigger!

Height/Weight or combination:
Vegas- 2nd tallest in the league
Dallas- 4th tallest

NYI- Heaviest in the league
Dallas- 2nd heaviest
TB- 7th heaviest
Vegas- 9th heaviest

St Louis Blues were 2nd tallest and 5th heaviest last year when they won the Cup

Capitals were the 3rd heaviest and 6th tallest 3 seasons ago when they won the cup.

Tampa went from the 2nd shortest in the whole league two years ago to the upper half this season!!! Note: Had those huge dmen 2 years ago.

Tampa knew that they were a GREAT regular season team, but needed to get much bigger overall to hang with the big boys in the playoffs.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Fallacy? No, just reality.

Tampa
2017-18: 193lbs and the lightest team in the league by far being 2lbs under the next closest team
2019-20: 203.4lbs and the 7th heaviest in the league
Many of the same players from two years ago so this will show even the slowest of hockey fans that new players (targeted) are MUCH bigger!

Height/Weight or combination:
Vegas- 2nd tallest in the league
Dallas- 4th tallest

NYI- Heaviest in the league
Dallas- 2nd heaviest
TB- 7th heaviest
Vegas- 9th heaviest

St Louis Blues were 2nd tallest and 5th heaviest last year when they won the Cup

Capitals were the 3rd heaviest and 6th tallest 3 seasons ago when they won the cup.

Tampa went from the 2nd shortest in the whole league two years ago to the upper half this season!!! Note: Had those huge dmen 2 years ago.

Tampa knew that they were a GREAT regular season team, but needed to get much bigger overall to hang with the big boys in the playoffs.

You seem to be stubbornly stuck on the size thing. While I think you make a decent point you just ignore the whole story and just go with size as the reason a team is successful or not. Tb should be a reason why your theory is just not right. Let's look at the winners of the last decade not just the last 2. Chicago wasn't a huge team. Pittsburgh wasn't a huge team. I think size has been a bigger thing the last two seasons but it still isn't everything. You need guys who have skill and can skate. Bruins were one of the most skilled teams in the league the last few years and they almost beat St Louis and the bruins weren't a heavy team despite their reputation. Before last year tb was on brink of beating the last 2 cup winners but scoring dried up. It wasn't because they weren't big. They just didn't want to go to the tough areas. They are now and they really don't have too much different of a team. Coleman was added but he's not big he plays big. The entire team has played bigger this year. In that they aren't playing scared. That is the size you are referring to.

 

[bov]

We've been at or near the top of the conference in fights, hits, pims for years now, especially amongst playoff teams. The notion that we have been losing in the postseason because the team is soft is complete BS. I'd concede that some of our smallish forwards in years past haven't been able to fight through the punishment and score the dirty goals that you need at times, but even then, the real issues had far more to do with structure and discipline. It's hilarious to see everyone touting Maroon, Goodrow, Coleman etc as if the team was a bunch of wallflowers before.

Don't get me wrong, I like the additions and they for sure make us a deeper, more formidable team but I keep hearing "THIS is what's different about Tampa this year"...nope, not really. They're just buying in at both ends of the rink for a full 60. TB has been one of the scrappier, more physical teams in the league for quite some time now and hasn't backed down from anyone in recent memory.

 

[Sky04]

Fallacy? No, just reality.

Tampa
2017-18: 193lbs and the lightest team in the league by far being 2lbs under the next closest team
2019-20: 203.4lbs and the 7th heaviest in the league
Many of the same players from two years ago so this will show even the slowest of hockey fans that new players (targeted) are MUCH bigger!

Height/Weight or combination:
Vegas- 2nd tallest in the league
Dallas- 4th tallest

NYI- Heaviest in the league
Dallas- 2nd heaviest
TB- 7th heaviest
Vegas- 9th heaviest

St Louis Blues were 2nd tallest and 5th heaviest last year when they won the Cup

Capitals were the 3rd heaviest and 6th tallest 3 seasons ago when they won the cup.

Tampa went from the 2nd shortest in the whole league two years ago to the upper half this season!!! Note: Had those huge dmen 2 years ago.

Tampa knew that they were a GREAT regular season team, but needed to get much bigger overall to hang with the big boys in the playoffs.

Took Pittsburgh and Washington to Game 7's and beat Boston in 5, how is that not hanging, are you ok?

 

[North Country]

You seem to be stubbornly stuck on the size thing. While I think you make a decent point you just ignore the whole story and just go with size as the reason a team is successful or not. Tb should be a reason why your theory is just not right. Let's look at the winners of the last decade not just the last 2. Chicago wasn't a huge team. Pittsburgh wasn't a huge team. I think size has been a bigger thing the last two seasons but it still isn't everything. You need guys who have skill and can skate. Bruins were one of the most skilled teams in the league the last few years and they almost beat St Louis and the bruins weren't a heavy team despite their reputation. Before last year tb was on brink of beating the last 2 cup winners but scoring dried up. It wasn't because they weren't big. They just didn't want to go to the tough areas. They are now and they really don't have too much different of a team. Coleman was added but he's not big he plays big. The entire team has played bigger this year. In that they aren't playing scared. That is the size you are referring to.

