Blue Jays Discussion: Do you want to learn the horrifying truth? Or do you want to see Vlad Jr. sock some dingers!

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phillipmike

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Oct 27, 2009
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Happy with Groshans but i really wanted Mandrigal to drop to us. The hit tool (and as a result discipline) has the potential to unreal... Currently has a 8.8% walk rate and 1.8% k rate in AA. You read that right, for every strikeout he gets 5 walks. 34 walks to 13 ks in his minor league career
 

Morgs

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Jul 12, 2015
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Happy with Groshans but i really wanted Mandrigal to drop to us. The hit tool (and as a result discipline) has the potential to unreal... Currently has a 8.8% walk rate and 1.8% k rate in AA. You read that right, for every strikeout he gets 5 walks. 34 walks to 13 ks in his minor league career

That's insane.

No chance he was dropping to us though, well before draft day.
 
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Discoverer

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Apr 11, 2012
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I generally expect little to nothing from college prospects who dominate rookie ball their draft year, but I think I'm at the point where I can move Cal Stevenson from "kinda interesting but probably nothing" to "cautiously optimistic": skipped past Lansing to a more age-appropriate Dunedin, and he's now up to a 130 wRC+ on the season (including 149 since May 1) with excellent BB and K marks and playing a bunch of CF (though more LF).

Definitely an intriguing guy at this point. I'm assuming he won't play much CF going forward, but I love the profile.

EDIT: This is all before his current 2-3 day with a walk.
 
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canucksfan

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I generally expect little to nothing from college prospects who dominate rookie ball their draft year, but I think I'm at the point where I can move Cal Stevenson from "kinda interesting but probably nothing" to "cautiously optimistic": skipped past Lansing to a more age-appropriate Dunedin, and he's now up to a 130 wRC+ on the season (including 149 since May 1) with excellent BB and K marks and playing a bunch of CF (though more LF).

Definitely an intriguing guy at this point. I'm assuming he won't play much CF going forward, but I love the profile.

EDIT: This is all before his current 2-3 day with a walk.

He's turned it around after a slow start, although the slow start could be due to his large jump.

Would like to see him develop a bit more power.
 

dredeye

BJ Elitist/Hipster
Mar 3, 2008
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Using the July '17 Sonny Gray trade as a base, I don't think the Yankees have the prospects to trade for Stroman. Three 50-55FV prospects, two of which were at Triple-A, is what the Blue Jays should be looking for. I would, however, entertain a Clint Frazier + 40FV low minors pitching prospect.

The Twins can produce the Gray package: Kiriloff, Graterol and Larnarch.
The Braves can as well, even better: Anderson, Waters, Contreras (or swap any out for Wright, Wilson). Plus I heard their GM is out of his mind and doesn't mind spending capital like a drunken sailor.

In regards to Giles, I'd be looking for a Brad Hand (The trading team's top prospect, Mejia)\Sean Doolittle (The trading team's top lottery ticket riser, Luzardo) return.

No reason to accept less in either situation.

As of now, the contenders are as follows: LAD, HOU, NYY, MIN, ATL, TBR, BOS, CLE. All will be looking for pitching help, most certainly bullpen help. ATL and Tampa have by far the most prospect capital.
Your twins proposal are mostly the pieces I suggested the other. Not interested in frazier plus. Rather the twins trio you suggested or the Braves option. Stroman would probably love atl with josh being there
 
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trellaine201

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Feb 10, 2010
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Stro is certainly an entertainer, I’ll give him that much and full of confidence. Little man syndrome I guess. He’s a competitor. Unfortunately I think his mouth moves a bit too fast sometimes.

I actually enjoy him but I don’t think the organization does.

Hopefully we don’t end up with more Druries and McKinney’s lol
 

The Nemesis

Semper Tyrannus
Apr 11, 2005
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Re: the Stroman social media thing: Ultimately it's one of those mean-nothing things that the media and silly twitter users will blow out of proportion because that's the MO of "news" in the modern age.

That said, on the other hand, if Stroman were to try and profess his innocence in terms of no seeing what the optics of such a move appear to represent, I'd have a hard time believing him given how social media savvy he generally is. There's no way he can be a guy that's on twitter as much as he is, interacting with the public as much as he does and not see or comprehend what it looks like when he scrubs his profile of mentions of the Jays or likes tweets exploring him ending up on the Yankees or whatever.

But then, on the other other hand, this is a guy that apparently didn't see the issue in publicly whinging about how the team didn't let him know they were dumping Ryan frigging Goins and thought it was a good idea to start off a spring training by tossing management under the bus for not making enough roster moves that he deemed personally acceptable. So perhaps he's just like a lot of athletes who live in their own little universe for so long that they become legitimately tone-deaf to the viewpoint of the outside world that everyone else inhabits.

:dunno:
 

ShaneFalco

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Jul 15, 2012
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Re: the Stroman social media thing: Ultimately it's one of those mean-nothing things that the media and silly twitter users will blow out of proportion because that's the MO of "news" in the modern age.

That said, on the other hand, if Stroman were to try and profess his innocence in terms of no seeing what the optics of such a move appear to represent, I'd have a hard time believing him given how social media savvy he generally is. There's no way he can be a guy that's on twitter as much as he is, interacting with the public as much as he does and not see or comprehend what it looks like when he scrubs his profile of mentions of the Jays or likes tweets exploring him ending up on the Yankees or whatever.

