Value of: Dylan Larkin to Montreal

[izlez]

The thread title is "value of" and the OP asks for a trade that makes sense for both sides. We can't just magically say Jeff Petry would return Seider+ because he is extremely important to us and is our only PMD.

The value of the Habs trading for him ≠ the value of the Red Wings trading him away.

No, you can't just say Petry would return Seider+. You are free to say you'll just keep your guy if he doesn't return Seider+

 

[Jive Pawnbroker]

I guess we'll see how committed Larkin really is to Detroit next summer. A proper rebuild takes time and depending on how next season goes he may decide to opt out as Seth Jones did this summer.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Larkin's value to Detroit is more than what most teams will likely be willing to give. Cannot see Larkin leaving Detroit unless it's FA or he forces a trade. Offer above does not move the needle.

Seem logical but I recall the same things said about Mantha. Yzerman don't have 2 year vision, he sees 5 years+! If he can flip Larkin where it adds to his youth core (age 18-22 range) and it also helps him tank more? I think he considers it and it don't have to be Montreal he trades with

 

[TaketheCannoli]

This should be good.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Seem logical but I recall the same things said about Mantha. Yzerman don't have 2 year vision, he sees 5 years+! If he can flip Larkin where it adds to his youth core (age 18-22 range) and it also helps him tank more? I think he considers it.

I might be wrong but I think Detroit has a big enough prospect and future high end quality players where they can start thinking about retaining their current leadership group and build from there/start being a little bit more competitive.

They might not make the playoff for the next 2-3 years and might pick in the 8-13 range but at least you take away some of the losing pain and players can actually see the light at the end of the tunnel. Winning more games is important in a franchise that is rebuilding, you can’t just go from dead last to being a contender right away. It’s not black and white

 

[Habs Halifax]

I might be wrong but I think Detroit has a big enough prospect and future high end quality players where they can start thinking about retaining their current leadership group and build from there/start being a little bit more competitive

I'd hold the horses off a bit yet. Best thing for the Wings is more lottery picks in the next 2 drafts. Takes time to built it right. He's not finish with the foundation yet. He's building a multi level that can sustain hurricanes... not a single story bungalow that requires renos in 5 years.

 

[Beezeral]

Didn’t Detroit just draft a goalie in the 1st round? They don’t want primeau

 

[TaketheCannoli]

Although your offer is fair, Larkin not going anywhere.

I admire you, you're a real diplomat.

 

[Bondurant]

Seem logical but I recall the same things said about Mantha. Yzerman don't have 2 year vision, he sees 5 years+! If he can flip Larkin where it adds to his youth core (age 18-22 range) and it also helps him tank more? I think he considers it and it don't have to be Montreal he trades with

Mantha was never captain material and can be lazy. Never viewed in the same light as Larkin. Wings have good prospects in the pipeline and I am not sure how long Yzerman will roll the dice with the lottery. It is a gamble and Wings have slipped more than any other team in recent years in the lottery.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Mantha was never captain material and can be lazy. Never viewed in the same light as Larkin. Wings have good prospects in the pipeline and I am not sure how long Yzerman will roll the dice with the lottery. It is a gamble and Wings have slipped more than any other team in recent years in the lottery.

Sure but it was the same type of comments. He's not getting traded... we will sign him and keep him.

 

[izlez]

Mantha was not regarded in nearly the same light as Larkin

 

[njx9]

I guess we'll see how committed Larkin really is to Detroit next summer. A proper rebuild takes time and depending on how next season goes he may decide to opt out as Seth Jones did this summer.

That sure sounds like the kind of bridge you cross when you come to it, not the kind you panic about long before it's remotely relevant.

Besides, if Larkin's going anywhere, it's obviously to Columbus. No idea why him getting to UFA or demanding an out has any relevance to a bad offer from Montreal.

 

[GOZetterberg]

Value seems pretty fair to me.

 

[Baksfamous112]

I'd hold the horses off a bit yet. Best thing for the Wings is more lottery picks in the next 2 drafts. Takes time to built it right. He's not finish with the foundation yet. He's building a multi level that can sustain hurricanes... not a single story bungalow that requires renos in 5 years.

Wrong. They already have a future #1 in the pipeline in Seider and just drafted Edvinsson. They just acquired Ned from Carolina and draft Cossa as a future/back up plan. Larkin is a solid 1B and they have multiple high end wingers prospects. Veleno will certainly suit in the 3C role long term and with the other pieces they already have at D and wing, they probably just need a high end 2C to support Larkin. A guy like Dvorak would make a lot of sense.

after that, it’s all about retaining the pieces long term you want to keep and allow time for the young guys to mature into NHL players and then into their role they were drafted for

 

[Habs Halifax]

Wrong. They already have a future #1 in the pipeline in Seider and just drafted Edvinsson. They just acquired Ned from Carolina and draft Cossa as a future/back up plan. Larkin is a solid 1B and they have multiple high end wingers prospects.