Stubborn?

I made a point that Tampa decided to make a change after Washington decided late in the series to be physical and then the tide changed in an instant. They knew they had to get bigger and Cooper said it HIMSELF in the draft day interview.

The problem is your bad comprehension.

I don’t make a “good point” (your words),, I’m just showing actual facts and quoting from the top.

 

[North Country]

I’m talking to a bunch of Napoleons.

 

[The Macho King]

For all the talk, the biggest difference is our breakouts are much better and our zone entries and forecheck are better. Not having Sustr lob a grenade for a grade A scoring chance against every game has been a huge help, and not icing rookies in checking roles have led to fewer mistakes.

Edit - basically, what can we do when the pretty play isn't there? We aren't forcing the pretty play - we are crashing the net, getting tips and rebounds, chipping it in and getting possession when we have to and setting up the cycle.

 

[DFC]

We've been at or near the top of the conference in fights, hits, pims for years now, especially amongst playoff teams. The notion that we have been losing in the postseason because the team is soft is complete BS. I'd concede that some of our smallish forwards in years past haven't been able to fight through the punishment and score the dirty goals that you need at times, but even then, the real issues had far more to do with structure and discipline. It's hilarious to see everyone touting Maroon, Goodrow, Coleman etc as if the team was a bunch of wallflowers before.

Don't get me wrong, I like the additions and they for sure make us a deeper, more formidable team but I keep hearing "THIS is what's different about Tampa this year"...nope, not really. They're just buying in at both ends of the rink for a full 60. TB has been one of the scrappier, more physical teams in the league for quite some time now and hasn't backed down from anyone in recent memory.

Palat has made a huge difference too. He's not quite a power forward, but he's close. And Brayden Point has come a long way since his last healthy post-seasons. To me, these are the biggest new factors in this long run. Because the big difference is our stars are scoring.

 

[flying squirrel]

I get the point you're trying to make by saying the Lightning are all the sudden world beaters because 20 more lbs. avg to line-up. But.......this Lightning core has made 4 ECF's in the last 6 years (One "Cup" appearance), and they've won more playoff games than most teams in this league during that time span. The Lightning did those deep playoff runs while 20lbs lighter but just got beat by the better teams, it happens (Two of those teams were small & fast). There's no shame having those stacked teams of Chicago, Pitt, and Caps ending your deep playoff runs. Plus, all of them went on to win "The Cup" after beating the Lightning. Sure size helps during some series, but how did this Lightning core team make 2 EFC's finals and a"CUP" final appearance if they were such terrible playoff performers before this season? Doesn't add up, non-playoff performers don't make deep runs in the playoffs, do they?

Terrible timing with injuries to best playoff performers (Two of those playoffs injuries to big players, Bishop and Hedman), having scoring droughts at wrong time, and getting beat by eventual "Stanley Cup" winner has more to do to why Lightning came up short in the past. They've gotten hungrier, have more experience now, and have added more gritty players to do the dirty work when needed. Coleman is not a big brute but his gritty play is paying dividends and then some. I do love what the heavy body of Maroon brings. Even though Maroon plays low minutes, the other X-factors he brings while not on the ice is paying off.

Can everyone just agree to disagree and admit all the reasons mentioned in this thread might be playing a part this year? Still, the Lightning haven't won jack yet. All this premature success talk is a little to early. Time will tell if this Lightning bunch lives up to expectations and gets the needed 5 wins to make history.

 

[Super Cake]

I just don't see neither the Stars or the Knights putting up much of a challenge for Tampa.

 

[aufheben]

For all the talk, the biggest difference is our breakouts are much better and our zone entries and forecheck are better. Not having Sustr lob a grenade for a grade A scoring chance against every game has been a huge help, and not icing rookies in checking roles have led to fewer mistakes.

Edit - basically, what can we do when the pretty play isn't there? We aren't forcing the pretty play - we are crashing the net, getting tips and rebounds, chipping it in and getting possession when we have to and setting up the cycle.

Shattenkirk sucks!

 

[SharksCyclops]

I’m talking to a bunch of Napoleons.

And yet still getting your panties in a bunch big guy.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Stubborn?

I made a point that Tampa decided to make a change after Washington decided late in the series to be physical and then the tide changed in an instant. They knew they had to get bigger and Cooper said it HIMSELF in the draft day interview.

The problem is your bad comprehension.