But then, on the other other hand, this is a guy that apparently didn't see the issue in publicly whinging about how the team didn't let him know they were dumping Ryan frigging Goins and thought it was a good idea to start off a spring training by tossing management under the bus for not making enough roster moves that he deemed personally acceptable. So perhaps he's just like a lot of athletes who live in their own little universe for so long that they become legitimately tone-deaf to the viewpoint of the outside world that everyone else inhabits.

:dunno:

A bit of a narcissist
 
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hockeywiz542

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May 26, 2008
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Houston Astros outfielder Jake Marisnick was suspended for two games because of his collision with catcher Jonathan Lucroy on Sunday, breaking Lucroy’s nose and giving him a concussion.

Marisnick still has the right to appeal the suspension, which Major League Baseball announced Thursday. Marisnick was also fined an undisclosed amount.

“After thoroughly reviewing the play from all angles, I have concluded that Jake’s actions warrant discipline,” MLB Chief Baseball Officer Joe Torre said in the announcement. “While I do not believe that Jake intended to injure Jonathan, the contact he initiated in his attempt to score violated Official Baseball Rule 6.01(i), which is designed to protect catchers from precisely this type of collision.”
 

SeaOfBlue

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Aug 1, 2013
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Whatever happened to Devon Travis?

He's still hurt. His career is done most likely, but maybe a team gives him a Minors deal to see if he can recover at all. He's still decent when he plays, he just doesn't play.

IDK if he fits with the Jays anymore given their prospect depth at 2B and SS going forward, but maybe they keep him as a stop-gap/depth option in the meantime.
 

hockeywiz542

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May 26, 2008
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Blue Jays Confidential: Is pitching a must in return for Marcus Stroman? - Sportsnet.ca
2. Do the Blue Jays need to acquire MLB or close-to-ready MLB pitching in any pre-July 31 dealings, or should they simply look for the best talent available and then try to package other players currently in the organization for help on the mound, either now or the off-season?

Jeff Blair (@SNJeffBlair):

Best talent – including a middle of the order hitter.

Arden Zwelling (@ArdenZwelling):

You always take the best talent available, whether in trade, the amateur draft, on the international market, etc. I do think that if the Blue Jays had two options that they felt similarly about in terms of future value, one a hitter and one a pitcher, they would go with the latter. But they should never take a lesser package in terms of value merely to fill a positional need.

Shi Davidi (@ShiDavidi):

Provided there isn’t a major disparity between the options, yes, absolutely, they must prioritize some near-term big-league pitching. Dealing away Marcus Stroman and Ken Giles without getting some arms back would be a major failure, because ultimately you need a pool of arms for a successful or pitcher or two to emerge. Why? Think of what the Blue Jays gave up for David Price: Daniel Norris, the prime prospect at the time, Jairo Labourt and Matt Boyd, whom the Blue Jays were least worried about. As it turned out, Boyd has been by far the best player Alex Anthopoulos surrendered that summer, underlining why volume matters when developing from within. The Blue Jays lack volume on the arm side. They have to fix that.

Ben Nicholson-Smith (@bnicholsonsmith):

Personally, I think you limit yourself if you only look at pitching that’s close to the major-leagues. What if there’s a better prospect at double-A, but he’s a shortstop? Or a higher-ceiling pitcher at low-A? I’d rather have those guys. Of course all things being equal, the Jays need pitching. I just don’t think we’re at the point of adding finishing touches yet. Until then, find the most value possible, regardless of position.

Mike Wilner (@Wilnerness590):

It’s a dangerous game to make a trade for something you don’t really need with a plan to spin that thing off into something that you do really need down the road. J.P. Ricciardi did it, turning Shannon Stewart into Bobby Kielty into Ted Lilly in a span of four months in 2003, but it’s not something that happens very often. However, it’s better to take an “A” level return that doesn’t involve a pitcher than a “C” level return that does, just because you need pitching. A general manager can tie his hands by saying he’ll only accept a certain position in return in a deal. Very clearly, the Blue Jays need close-to-ready, high-level pitching talent, but they shouldn’t simply go out looking for the best pitcher they can get, if he’s not nearly as good as a position player they could acquire for the same price.
 

dredeye

BJ Elitist/Hipster
Mar 3, 2008
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Whatever happened to Devon Travis?
It’s funny I asked myself the same question today. Literally a dead asset now. I can’t even think of the last time I heard his name mentioned anywhere. It’s too bad because he was good when healthy. Problem being he hasn’t been for years now
 

The Nemesis

Semper Tyrannus
Apr 11, 2005
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Oh well at least Gose is a dead asset. It’s a wash. Poor Travis. He was the Tigers number one prospect at the time of the trade.

No he wasn't. Nick Castellanos was #1 by pretty much every major outlet. Travis was somewhere between 2nd and somewhere in the high 10s (like maybe 12th or 13th at the outside)

After initially trying to comb Fangraphs, Baseball America, and other outlets, I stumbled on a post from Beyond The Box Score from that year that gave aggregated rankings where Travis came out to be about 8th.

2014 Detroit Tigers Top Prospects

(ignore the team name in the URL. It says Royals but it returns the Tigers' list)


Just for kicks, here's the Jays' list from that year (2014)

2014 Toronto Blue Jays Top Prospects
 
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