It's not enough. Your house will require a reno in 5 years. This is Yzerman, not Bergevin or Dubas

 

[Baksfamous112]

It's not enough. Your house will require a reno in 5 years. This is Yzerman, not Bergevin or Dubas

Wtf is this analogy anyway. They’ve been rebuilding for what, 5 years already? They have the pieces they need to move to another phase of their rebuild.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Wtf is this analogy anyway. They’ve been rebuilding for what, 5 years already? They have the pieces they need to move to another phase of their rebuild.

It's called building it right. Stock piling more than what you consider is "OK". Avoid moving up and play the lottery more.

Your too quick to be content IMO

 

[Baksfamous112]

It's called building it right. Stock piling more than what you consider is "OK". Avoid moving up and play the lottery more.

Your too quick to be content IMO

Or you just don’t understand the tool it takes on the players to continually lose and be mediocre. You end up selling your players that are near UFA for draft picks because they are tired of losing and won’t resign. Then you draft new players and whoever pans out ends up being traded 5-6 years later for future assets. It’s like running in circle with your head up your ass.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Or you just don’t understand the tool it takes on the players to continually lose and be mediocre. You end up selling your players that are near UFA for draft picks because they are tired of losing and won’t resign. Then you draft new players and whoever pans out ends up being traded 5-6 years later for future assets. It’s like running in circle with your head up your ass.

When you down, you stay down and don't get up too early. Keep playing the lottery. Yzerman is thinking big picture, not a cute little bungalow house like you want.

 

[Baksfamous112]

When you down, you stay down and don't get up too early. Keep playing the lottery. Yzerman is thinking big picture, not a cute little bungalow house like you want.

You don’t have a single clue what Yzeman think or will do. (Mod edit)

 

[Zynbanejad]

Detroit over value him cause he is a hometown boy living with his parents in Detroit and seem like a good all around human + he is really dynamic and explosive to watch.

BUT

what they forget is that Benn almost killed him and no one knowns if he will be back from the injury he got, which is one of the worst to come back from...

What injury is that?

 

[Ishad]

What injury is that?

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

What injury is that?

Jamie Benns cross check to Larkins neck?

 

[HisNoodliness]

Seem logical but I recall the same things said about Mantha. Yzerman don't have 2 year vision, he sees 5 years+! If he can flip Larkin where it adds to his youth core (age 18-22 range) and it also helps him tank more? I think he considers it and it don't have to be Montreal he trades with

But Mantha got traded for a huge overpayment AND had a lot less intangible value to the team than Larkin. We said that Mantha wasn't getting traded when people wanted to low-ball us because of his down season and low total production due to injuries. If someone only offered us fair value for Mantha, he'd still be a Wing. But the Caps gave us an offer we couldn't refuse.

Give us a slightly younger player that's as good as Larkin, a first round pick and a second round pick for Larkin and we'll think about it. That's what we got for Mantha. That's why the replies in this thread are Suzuki+. It's not that we actually think you're going to trade us Suzuki and a 1st for Larkin. It's that we don't want to trade him and you have to give us a deal that's too good to say no to. The Caps did that, so Yzerman made the trade.

I agree that we have to keep looking to the future, but we also have to build a team culture and give our young players an environment where they can grow. I want to lose as much as possible next year, but I want to be competitive while we do so. Keeping Larkin isn't going to have a catastrophic impact on our pick location, but he will have a huge impact on our players' development by letting Seider, Zadina and Raymond play with a functional top 6 C.

 

[Habs Halifax]

But Mantha got traded for a huge overpayment AND had a lot less intangible value to the team than Larkin. We said that Mantha wasn't getting traded when people wanted to low-ball us because of his down season and low total production due to injuries. If someone only offered us fair value for Mantha, he'd still be a Wing. But the Caps gave us an offer we couldn't refuse.

Give us a slightly younger player that's as good as Larkin, a first round pick and a second round pick for Larkin and we'll think about it. That's what we got for Mantha. That's why the replies in this thread are Suzuki+. It's not that we actually think you're going to trade us Suzuki and a 1st for Larkin. It's that we don't want to trade him and you have to give us a deal that's too good to say no to. The Caps did that, so Yzerman made the trade.

I agree that we have to keep looking to the future, but we also have to build a team culture and give our young players an environment where they can grow. I want to lose as much as possible next year, but I want to be competitive while we do so. Keeping Larkin isn't going to have a catastrophic impact on our pick location, but he will have a huge impact on our players' development by letting Seider, Zadina and Raymond play with a functional top 6 C.

Just a point on what was said about Mantha and how it's being said about Larkin. I feel Yzerman looks at any trade offer that helps or reinforces his youth core build-up. Larkin is not old but is probably 30+ when Yzerman's youth core reaches prime years.