I don’t make a “good point” (your words),, I’m just showing actual facts and quoting from the top.

No you just refuse to believe you aren't right with your analysis. I think part of it is right but its not the whole story. Which you refuse to acknowledge.

 

[North Country]

Tampa was cruising and Washington had to change their game plan. Tampa realized they needed to get much bigger after being exposed and other teams noticed what worked. The change began.
Caps rough up Lightning 3-0 to force Game 7

 

[Sentinel]

Like I replied before.
Ixnay on my inxjay

I have no idea what this means.

 

[North Country]

No you just refuse to believe you aren't right with your analysis. I think part of it is right but its not the whole story. Which you refuse to acknowledge.

You refuse to believe, Bud. They averaged 193 pounds 3 seasons ago and got totally exposed when things got physical. Many of the same players back and now average 203+ lbs. That means the new players are 20lbs? plus on average, if the regulars stayed about the same weight. That’s the only thing possible to make that weight jump.

Capitals exposed a team everyone thought was unstoppable that year with a huge size advantage and a bruising game plan.

Other big teams could have done the same thing against Tampa in the playoffs, but instead played Tampa’s style.

Cooper said they NEEDED to get bigger and they did quickly.

 

[DFC]

You refuse to believe, Bud. They averaged 193 pounds 3 seasons ago and got totally exposed when things got physical. Many of the same players back and now average 203+ lbs. That means the new players are 20lbs? plus on average, if the regulars stayed about the same weight. That’s the only thing possible to make that weight jump.

Capitals exposed a team everyone thought was unstoppable that year with a huge size advantage and a bruising game plan.

Other big teams could have done the same thing against Tampa in the playoffs, but instead played Tampa’s style.

Cooper said they NEEDED to get bigger and they did quickly.

"Totally exposed" in a seven game series.

 

[Jyrki]

"easy for the Flames"
"easy for the Avs"
"easy for the Knights"

If the Stars make it, I think they'll be fine with everyone expecting Tampa to win.

 

[North Country]

"Totally exposed" in a seven game series.

They came out with a seek and destroy game plane in game 6. Much smaller bodies were flying through the air and all knew the series was over after the change.

 

[Metroid]

I

I have no idea what this means.

I'll tell you after

 

[Sol]

Anyone expecting this to be easy for Tampa is on crack.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

I get the point you're trying to make by saying the Lightning are all the sudden world beaters because 20 more lbs. avg to line-up. But.......this Lightning core has made 4 ECF's in the last 6 years (One "Cup" appearance), and they've won more playoff games than most teams in this league during that time span. The Lightning did those deep playoff runs while 20lbs lighter but just got beat by the better teams, it happens (Two of those teams were small & fast). There's no shame having those stacked teams of Chicago, Pitt, and Caps ending your deep playoff runs. Plus, all of them went on to win "The Cup" after beating the Lightning. Sure size helps during some series, but how did this Lightning core team make 2 EFC's finals and a"CUP" final appearance if they were such terrible playoff performers before this season? Doesn't add up, non-playoff performers don't make deep runs in the playoffs, do they?

Terrible timing with injuries to best playoff performers (Two of those playoffs injuries to big players, Bishop and Hedman), having scoring droughts at wrong time, and getting beat by eventual "Stanley Cup" winner has more to do to why Lightning came up short in the past. They've gotten hungrier, have more experience now, and have added more gritty players to do the dirty work when needed. Coleman is not a big brute but his gritty play is paying dividends and then some. I do love what the heavy body of Maroon brings. Even though Maroon plays low minutes, the other X-factors he brings while not on the ice is paying off.

Can everyone just agree to disagree and admit all the reasons mentioned in this thread might be playing a part this year? Still, the Lightning haven't won jack yet. All this premature success talk is a little to early. Time will tell if this Lightning bunch lives up to expectations and gets the needed 5 wins to make history.

Or maybe they're doing better because other teams aren't at their best due to the layoff. Similar to how TB feasts on mistakes by their opponents in the RS.

 

[T REX]

"Totally exposed" in a seven game series.

I don't think we scored in the last 8 periods of that series. We were definitely exposed. The Caps rocked our shinola. It's ok. We made some changes and I'm eating a lot of well deserved delicious crow right now.

 

[rocketdan9]

Is it fair to say that on paper this should be an easy "Stanley Cup" win for Tampa? That said, if they end up losing again, would management be forced to make a change? If so, who gets moved?

what kind of special you smokin? 1st they haven't even beaten the Islanders

2nd the Stars remind me of 2019 CBJ but with more skill. Dallas should not be underestimated

 

[These Are The Days]

Round 1: play almost 7 games worth of hockey in 5 games and finish with less PP TOI than the NYR
Round 2: play President's Trophy winners
Round 3: face the best coach in the NHL

All without Stamkos


Easy path boys!